Transforming Non-Profit and Church Leadership

WEBVTT

1
00:00:05.440 --> 00:00:09.599
What's working on purpose anyway? Each
week we ponder the answer to this question.

2
00:00:10.240 --> 00:00:14.919
People ache for meaning and purpose at
work, to contribute their talents passionately

3
00:00:15.240 --> 00:00:19.760
and know their lives really matter.
They crave being part of an organization that

4
00:00:19.839 --> 00:00:25.039
inspires them and helps them grow into
realizing their highest potential. Business can be

5
00:00:25.120 --> 00:00:29.600
such a force for good in the
world, elevating humanity. In our program,

6
00:00:29.800 --> 00:00:33.759
we provide guidance and inspiration to help
usher in this world we all want

7
00:00:34.479 --> 00:00:39.240
Working on purpose. Now. Here
is your host, doctor Elise Cortes.

8
00:00:41.240 --> 00:00:44.000
Welcome back to the Working on Purpose
Program. Thanks for tuning in again this

9
00:00:44.000 --> 00:00:46.719
week. I'm your host, Doctor
at Least Cortez, joining you live from

10
00:00:46.759 --> 00:00:49.560
Dallas, Texas, which is home
base for me. If you've been tuning

11
00:00:49.600 --> 00:00:52.200
in for a while, you know
this program as a thought leadership series that

12
00:00:52.280 --> 00:00:56.640
enlightens and inspires listeners with insights from
distinguished business leaders and subject matter experts.

13
00:00:56.960 --> 00:01:00.399
Our conversations are designed to make you
think, inspire you to ever reach for

14
00:01:00.479 --> 00:01:03.519
cultivating your best, and take an
informed approach toward leadership and business. Our

15
00:01:03.519 --> 00:01:07.799
guest today is Hugh Balou, a
transformational leadership strategist and the president of Center

16
00:01:07.879 --> 00:01:11.920
Vision International, Inc. He's the
author of eight books on transformational leadership and

17
00:01:12.040 --> 00:01:17.000
is a recognized expert in working with
leaders and churches, religious organizations, and

18
00:01:17.040 --> 00:01:21.480
business and nonprofit communities. He is
the editor of the nonprofit Performance three sixty

19
00:01:21.519 --> 00:01:25.760
magazine and the host of the Nonprofit
Exchange podcast. We'll be talking about how

20
00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:30.359
his previous career as a conductor informs
his work today, the specific approach he

21
00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:34.200
and team take developing leaders, and
hear some stories about their work and the

22
00:01:34.239 --> 00:01:38.239
difference he's made and they made the
organizations they serve. He joined today from

23
00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:42.439
Lynchburg, Virginia. Hugh, welcome
to Working on Purpose. Well, lets

24
00:01:42.480 --> 00:01:45.200
thank you for having me here.
I'm glad to be here. It's wonderful

25
00:01:45.280 --> 00:01:49.719
being on the other end of the
mic, isn't it. Yeah, let's

26
00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:53.319
do this. Well, we have
to start. You have such a fantastic,

27
00:01:53.439 --> 00:01:56.239
long and distinguished career view and I'm
just so happy to know that you're

28
00:01:56.239 --> 00:01:59.040
still having such a great time in
life and work. It should be like

29
00:01:59.079 --> 00:02:01.480
that, as doctor SEUs, it
should be like that. So let's do

30
00:02:01.599 --> 00:02:06.120
this for our guests. Would you
just start by saying a little bit about

31
00:02:06.120 --> 00:02:09.439
your expansive life and career, and
I want to start this conversation by learning

32
00:02:09.439 --> 00:02:14.840
how you chose your initial career in
music and performed as a conductor. Why

33
00:02:15.039 --> 00:02:17.960
music first, Well, it's it's
about the nurture in the home and what

34
00:02:19.879 --> 00:02:23.319
what shapes us. And my parents
had really good classical music playing all the

35
00:02:23.319 --> 00:02:28.360
time, so I was fascinated.
I took piano lessons, and so I

36
00:02:28.400 --> 00:02:30.800
decided I'd go to college and study
music. And I was the person they

37
00:02:30.800 --> 00:02:35.879
shouldn't have let in the music school
and certainly didn't let out. I was

38
00:02:36.000 --> 00:02:39.680
very intentional about it and had very
little skill, but I got out and

39
00:02:39.039 --> 00:02:45.120
I started directing church choirs when I
was eighteen years old. So I went

40
00:02:45.159 --> 00:02:49.039
from you know, tiny little churches
to twelve thousand megachurch size and work in

41
00:02:49.319 --> 00:02:53.400
several megachurches. So it was on
national TV and had who who's who's who

42
00:02:53.479 --> 00:02:58.039
of national artists come in and do
concerts with us. So I was able

43
00:02:58.080 --> 00:03:02.039
to do big productions and run big
program So it was a career that was

44
00:03:02.120 --> 00:03:07.319
meaningful to me. I can impact
a whole lot of people. By impacting

45
00:03:07.360 --> 00:03:08.919
a whole lot of people, you
know, that's so beautiful. One you

46
00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:13.680
know that the word meaningful means a
lot to me because I'm a management consultant

47
00:03:13.719 --> 00:03:15.800
and I focus specifically in meaning and
purpose, and I love that right out

48
00:03:15.800 --> 00:03:19.879
of the gate, you chose something
meaningful for yourself, and a lot of

49
00:03:19.879 --> 00:03:23.479
young people don't do that. They
take the guidance of other people that mean

50
00:03:23.800 --> 00:03:25.479
the best wishes for them, but
kind of steer them off their path.

51
00:03:25.560 --> 00:03:30.280
So I'm glad that you stay true. That's really really inspiring for me,

52
00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:32.039
actually, as someone who has a
seventeen year ol daughter and she's trying to

53
00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:36.479
figure out what she wants to be
when she grows up. So speaking of

54
00:03:36.520 --> 00:03:39.599
that identity is my next question.
So since it's such an anchoring mechanism in

55
00:03:39.639 --> 00:03:44.120
our lives, and among other things, it drives behavior, and I'm a

56
00:03:44.159 --> 00:03:46.800
meeting of work and identity researcher,
as you might recall, So I'm fascinated

57
00:03:46.840 --> 00:03:52.120
with the way people answer the questions
who are you and what makes you you?

58
00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:55.400
So how would you answer those questions
for us? I'm an influencer and

59
00:03:55.479 --> 00:04:01.560
I'm passionate about giving value to people
so they can realize the inner skill they

60
00:04:01.599 --> 00:04:06.159
have that they've not really realized and
certainly haven't developed. So I'm a catalyst

61
00:04:06.199 --> 00:04:12.199
for people finding their excellence and then
developing that so they can have impact.

62
00:04:12.520 --> 00:04:15.399
And let me know, there's something
about you that maybe listeners don't know because

63
00:04:15.439 --> 00:04:18.879
they've not had the experience of seeing
you in action. I have. When

64
00:04:19.160 --> 00:04:24.000
you facilitated the Youth Philanthropy conference we
did a few weeks ago, you were

65
00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:27.959
just dynamic. You you were just
I mean, I was. I learned

66
00:04:28.000 --> 00:04:30.759
a whole bunch of things from you, and I was inspired. I was

67
00:04:30.759 --> 00:04:34.439
in such good hands, and you
really are a catalyst. Well, leaders

68
00:04:34.439 --> 00:04:41.959
don't do. Leaders lead and the
conductor, well, people misperceive what a

69
00:04:42.000 --> 00:04:46.120
conductor's power is. People think a
conductor is a dictator. Well, let

70
00:04:46.120 --> 00:04:48.439
me tell you. You got this
little white stick, and you've got a

71
00:04:48.439 --> 00:04:53.120
whole bunch of union players. They're
very good. You can't make them do

72
00:04:53.199 --> 00:04:58.360
anything. What you can do is
influence them. It's how we use the

73
00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.759
tools and how we show up.
So a leader is an influencer. And

74
00:05:01.800 --> 00:05:05.120
the culture of the orchestra, the
culture that acquire, the culture of the

75
00:05:05.160 --> 00:05:11.040
boardroom, the culture of the staff
is a reflection of the leader. And

76
00:05:11.079 --> 00:05:14.439
so I learned that early on,
and I was way out in front.

77
00:05:14.480 --> 00:05:17.839
I started directing a choir when I
had no experience of even being an acchoir.

78
00:05:18.120 --> 00:05:20.519
So I've been one of these people, either bravether or stupid. I

79
00:05:20.560 --> 00:05:25.519
just said, I bet I could
do that. So that started a forty

80
00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:30.800
year career of conducting. And still
just as last year, I was conducting

81
00:05:30.839 --> 00:05:33.480
a symphony here, So you don't
give it up, I would think not.

82
00:05:33.639 --> 00:05:35.879
In fact, that was my next
question is I was wondering how it

83
00:05:35.920 --> 00:05:40.399
was you decided to add leadership,
develop and coaching work to your career offerings,

84
00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:44.040
since I assumed that you were still
conducting music, So why did you

85
00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:47.600
sign it to add leadership in coaching? What did a stint with the Lynchburg

86
00:05:47.680 --> 00:05:54.759
Symphony here in Virginia, And so
I worked with the previous president and help

87
00:05:54.839 --> 00:05:58.519
them build their strategy, help them
build the board engagement. So it's really

88
00:05:58.680 --> 00:06:01.680
like shipping a musical. On we
come in, we have a very clear

89
00:06:02.199 --> 00:06:06.879
distinct intent, purpose driven intent.
So we were very clear on the purpose

90
00:06:06.920 --> 00:06:10.759
everything we do. Why are we
meeting, what are we going to do?

91
00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:13.759
And then one day they said,
oh, you're directing the next concert,

92
00:06:13.759 --> 00:06:16.439
and I said okay. So I
didn't even know if they knew about

93
00:06:16.439 --> 00:06:19.439
my conducting, and so they said, well, we've seen some videos of

94
00:06:19.480 --> 00:06:23.600
you and we want you to conduct. And so for the first time in

95
00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:27.160
the history of the symphony, they
filled the hall and you know, it

96
00:06:27.279 --> 00:06:31.040
was the talk of the town because
I did something different which engaged the whole

97
00:06:31.240 --> 00:06:38.319
population of the community on stage and
in the audience. So really it's it's

98
00:06:38.720 --> 00:06:43.279
I managed large music programs and in
my church in Atlanta, I was twelve

99
00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:46.959
thousand members. We had several hundred
events a week. I had seven hundred

100
00:06:46.000 --> 00:06:49.639
and fifty people in music program.
So you know, you had to learn

101
00:06:49.720 --> 00:06:54.519
how to manage systems, how to
create systems, and how to get out

102
00:06:54.519 --> 00:06:58.680
of the way because they were very
competent people. And you know, any

103
00:06:58.759 --> 00:07:02.600
leader depends on having combinant people,
and we influenced them to step up and

104
00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:08.000
step out and do their best.
Beautiful. I love the work as well.

105
00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:13.360
Your company that you started is called
Center Vision. Why did you start

106
00:07:13.399 --> 00:07:16.319
the organization? And can you can
you say for us a bit about what's

107
00:07:16.360 --> 00:07:24.160
the vision behind energism. So it's
the synergy that we get from having a

108
00:07:24.199 --> 00:07:29.439
common vision. And I actually have
at Centervision family of brands, Centervision International,

109
00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:33.360
as I work with corporate leaders,
MidCap corporations, Centervision Leadership Foundation,

110
00:07:33.480 --> 00:07:41.120
I work with nonprofit leaders and churches, synagogues and educations. And in Centervision

111
00:07:41.120 --> 00:07:45.439
Publishing, I publish a magazine and
I do have an editor run the publisher

112
00:07:45.560 --> 00:07:49.600
and actually let me write for it. And I write books and publish programs,

113
00:07:49.639 --> 00:07:55.600
self study programs and have a community. So it's like ensemble in music.

114
00:07:56.040 --> 00:08:00.240
So you know, a drama ensemble
plays together, they learned to play

115
00:08:00.240 --> 00:08:03.199
off each other. A musical ensemble
is very much the same. We rehearse,

116
00:08:03.399 --> 00:08:07.680
so we developed this extra skill set. We don't give up being independent,

117
00:08:07.759 --> 00:08:11.199
we don't give up our skill set, but we developed this other skill

118
00:08:11.560 --> 00:08:18.360
as the ensemble. So Centervision is
the word that kind of resembles that ensemble

119
00:08:18.399 --> 00:08:24.040
feeling that is delightful, absolutely delightful. And I also recognize just all the

120
00:08:24.079 --> 00:08:28.000
moving parts that are in that.
I have several moving parts in my business

121
00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:31.959
as well, but it's really quite
spectacular that you keep all of those parts

122
00:08:31.039 --> 00:08:35.320
moving beautifully in synchronicity. I think
it's amazing. I have you've ever seen

123
00:08:35.320 --> 00:08:39.679
a musical score. It's a very
long piece of paper and it's got all

124
00:08:39.679 --> 00:08:43.120
the instruments on it, and there's
sixty seventy eighty instruments in the orchestra,

125
00:08:43.200 --> 00:08:46.039
but there's a bunch of strengths that
you got a line for each one,

126
00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:48.840
and it goes across the page very
fast. And there's no way unless you

127
00:08:48.919 --> 00:08:52.919
study the score and really know what's
going on, there's no way you can

128
00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:56.279
take in everything right away. So
you have to know the score. That

129
00:08:56.320 --> 00:09:00.080
it's My leadership principles start with know
the score. We have to be in

130
00:09:00.080 --> 00:09:05.519
intentional, purposeful about where we're going. And so that score is a skill

131
00:09:05.600 --> 00:09:09.240
set in itself. So it's what
holds us together. It's the common plan.

132
00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:13.399
So without a strategy, we're nothing. As business or nonprofit leaders,

133
00:09:13.480 --> 00:09:18.120
we must have a roadmap. One
of the things that I find beautiful about

134
00:09:18.159 --> 00:09:22.440
what you've done in your life is
that you have stood on the career of

135
00:09:22.519 --> 00:09:28.480
music and now you use that as
an anchor or an informational conduit to what

136
00:09:28.519 --> 00:09:31.440
you're doing now in leadership development,
and I always encourage people to not forego

137
00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:35.120
wherever they came from before, but
fold it in and let it, let

138
00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:37.639
it flavor, if you will.
Where would they go next? So,

139
00:09:37.759 --> 00:09:41.559
how does your experience conducting inform your
leadership today. Well, it took me

140
00:09:41.720 --> 00:09:46.919
forty years to write my first book, Moving so much better, Thank you,

141
00:09:46.200 --> 00:09:50.480
Building Lives. So that was my
first first book, and it's really

142
00:09:50.559 --> 00:09:54.960
and it took me thirty days put
it on paper. And so it's the

143
00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:58.039
church musician, it's transformational leader.
So you have a bunch of singers to

144
00:09:58.080 --> 00:10:03.440
transform them into Acquire, You transform
ACQUIR into an ensemble and in a faith

145
00:10:03.440 --> 00:10:07.840
community, transform people's lives. And
so I in this book, after I

146
00:10:07.919 --> 00:10:13.360
left the twelve thousand member church,
I defined my job as music director that

147
00:10:13.559 --> 00:10:18.840
ten percent ten percent on my job
was music. Ninety percent allowed that to

148
00:10:18.879 --> 00:10:24.279
happen. So the blue ten ninety
rule is as a leader, we have

149
00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:26.679
the vision and the skill to make
that happen. It's ten percent of what

150
00:10:26.720 --> 00:10:31.919
we do. Ninety percent is that
iceberg that supports the iceberg underwater. That

151
00:10:33.039 --> 00:10:35.399
ninety percent allows us to do it, and most of us don't have the

152
00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:41.159
skills or the knowledge of experience to
develop that ninety percent. So at least

153
00:10:41.159 --> 00:10:43.879
that's why you and I have worked, because people need us to be able

154
00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:50.720
to highlight their expertise and achieve their
vision. So it really works together.

155
00:10:50.200 --> 00:10:54.080
So being able to be on stage, that's just a little bit. There's

156
00:10:54.120 --> 00:10:58.399
a whole bunch behind that that really
makes it happen. So when the time

157
00:10:58.440 --> 00:11:01.919
goes down, boom, it's the
domination. Like being on the radio show,

158
00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:03.639
being on a TV show, being
in a movie. There's a whole

159
00:11:03.639 --> 00:11:07.200
lot of work that went on to
make it happen. Isn't that the truth?

160
00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:11.039
Well, so that question was specifically
to your leadership, how your music

161
00:11:11.039 --> 00:11:15.279
informs your leadership? I'm also interested
in maybe it's the same answer, but

162
00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:20.240
how does your background and music inform
how you coach and how you consult?

163
00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:22.840
You know, God give us two
ears, two eyes, and one mouth,

164
00:11:24.080 --> 00:11:30.159
So coaching is ninety percent listening with
our eyes and our ears, and

165
00:11:30.279 --> 00:11:35.120
so coaching is more about asking questions
and listening and reframing and helping people discover

166
00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:41.039
things about themselves. The misinterpretation there
is that coaches tell people what to do.

167
00:11:41.440 --> 00:11:43.679
Now, there are several styles of
coaching, several areas of coaching.

168
00:11:43.919 --> 00:11:48.480
There's content coaching, there's leadership coaching, there's process coaching. But there's also

169
00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:54.519
personal development coaching, which is about
how do we make decisions? And my

170
00:11:54.759 --> 00:11:58.600
job is to enable people to raise
the bar on their own function. You

171
00:11:58.639 --> 00:12:01.480
know one of my favorite things about
coach you and you're sort of hitting on

172
00:12:01.519 --> 00:12:05.480
it. This I really love and
I do think I bring a certain superpower

173
00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:09.000
to this. Right. I have
my eyes work through my purpose lens,

174
00:12:09.000 --> 00:12:11.200
and so I can see what's unique
and special about people that's just so obvious

175
00:12:11.240 --> 00:12:13.879
and natural for them. It's the
water. These women, they're just so

176
00:12:15.000 --> 00:12:18.759
used to it. They can't articulate
or separate it. One of my favorite

177
00:12:18.799 --> 00:12:22.159
things, though, is to be
able to shine that mirror back to them

178
00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:24.720
and show them who they are.
It is the most amazing thing. I'm

179
00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:28.679
sure you've experienced that your whole entire
life, But isn't it a gift.

180
00:12:28.120 --> 00:12:31.639
I'm a leadership coach. I have
a leadership coach. If people are going

181
00:12:31.639 --> 00:12:33.960
to excel, they must have a
coach. If you look at the people

182
00:12:35.000 --> 00:12:37.679
who are the top in their field, they have a coach. You look

183
00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:41.080
at the people that are struggling,
they're the people that are going to figure

184
00:12:41.080 --> 00:12:46.960
it out for themselves. And so
we have blind spots and we need somebody

185
00:12:46.279 --> 00:12:52.320
external who can help give us feedback. Oh did you realize this or did

186
00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:56.240
you realize when you said that,
or what's the impact of that decision or

187
00:12:56.360 --> 00:13:00.840
is there another way to think about
this? And so have a leadership coach

188
00:13:00.919 --> 00:13:05.559
is important, a marketing coach,
other business process coach. We cannot do

189
00:13:05.639 --> 00:13:09.919
for ourselves what we do for other
people as coaches. And I call myself

190
00:13:09.960 --> 00:13:16.039
a transformational leadership strategist. It's more
than coaching, more than consulting. It's

191
00:13:16.399 --> 00:13:20.720
developing the strategy and integrating into performance. That's what a conductor does. You

192
00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:26.159
got this piece of paper that makes
no sounds, and then we enable music

193
00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:30.720
to come about from that piece of
paper. With a very competent team,

194
00:13:31.159 --> 00:13:35.159
and really you want to have people
around you that are more competent than you.

195
00:13:35.399 --> 00:13:39.480
If you're the best person on your
team, you better run. I

196
00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:41.320
agree, and back to your point
about coaches. I have two coaches,

197
00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:46.039
and I am convinced that I certainly
wouldn't be living my purpose fully if I

198
00:13:46.080 --> 00:13:50.600
didn't have one of the coaches that
I'm working with and the other one I

199
00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:54.200
work more on emotional spiritual matters with. But I couldn't agree more with you.

200
00:13:54.240 --> 00:13:56.399
If you're up to something in life, you need a coach. You

201
00:13:56.440 --> 00:13:58.559
need somebody to help to stand outside
of yourself and I'll kind of pull you

202
00:13:58.600 --> 00:14:03.399
a little bit and challenge you.
Absolutely, and that's where we grow is

203
00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:09.000
in the discomfort and stretching our abilities
and self awareness. And so the number

204
00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:13.679
one trade of a leader is an
influencer. But to be an influencer,

205
00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:18.919
we must be vulnerable and be open
to that. I completely agree, and

206
00:14:18.960 --> 00:14:20.720
that is im perfect way to send
us on our first our first break there,

207
00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:26.799
Hugh's going to be a little bit
reactional reflectional about that, So let's

208
00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:28.240
do that. I'm Elice Cortez,
your host. We are there with Hugh

209
00:14:28.279 --> 00:14:31.960
Valou. He is a transformational leadership
strategic US and the president of Center Vision

210
00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:37.360
International, Inc. He jokes today
from Lynchburg, Virginia. We've been talking

211
00:14:37.360 --> 00:14:39.399
a bit about him, where he
came from, how he grew to the

212
00:14:39.399 --> 00:14:41.399
person he is today. After the
break, we're going to hear about his

213
00:14:41.720 --> 00:14:45.840
unique approach to leadership development. Stay
with us, We'll be right back.

214
00:14:46.320 --> 00:14:52.279
Doctor Release. Cortez is a management
consultant specializing in meaning and purpose and inspirational

215
00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:58.080
speaker and author. She helps companies
visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop

216
00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:05.639
purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures
that elevate fulfillment, performance and commitment within

217
00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:09.279
the workforce. To learn more or
to invite Elise to speak to your organization,

218
00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:13.679
please visit her at Eleasecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get

219
00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:24.519
your employees working on purpose. This
is Working on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes.

220
00:15:26.000 --> 00:15:28.919
To reach our program today or open
a conversation with Elise, send an

221
00:15:28.960 --> 00:15:37.039
email to Alise Alise at Elisecortes dot
com. Now back to working on purpose.

222
00:15:39.159 --> 00:15:41.840
Thanks for staining with us, and
welcome back to working on purpose if

223
00:15:41.879 --> 00:15:45.120
you're just joining us. My guest
is Hugh belou. He's a transformational leadership

224
00:15:45.120 --> 00:15:48.399
strategist and the president of Centervision International. He's the author of eight books on

225
00:15:48.440 --> 00:15:52.799
transformational leadership and is a recognized expert
in working with leaders in churches, religious

226
00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:56.879
organizations, and business and nonprofit communities. He is the editor of the nonprofit

227
00:15:56.960 --> 00:16:02.399
Performance three sixty magazine and the host
of the nonprofit Exchange podcast. I'm your

228
00:16:02.440 --> 00:16:06.320
host, Police Cortes. So before
the break here we were talking about really

229
00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:08.360
how it was that you came up
in the world and your love of music,

230
00:16:08.399 --> 00:16:11.720
and how you've really now fed and
thread that through what you're doing today

231
00:16:11.720 --> 00:16:15.919
in leadership development. So now what
I want to do is I want to

232
00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:18.879
take the curtain back a little if
we can, and learn more about your

233
00:16:18.879 --> 00:16:22.360
approach to leadership development. Everybody does
it a little bit differently, and you've

234
00:16:22.360 --> 00:16:26.159
got your own sauce too, of
course. So you distinguished that you're developing

235
00:16:26.200 --> 00:16:29.799
transformative leaders which I think is fascinating. So what first? What is a

236
00:16:29.799 --> 00:16:33.639
transformative leader? And how is here
she different from other types of leaders say

237
00:16:33.679 --> 00:16:37.879
inspirational or other kinds. There are
a number of tags for this type of

238
00:16:37.960 --> 00:16:41.879
leadership, that type of leadership,
and being a conductor, I fell right

239
00:16:41.919 --> 00:16:47.840
into the pattern of transformational leadership.
It's a style of leadership. It's about

240
00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:52.080
a vision. And when we're kind
of doctors on a podium and we got

241
00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:55.360
a piece of music, there's a
clear vision and this is where we're going,

242
00:16:55.639 --> 00:16:57.759
this is what we're going to do. So we were very purposeful about

243
00:16:57.799 --> 00:17:03.039
the objective. So transformational leadership is
about the vision where are we going.

244
00:17:03.519 --> 00:17:07.200
The opposite of that scale is the
autocratic leader, the charismatic leader. It's

245
00:17:07.240 --> 00:17:10.519
about me. You know, I
got all the ideas. I'm going to

246
00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:14.279
boss you around. That's the boss, and so over here, transformational leader

247
00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:18.319
is the empowerment person. We build
leaders on team, so it's a it's

248
00:17:18.359 --> 00:17:22.960
a very different different approach. Transformational
leader does not do anything. We define

249
00:17:23.400 --> 00:17:27.799
what we take off our plate because
there's component people in our team. Now,

250
00:17:27.799 --> 00:17:33.200
I don't hire the very best OBO
player for my orchestra and tell them

251
00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:36.799
how to play the Obo. And
you'd be surprised how many power leaders,

252
00:17:36.839 --> 00:17:41.799
whether they're in a multinational corporation or
a startup nonprofit in the local community,

253
00:17:41.079 --> 00:17:45.880
they get somebody this component say something, they hurt somebody, or bring some

254
00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:48.880
volunteer into do marketing communications. Then
they tell them how they want it done,

255
00:17:49.279 --> 00:17:53.400
which is ludicrous. You've got an
expert Obo player, so you say

256
00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:57.640
play. And when we shape the
process and we do the blend, so

257
00:17:57.720 --> 00:18:02.079
we've got when you got to melody
comes out when you don't have the melody.

258
00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:07.839
So the leader shapes the process,
the product and actually inspires the community

259
00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:11.240
to perform at a higher level.
Now, I can't make people, as

260
00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.799
I said before, I can't make
people do anything. What I can do

261
00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:21.359
because of my competence and my knowledge
and my instructions inspire them to raise the

262
00:18:21.400 --> 00:18:25.359
bar. On their own performance,
and so there's this synergy that goes back

263
00:18:25.400 --> 00:18:30.240
and forth as we raise the bar
on our performance. So it's it's being

264
00:18:30.319 --> 00:18:33.960
very clear about influencing people. You
get things off your plate. You must

265
00:18:34.039 --> 00:18:37.720
model what you want to see.
If you show up the workplate, you

266
00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:41.839
don't do your job, you say
bad things about other people. You're shaping

267
00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:48.039
the community by your very being.
So authenticity is critical for the for the

268
00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:53.640
transformational leader. So transformational leadership as
a style of leadership was written about in

269
00:18:53.680 --> 00:18:59.680
the eighties by two writers, Burns
and Bass, and they wrote about it

270
00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:03.119
as military was a model. You
don't micromanage people in combat. We don't

271
00:19:03.160 --> 00:19:08.839
micromanage performers on stage during a performance. We must prepare and we must guide

272
00:19:08.880 --> 00:19:15.480
the process and then it blossoms.
So there's several aspects of transformational leadership.

273
00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:19.839
And I never found curriculum or books
that I really thought nailed everything. So

274
00:19:19.880 --> 00:19:25.720
I wrote my own so starting with
this book and then numbers of online courses

275
00:19:25.759 --> 00:19:29.160
and other books. So I've talked
about the process, but I've also tell

276
00:19:29.240 --> 00:19:33.880
stories and then the magazine that I
published, there's stories about leaders who've actually

277
00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:38.480
accomplished things, and leadership is generic. It doesn't have a face of nonprofit

278
00:19:38.599 --> 00:19:44.240
or religion, or education or business. It is generic. It is us

279
00:19:44.279 --> 00:19:49.599
influencing people to achieve a common result. So it's a very powerful tool and

280
00:19:49.640 --> 00:19:56.559
it's ultimately scalable, where autocratic leadership
is limiting. Wherever you can be and

281
00:19:56.559 --> 00:20:00.759
wherever you influence. So it's a
very practical leadership model. Well, nicely

282
00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:03.799
done, thank you, and then
a lot to take it up a little

283
00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:07.119
bit further. And you've already allude
to these before in the first datement,

284
00:20:07.160 --> 00:20:10.880
but you mentioned something about the four
principles of leadership that you've devised and teach.

285
00:20:11.319 --> 00:20:14.160
I would love to hear about those. If you can match these four

286
00:20:14.160 --> 00:20:15.920
things, you can lead anywhere.
You can be a better committee chair,

287
00:20:17.240 --> 00:20:19.799
you can be a better den mother
the cup scouts. So number one,

288
00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:25.480
it's the foundations. When the conductor
steps on the podium, they know the

289
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:30.720
score. So knowing where you want
to go with clarity of perfect clarity of

290
00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:34.519
vision and ability to articulate that you
can have it in your head. But

291
00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:40.240
if you can't share it in a
way people can understand and be excited about

292
00:20:40.279 --> 00:20:44.799
it, then you're really not going
anywhere. So that the foundation. Knowing

293
00:20:44.839 --> 00:20:48.359
the score is a have your plan, but you also have the ability to

294
00:20:48.440 --> 00:20:53.000
lead, so that I call the
foundation. We are capable of leading.

295
00:20:53.319 --> 00:20:56.960
I talked to lots of people starting
up businesses or nonprofits and they say,

296
00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:00.279
well, I got a team,
and I said, what are they to

297
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:02.920
do? Well, I don't know
yet. Well that's backward. So we

298
00:21:02.960 --> 00:21:07.279
want to take our vision and put
it down into a plan, then we

299
00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:11.359
can move forward. And the second
one is relationships. That's your people.

300
00:21:11.799 --> 00:21:15.720
So but my principle and music is
hire the best. I don't want shabby

301
00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:21.519
musicians in my art show and ex
musicians. And there's so many leaders that

302
00:21:21.599 --> 00:21:26.279
want to hire people less capable than
themselves, so it doesn't challenge them.

303
00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:30.119
Well, excuse me. You need
people better than you so you can empower

304
00:21:30.200 --> 00:21:33.599
them to create this energy. And
so we want to hire the best.

305
00:21:33.680 --> 00:21:38.799
So we have a worthy, worthy
project, worthy goal, clear vision.

306
00:21:40.240 --> 00:21:45.559
Now we find people that fit our
culture, they understand our values, they

307
00:21:45.640 --> 00:21:49.000
understand our principles, and we share
that in common. So then here's our

308
00:21:49.039 --> 00:21:52.799
work, here's how we work together. And then okay, you got good

309
00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:59.440
people doing worthy work. Here's the
third principle. We'reharst for success, the

310
00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:03.160
best musical ensembles, the best drama
groups, rehearse for every performance. You

311
00:22:03.240 --> 00:22:07.039
got to stay on the cutting edge. You got to refine, you got

312
00:22:07.079 --> 00:22:11.839
to be at your best. We
want to have have anologist do it well.

313
00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:15.200
This is about systems. So at
least I bet you've attended a boring,

314
00:22:15.400 --> 00:22:19.359
unproductive meeting in your life, probably
more than once, just ocase and

315
00:22:19.440 --> 00:22:23.559
I hope you well you probably led
one like I have, so no more.

316
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:27.480
So that's the number one team killer. We have a bad meeting,

317
00:22:27.799 --> 00:22:30.920
yet we expect to have good results. Well, I got to tell you,

318
00:22:32.160 --> 00:22:33.920
if I have a bad rehearsal,
I'm probably going to have a bad

319
00:22:34.079 --> 00:22:40.680
concert. So we're teaching people how
to perform in our everyday activity. So

320
00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:45.440
there's lots of systems. The annual
review who highly dysfunctional. The hiring process,

321
00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:49.359
we don't do it right. Meetings, we waste people's time and we

322
00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:53.240
put this damper on their spirit.
So that's the number one team killer.

323
00:22:53.640 --> 00:23:00.440
And the fourth principle is what makes
all those others work. There's rests music,

324
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:06.160
So the musical principle is value the
rests. So it's about balance.

325
00:23:06.400 --> 00:23:10.759
So we've got multiple priorities we've got
all of our personal traits, personal,

326
00:23:11.160 --> 00:23:14.440
spiritual, physical, we need to
balance all of that, and we need

327
00:23:14.480 --> 00:23:18.519
to balance work and personal life.
And you've had clients that brag about,

328
00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:22.799
well, I work fifteen hour days, seven days a week. I haven't

329
00:23:22.839 --> 00:23:25.920
had a vacation for years. They're
like, they're bragging about it. Well,

330
00:23:26.319 --> 00:23:29.920
you can't be your best if you're
burning out your body and spirit.

331
00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:33.279
So having time to rest, having
time to reflect, having time to think,

332
00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:37.319
having time to plan, having time
to evaluate. We need to balance

333
00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:42.279
our schedule with various aspects. And
actually you can get more done if you

334
00:23:42.359 --> 00:23:45.960
work less. So all of those
of the principles if you can embrace those,

335
00:23:47.079 --> 00:23:49.559
and my books are written around those, and my self studied courses are

336
00:23:49.559 --> 00:23:55.319
written around those four principles because they're
pretty universal, very nice. I appreciate

337
00:23:55.359 --> 00:23:56.920
how crisp that is and very easy
to follow. So thanks for that.

338
00:23:57.240 --> 00:24:00.119
I always like to make sure that
our listeners want can we have something that's

339
00:24:00.200 --> 00:24:03.319
actuable for them that immunily put to
use, and that is so thank you.

340
00:24:03.759 --> 00:24:07.400
And then building on that one thing
that you and I have spoken about

341
00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:11.079
but really not in detail or depth, and that is your wayfinder approach.

342
00:24:11.119 --> 00:24:14.559
You're working with your clients, tell
us about that that is exclusive to the

343
00:24:14.559 --> 00:24:18.960
Center, Vision Leadership Foundation community.
So I look at things that don't work,

344
00:24:18.039 --> 00:24:22.240
I look at where people have trouble, and I go backwards. How

345
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:26.480
do we get there? So the
standard consultant model is Okay, I'm a

346
00:24:26.559 --> 00:24:30.319
strategist. I'm going to ask you
a few questions. I'll write your strategic

347
00:24:30.359 --> 00:24:33.759
plan. I'll leave you a piece
of paper and goodbye. Well, ninety

348
00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:37.559
percent of the failure is in implementation. So yes, we have a plan,

349
00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:41.839
but it's co created with our board. So we have built the culture

350
00:24:41.880 --> 00:24:45.799
from the very beginning. The planners
and the doers are the same. Now,

351
00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:49.200
guiding the process is what I call
a wavefinder. We have the expertise

352
00:24:49.599 --> 00:24:52.720
and the consultant. By the way, he tells you what to do,

353
00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:55.880
and now that's ludicrous. It's like
telling a noble player how to play the

354
00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:57.720
obo. I don't know how to
play the elbow. So who knows more

355
00:24:57.759 --> 00:25:03.039
about their idea, about their enterprise
than the leader in the organization. So

356
00:25:03.079 --> 00:25:06.799
we shouldn't tell them what to do. We should help them take the information

357
00:25:07.240 --> 00:25:11.119
and put it in the system so
they can actually achieve their mission fully achieve

358
00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:15.279
their mission. So a wayfinder enables
people to grow their skills to be able

359
00:25:15.319 --> 00:25:21.000
to do it themselves. It's a
different model, it's a different mindset,

360
00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:25.960
and it's a different approach to creating
sustainable, healthy communities. You know what

361
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:29.359
I love about that is it aligns
with what my approach to which is really

362
00:25:29.400 --> 00:25:34.119
all about helping people discover and step
into and realize their own greatness because right

363
00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:37.119
that's their ability to be able to
realize their own potential, make the diversional

364
00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:41.359
that's worthy of their one precious life. So it very much aligns with that

365
00:25:41.480 --> 00:25:47.599
principle of mind that's not surprising but
fascinating. And you spoke about my podcast,

366
00:25:47.720 --> 00:25:49.880
the Nonprofit Exchange, which you've been
a guest on. But I do

367
00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:55.559
have a podcast called thirty one Days
to Becoming a Better Leader, and people

368
00:25:55.559 --> 00:25:59.680
can find it a Better Leader dot
me and it's free and it's just there.

369
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:03.119
In that thirty one days you'll find
out I didn't know if that was

370
00:26:03.160 --> 00:26:06.680
a part of leadership. So it's
kind of an education on what leadership really

371
00:26:06.759 --> 00:26:11.920
is. And it's a very misunderstood
work. I agree so many definitions to

372
00:26:11.039 --> 00:26:15.079
it seems one of the things that
I appreciate too about you is that you

373
00:26:15.240 --> 00:26:18.519
seem to focus on nonprofits and churches. Is that true and if so,

374
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:25.839
why that's been a turn recently.
I've worked with several multinational companies. I

375
00:26:25.880 --> 00:26:30.720
worked with dozens and dozens of startup
businesses, entrepreneurs, and early stage businesses

376
00:26:30.799 --> 00:26:37.200
trying to help them put these principles
into place. I started Center Vision because

377
00:26:37.240 --> 00:26:40.640
when I served the churches, we
had a counseling center and people could get

378
00:26:40.640 --> 00:26:44.119
the help they needed whether or not
they had the money. So there needed

379
00:26:44.119 --> 00:26:48.119
to be a resource that was either
free or low cost for these organizations,

380
00:26:48.119 --> 00:26:53.160
the smaller ones that don't have the
budget for leadership and organizational development, which

381
00:26:53.240 --> 00:26:57.279
is crucial for our success. Half
of the nonprofits that are formed every year

382
00:26:57.400 --> 00:27:03.039
will close. The brand out rate
for leaders is forty five percent according to

383
00:27:03.079 --> 00:27:07.079
the study by the Meyer Foundation,
and in clergy, only one out of

384
00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:11.920
ten clergy actually make it to retirement. It's a high stress job, so

385
00:27:11.240 --> 00:27:17.839
empowering leaders not to get into the
same old routine to burn out because what

386
00:27:17.880 --> 00:27:22.119
we're not doing is we're not enabling
others in the community to step up and

387
00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:26.440
volunteer and do the work that they
want to be doing. So we're actually

388
00:27:26.480 --> 00:27:30.279
standing in the way of people that
can do things and want to do things

389
00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:33.720
because we think they're too busy.
Well, they can decide that. So

390
00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:37.720
it's a sector that we really need. Government shouldn't be doing a lot of

391
00:27:37.720 --> 00:27:41.519
things it's trying to do. The
nonprofits in the faith community need to step

392
00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:45.559
up. So about it's giving an
opportunity and many we're losing. And I'm

393
00:27:45.559 --> 00:27:49.960
a Methodist. We're losing oneand or
twelve hundred members a week in the Methodist

394
00:27:51.000 --> 00:27:55.519
Church and that's not unusual for the
mainline churches. And to me, that's

395
00:27:55.519 --> 00:28:00.119
a leadership issue. We're not really
engaging people in meaningful, meaningful work that

396
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:06.119
we're called to be. You see
why I ask you to the show every

397
00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:08.440
other word that you use almost as
meaning or purpose. So I just I'm

398
00:28:08.480 --> 00:28:12.160
with you on every term here,
Hugh lurks. So, okay, so

399
00:28:12.200 --> 00:28:17.279
you told me why you're serving nonprofits
in churches because there's a need and they

400
00:28:17.319 --> 00:28:21.640
can't necessarily afford the same sort of
fee structure that say corporate America can.

401
00:28:22.000 --> 00:28:26.039
And I'm curious, though I also
do work with nonprofit in corporate America is

402
00:28:26.119 --> 00:28:30.960
there a different leadership necessary in nonprofits
for churches in corporate America, it's a

403
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:33.799
lot harder in nonprofits. In church, you don't have the leverage for paycheck.

404
00:28:34.119 --> 00:28:38.519
In my church in Atlanta, we
had CEOs of major corporation and they

405
00:28:38.519 --> 00:28:44.559
were in committees and the choirs and
the ensembles, and they very much respected

406
00:28:44.599 --> 00:28:48.319
what I could do because I could
engage a whole lot of people without the

407
00:28:48.400 --> 00:28:52.920
leverage of a paycheck and with a
high level of accountability and a high standard

408
00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:56.799
of performance. People don't show up
to do a bad job, and we

409
00:28:57.319 --> 00:29:03.640
apologize in community is like nonprofits and
churches, and we wish down shift to

410
00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.720
make it easy for everybody, and
then we water it down and then nobody's

411
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:12.400
satisfied. So we set the bar
too low. And there's a different way

412
00:29:12.599 --> 00:29:17.559
we influence people. Yes, So
with people who want to volunteer, the

413
00:29:17.559 --> 00:29:22.559
big vword, we want to find
out what they want and it's really not

414
00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:26.799
much different. People show up in
a corporation for a paycheck. People show

415
00:29:26.880 --> 00:29:30.279
up in a community like a church
and nonprofit because they want to make a

416
00:29:30.319 --> 00:29:34.960
difference. Well, people perform at
a higher standard in either one if they're

417
00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:38.400
personally fulfilled in the work they're doing. Yes, you get a raise,

418
00:29:38.480 --> 00:29:41.079
but then it's gone. You spend
it, But you're going to perform at

419
00:29:41.079 --> 00:29:45.599
a higher level if you feel like
you're doing something meaningful. Even people that

420
00:29:45.640 --> 00:29:48.880
are paid good salaries hate to go
to meetings that they feel like is a

421
00:29:48.920 --> 00:29:52.839
waste of their time. They're being
paid to be there, but they hate

422
00:29:52.880 --> 00:29:56.400
it. They want to do meaningful
work and they want to perform at a

423
00:29:56.440 --> 00:30:00.279
high standard. So that part is
very similar. So I think probably corporate

424
00:30:00.319 --> 00:30:07.000
leaders could learn from nonprofit leaders and
unfortunately the leadership blind spots and deafits are

425
00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:11.799
pretty much the same across any of
those sectors. Yeah, reminded me just

426
00:30:11.920 --> 00:30:15.160
quickly that when I had the privilege
of serving as the chairman of the board

427
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:18.440
of the YMCA here in Dallas at
the White Rock location, we had I

428
00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:19.720
think thirty two board members at the
time, and I went and met with

429
00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:25.039
each one of them in person as
I launched my leadership, and the idea

430
00:30:25.160 --> 00:30:26.559
was, what do you want?
What are you trying to What are you

431
00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:27.920
trying to get from being on the
board, what do you you're here for

432
00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:30.799
a reason? This time takes away
from your work and your family. What

433
00:30:30.799 --> 00:30:33.319
can we do to make it meaningful? What are you trying to make happen?

434
00:30:33.599 --> 00:30:37.200
It was amazing. Everybody had a
different response. Everybody wanted something different,

435
00:30:37.240 --> 00:30:41.319
and so the ability to be able
to serve up new meaningful roles for

436
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:45.839
them or a new relationships that they
were interested in cultivating. It was such

437
00:30:45.839 --> 00:30:48.279
a great fun job to do.
I enjoyed it immensely. It is a

438
00:30:48.279 --> 00:30:52.960
fun job. And if you're not
going on one talking absolutely no, no,

439
00:30:52.960 --> 00:30:55.640
no, I'm an excellent interviewer.
I don't care what they say.

440
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:57.359
All right, let's grab our Let's
grab our second break if we can.

441
00:30:57.440 --> 00:31:00.680
Hugh, thanks for staying with us. We're going on our second break here.

442
00:31:02.160 --> 00:31:04.119
We will be back here with Hugh
of Bluo. He is a transformational

443
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:08.519
leadership strategist and the president of Centervision
International. He is the author of eight

444
00:31:08.519 --> 00:31:12.519
books and trust Relational Leadership. There's
a recognized expert in working with leaders in

445
00:31:12.599 --> 00:31:17.759
churches, religious organizations, and business
and nonprofit communities. He is the editor

446
00:31:17.759 --> 00:31:22.200
of the nonprofit Performance three sixty magazine
and host of the nonprofit Exchange podcast I'm

447
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:26.240
your host Elise Cortes. Stay with
us, We'll be right back Doctor Elise

448
00:31:26.319 --> 00:31:33.079
Cortes is a management consultant specializing in
meaning and purpose. An inspirational speaker and

449
00:31:33.119 --> 00:31:38.319
author. She helps companies visioneer for
greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired

450
00:31:38.440 --> 00:31:45.000
leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate
fulfillment, performance, and commitment within the

451
00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:49.559
workforce. To learn more or to
invite Elise to speak to your organization,

452
00:31:49.880 --> 00:31:55.160
please visit her at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get your

453
00:31:55.200 --> 00:32:05.759
employees working on purpose. This is
working on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes.

454
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:09.559
To reach our program today or open
a conversation with Alise, send an email

455
00:32:09.640 --> 00:32:16.799
to a lease Ali s at elisecortes
dot com. Now back to working on

456
00:32:16.880 --> 00:32:22.559
Purpose. Thanks for staying with us, and welcome back to working on Purpose.

457
00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:24.319
If you're just tuning in. My
guest is Hublu. He's a transformational

458
00:32:24.359 --> 00:32:29.599
leadership strategist and the president of Synergism
International. We were talking before the break

459
00:32:29.640 --> 00:32:31.720
about his particular approach to leadership development
and now what we want to do is

460
00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:36.279
get into the skinny of it here
and I'm asked him to think about some

461
00:32:36.359 --> 00:32:38.640
case studies and examples of the work
that he and his team do so for

462
00:32:38.720 --> 00:32:43.559
this segment again, now we're getting
into the application here, so I want

463
00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:46.279
to focus on some of the examples
that you've done to help transform the leadership

464
00:32:46.319 --> 00:32:50.880
of your clients, so the listeners
can be inspired and learned by curiously somewhat

465
00:32:50.880 --> 00:32:52.839
through what you're saying. So,
can you tell us about maybe first in

466
00:32:52.960 --> 00:32:57.920
nonprofit you work with where you've helped
them achieve really strong results, maybe the

467
00:32:57.960 --> 00:33:01.200
story before and after something like that. Well, you know, let's see

468
00:33:01.240 --> 00:33:06.759
what comes to mind. You know, I work all over the country,

469
00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:09.200
a work in person. I work
remotely. I think some of the most

470
00:33:09.240 --> 00:33:15.480
important ones have happened in my backyard. So that blows the consultant model all

471
00:33:15.519 --> 00:33:19.279
to pieces, because the consultant has
to be fifty miles away from home,

472
00:33:19.319 --> 00:33:23.160
as you know, and have a
briefcase. And so one of the most

473
00:33:23.200 --> 00:33:29.599
intriguing projects that I led was that
I used to live in Blacksburg. The

474
00:33:29.599 --> 00:33:34.559
town of Blacksburg named after a guy
named Black, and he had two sons

475
00:33:34.799 --> 00:33:38.519
who each got eight blocks. And
so there's this sixteen blocks downtown that's the

476
00:33:38.559 --> 00:33:43.960
sixteen squares of history. And then
just outside of it was Alexander Black's house

477
00:33:44.319 --> 00:33:47.319
and it was going to Potts.
So the town bought it and they wanted

478
00:33:47.359 --> 00:33:51.240
people to donate fix it up.
Well, give me a break, who's

479
00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:53.720
going to donate to the government.
And then they formed a nonprofit and people

480
00:33:53.759 --> 00:34:00.240
said that's a trick. It's still
a government. So they engaged me to

481
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:04.599
to create a strategic plan for it. Well, strategic plan is a piece

482
00:34:04.599 --> 00:34:08.039
of paper. So we got the
key players that Virginia tech people, the

483
00:34:08.079 --> 00:34:13.039
business people, the city council members, a couple of them, arts community,

484
00:34:13.440 --> 00:34:17.840
and so we came together and over
four sessions over two months, people

485
00:34:17.880 --> 00:34:22.119
took off of work four hours at
a time and we did some heavy lifting

486
00:34:22.400 --> 00:34:28.119
and I used visually displayed thinking on
storyboards. So we created the strategy over

487
00:34:28.159 --> 00:34:31.639
time. But what happened in the
process was it was a new architecture of

488
00:34:31.679 --> 00:34:37.000
engagement. The arts community was noted
all aligned. They weren't doing things together.

489
00:34:37.119 --> 00:34:40.280
There's an arts collaborative that's still going
on five years later. The bankers

490
00:34:40.280 --> 00:34:44.639
wouldn't fund this project because they didn't
think it was viable. Well, when

491
00:34:44.679 --> 00:34:47.119
we finished the fourth meeting, the
three bankers around the table said we're going

492
00:34:47.159 --> 00:34:51.960
to rank the loan for one point
eight million dollars. And so what happened

493
00:34:52.079 --> 00:34:57.000
was a transformation of well an idea, this is a place to record history

494
00:34:57.119 --> 00:35:00.239
in this historic area of Blacksburg.
Paint your house. You have to get

495
00:35:00.280 --> 00:35:04.960
approval, it's one of those protected
areas. But it went to being a

496
00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:08.000
place where history is made and the
community gathers. And it was a very

497
00:35:08.039 --> 00:35:14.280
elegant transformation and renovation of that wouldn't
really transformed as a renovation of that house.

498
00:35:14.719 --> 00:35:19.800
And so the bottom line here was
it was the community coming together to

499
00:35:19.880 --> 00:35:22.360
create their own plan, and I
didn't do it. I was a catalyst

500
00:35:22.440 --> 00:35:27.360
for bringing their thinking out and then
putting in in a structure. What I

501
00:35:27.480 --> 00:35:31.280
find, especially in trouble times like
we have today, is we've lost the

502
00:35:31.320 --> 00:35:37.679
ability to have civil discourse, meaningful
conversations about things that matter and disagree and

503
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:44.079
think that the disagreement is really creative
thinking, it's not a weapon. And

504
00:35:44.239 --> 00:35:49.039
so what happened is all the people
with diverse opinions really were able to be

505
00:35:49.119 --> 00:35:52.239
aligned with a common vision. So
that's the synergy of the common vision that

506
00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:55.559
I talked about. So that was
I put so much effort in that job.

507
00:35:55.639 --> 00:36:00.280
I think I made a dollar an
hour, but It wasn't about pot

508
00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:02.400
the money. It was about me
being able to do a good job in

509
00:36:02.440 --> 00:36:07.360
the place where I lived at the
time that was high risk. So what

510
00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:10.840
what I just really heard here what
the difference it makes when you when you

511
00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:15.599
know that you so we all know
when some when what we do is meaningful,

512
00:36:15.639 --> 00:36:17.800
it registers on an emotional level.
And I heard that for you,

513
00:36:17.920 --> 00:36:22.280
and I guess we could all just
hang on to the one point eight million

514
00:36:22.800 --> 00:36:27.360
dollar loan that would indicate the success. But it sounds to me like you

515
00:36:27.480 --> 00:36:30.280
pulled the whole town forward, well, the movies and shakers in the town,

516
00:36:30.320 --> 00:36:35.280
which indirectly, you know, town
of thirty thousand was a university of

517
00:36:35.280 --> 00:36:39.679
thirty thousand and thirty five thousand,
so you know, the core players know

518
00:36:39.800 --> 00:36:44.000
it happened. Not everybody knows how
it happened, but that's okay. It's

519
00:36:44.039 --> 00:36:47.440
a place, it's a place to
gather and to think and to be and

520
00:36:47.480 --> 00:36:52.400
to be in community together. So
it transformed the whole idea from being a

521
00:36:52.559 --> 00:36:57.280
historical museum to being a it's still
a museum, there's still preservation of history,

522
00:36:57.480 --> 00:36:59.920
but we you know, we gather
and we communicate and we sell,

523
00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:01.960
break and we create new history.
And seeing what I know listening to that

524
00:37:02.039 --> 00:37:05.360
haven't been part of these as well, what we know is that every single

525
00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:09.360
person that was part of that effort
was also involved and fueled by that transformation

526
00:37:09.480 --> 00:37:13.599
themselves, and they felt that we're
carried along with it as well, which

527
00:37:13.679 --> 00:37:17.000
is just beautiful. Yeah, and
it was just a start, and you

528
00:37:17.039 --> 00:37:23.000
know, you people then take it
on and it migrates over time and to

529
00:37:23.079 --> 00:37:27.840
a mature document. So what I'll
point out here is the strategies that I

530
00:37:27.880 --> 00:37:31.760
create, we also establish a review
six month review. So a long term

531
00:37:31.760 --> 00:37:36.119
plan is still a long term plan. You revise it and you update it,

532
00:37:36.159 --> 00:37:39.519
and you recommit to the new plan. So the long term objectives are

533
00:37:39.559 --> 00:37:44.440
probably the same, your vision and
mission are probably the same, but the

534
00:37:44.480 --> 00:37:47.840
mechanics of getting it done. Will
learn how to improve those and we'll learn

535
00:37:47.920 --> 00:37:52.559
if we're going down the wrong pathway. So it's so staying flexible to the

536
00:37:52.599 --> 00:37:57.760
application and the implementation of the plan
is key. Okay, So that was

537
00:37:58.000 --> 00:38:00.519
a story or a case study about
it nonprofit. How about one about a

538
00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:04.639
church that you've worked with. Well, there's a methods church in North Campton,

539
00:38:04.679 --> 00:38:07.800
Ohio. They called me one day
said we got to hire four staff

540
00:38:07.840 --> 00:38:12.199
members. Can you help us hire? And so I said, what is

541
00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:15.599
your strategy? Well, we don't
really have one written. I said,

542
00:38:15.639 --> 00:38:17.480
well what are they going to do? How are we going to work together?

543
00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:23.079
And so instead of me working for
a couple of months, we devised

544
00:38:23.079 --> 00:38:28.039
a year long develop a year long
process. And this is where cinivision kicks

545
00:38:28.039 --> 00:38:30.519
in. You know, they had
X number of dollars, but they needed

546
00:38:30.840 --> 00:38:35.039
much more work. So basically the
end congrant and they able them have the

547
00:38:35.079 --> 00:38:39.360
whole year's with process, multiple trips, multiple engagements, and then in between

548
00:38:39.639 --> 00:38:46.280
conversations. So so they we gathered
in their big their big gym, and

549
00:38:46.400 --> 00:38:50.760
one hundred people in congregation showed up
for a Saturday planning session. So we

550
00:38:50.800 --> 00:38:53.639
did some future visioning. What would
you like to see? So it starts

551
00:38:53.679 --> 00:38:58.679
with possibility things. Now churches want
to opt out and say our mission is

552
00:38:58.719 --> 00:39:01.960
the Great commission to to make disciples. Well, that's the great commission.

553
00:39:01.960 --> 00:39:07.480
It's not a choice. Your mission
is what you do when you make disciples.

554
00:39:07.719 --> 00:39:10.079
And so in each each organization is
different, like each person is different.

555
00:39:10.079 --> 00:39:13.880
So what are we going to do
as an organization? It's different from

556
00:39:13.920 --> 00:39:15.480
the other one down the street.
And by the way, is there some

557
00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:20.320
way we can work together? It's
something we rarely think about. And so

558
00:39:20.639 --> 00:39:24.920
we defised the process. And then
I said, why don't we upgrade everybody's

559
00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:28.480
leadership skills because you got a lot
of teams, committees, you got a

560
00:39:28.519 --> 00:39:31.960
lot of people doing things. So
I did another Saturday months later on all

561
00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:37.559
hands on deck leadership Prices training.
So I did a full day training.

562
00:39:37.599 --> 00:39:40.320
It was a snowed in day.
Seventy seven people showed up and they loved

563
00:39:40.320 --> 00:39:43.480
it, so instudent, I want
to go home. So we talked about

564
00:39:43.519 --> 00:39:45.880
meeting strategies as part of that,
and so the next Sunday we announce.

565
00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:50.000
The next day of Sunday we announced
what we've done, and then after church

566
00:39:50.079 --> 00:39:52.719
they had a meal and they had
committee meetings. So I walked around.

567
00:39:52.000 --> 00:39:57.840
Everybody was using what I taught them, So no more boring meetings. It's

568
00:39:57.840 --> 00:40:02.320
purpose driven meetings. It's focused outcomes. It's changing the agenda to deliverables.

569
00:40:02.360 --> 00:40:07.360
We're going to accomplish the following things. So there was this energy and then

570
00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:10.400
they started sharing with one another and
they just discovered that, oh, if

571
00:40:10.440 --> 00:40:13.679
you do this, I don't have
to do it. But if I finished

572
00:40:13.719 --> 00:40:16.400
this, this other group needs it. So we erased the silos in the

573
00:40:16.440 --> 00:40:21.320
sharing of the goals, which we
don't ordinarily do. We meet in secret,

574
00:40:21.360 --> 00:40:23.960
we work in secret, and then
we report the results when really this

575
00:40:24.039 --> 00:40:29.559
new architecture of engagement is how do
we work together because we could maybe do

576
00:40:29.679 --> 00:40:32.679
less work and get more done and
have a better time at it. So

577
00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:37.840
that was very successful. And then
then we went we did a job search.

578
00:40:37.880 --> 00:40:40.679
We had four search committees, and
long story short, we put all

579
00:40:40.679 --> 00:40:45.039
four people in the jobs on June
first. We started December June first,

580
00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:50.800
then went to work. And then
the most eliminated part of this is the

581
00:40:51.199 --> 00:40:57.280
assimilation process. So we did an
assmilation process and talked about how do we

582
00:40:57.400 --> 00:41:02.159
manage evaluations without having to do the
annual evaluation, how do we do ongoing

583
00:41:02.199 --> 00:41:07.239
empowerment and improvement over the process.
By the way, in the process of

584
00:41:07.639 --> 00:41:12.679
of doing the planning and look into
the future, they rewrote the four position

585
00:41:12.760 --> 00:41:15.559
descriptions. It wasn't at all what
they thought it was going to be,

586
00:41:15.880 --> 00:41:19.760
and they came up with a much
more powerful paradigm of leadership for this church

587
00:41:19.800 --> 00:41:22.559
and it was very successful. I
can tell I'm just hanging out every word.

588
00:41:22.679 --> 00:41:27.280
How exciting, how very exciting.
Talk about making a difference and leaving

589
00:41:27.320 --> 00:41:30.960
a legacy. It's beautiful. Speaking
of a legacy, we have to talk

590
00:41:30.960 --> 00:41:32.320
about our common friend, Bob Hopkins, which is how we got to know

591
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:35.719
each other. And I want to
talk a little bit about how you got

592
00:41:35.719 --> 00:41:37.760
connected to Yes, that's our Bob
Hopkins right there. I'm so proud of

593
00:41:37.880 --> 00:41:40.400
my cold Fust. He's been on
the show a couple of times and I

594
00:41:40.599 --> 00:41:44.679
just am such a fan. He
has a program called the PAVE Program,

595
00:41:44.679 --> 00:41:50.320
which it stands for Philanthropy and Volunteerism
and education. And I want to understand

596
00:41:50.480 --> 00:41:52.880
why you're connected with that. Why
is is that a meanful project for youth

597
00:41:52.920 --> 00:41:58.519
support. Well, the PAVED leaders
were the leaders in that youth philanthropy conference

598
00:41:58.559 --> 00:42:02.159
we spoke about in June twenty twenty, and they led it. They were

599
00:42:02.159 --> 00:42:07.119
the leaders. I was the facilitator
of the process. I set up all

600
00:42:07.119 --> 00:42:12.400
the mechanism. You know, that's
the preparation part. So my real of

601
00:42:12.480 --> 00:42:16.519
thumb for meetings and live events is
the same as preparing for a rehearsal.

602
00:42:16.800 --> 00:42:20.760
It's two to one. If it's
an hour rehearsal, you have two hours

603
00:42:20.840 --> 00:42:23.679
preparation two hour four hours, and
so that was a four hour session.

604
00:42:23.679 --> 00:42:28.440
It took a whole lot of preparation
just to make sure that everything flowed.

605
00:42:28.880 --> 00:42:30.719
And you know, for the person
watching it, if you watch a performance

606
00:42:30.760 --> 00:42:35.360
and it seems easy, then the
artist has done a good job of preparing.

607
00:42:35.719 --> 00:42:42.360
And so preparing and teaching our youth
to step up its priority. In

608
00:42:42.400 --> 00:42:45.519
all of my churches for forty years, my peer group, the group that

609
00:42:45.599 --> 00:42:50.039
I led, was the third through
fifth grade choirs. And you know what

610
00:42:50.320 --> 00:42:53.360
we learned from them, and I
learned from emdnus and every one of these

611
00:42:53.639 --> 00:42:58.800
well, the thirteen to twenty two
year olds went first and they were astounding,

612
00:42:59.239 --> 00:43:04.239
and then the into a twelve year
olds came and they were a step

613
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:08.440
up from that. They were higher
performing, so empowering. And people want

614
00:43:08.440 --> 00:43:10.800
to say, oh, the youth
are tomorrow's leaders. No, they're to

615
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:14.880
day's leaders, and we need to
give them a voice, and we need

616
00:43:14.920 --> 00:43:17.599
to give them some of the benefit
of our expertise. And so all of

617
00:43:17.639 --> 00:43:22.079
those all of those youth were listening
to Bob and I with gray hair saying

618
00:43:22.079 --> 00:43:25.679
okay, here's some things that didn't
work, but they were also active,

619
00:43:27.239 --> 00:43:31.800
learning, sharing and volunteering in their
own right. And so there's a lot

620
00:43:31.840 --> 00:43:37.159
of hope if we give people people
a benefit of our wisdom and the benefit

621
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:38.960
of a track, that they can
raise the bar on their own performance.

622
00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:44.920
So I am passionate along with Bob
and never had thought about it before in

623
00:43:44.920 --> 00:43:51.000
philanthropy, and so he's opened my
eyes to challenging these young leaders to think

624
00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:53.679
in a new, fresh way.
And he does it in his classes and

625
00:43:53.719 --> 00:43:58.920
teaching them the junior colleges and colleges
around Dallas. I know he does.

626
00:43:59.119 --> 00:44:01.239
When I had him on the show
first, I was really fell in love

627
00:44:01.239 --> 00:44:04.960
with what he's doing and what he
stands to be in the world. And

628
00:44:05.000 --> 00:44:08.159
he really believes and I absolutely agree
with him that if we allow children to

629
00:44:08.920 --> 00:44:14.840
become philanthropists and volunteers in their community, one we strengthen them their their sense

630
00:44:14.840 --> 00:44:17.960
of self in person because they step
into a state of self transcendence. So

631
00:44:17.960 --> 00:44:22.480
they're more less likely to get into
trouble and get involved with drugs, choose

632
00:44:22.519 --> 00:44:25.199
criminal activities, et cetera, and
more likely to really develop a sense of

633
00:44:25.239 --> 00:44:29.880
confidence and self esteem and becomes successful
in life. I think that's worth getting

634
00:44:29.960 --> 00:44:31.679
up for. It's worth getting up
for. And I was, I was,

635
00:44:32.199 --> 00:44:37.159
have the book in my hand.
It's called Philanthropy Misunderstood. But he's

636
00:44:37.199 --> 00:44:42.880
got a lot of stories in here
about people who are philanthropists doing very,

637
00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:45.360
very meaningful work, and actually asked
me how I met him. I was

638
00:44:45.400 --> 00:44:49.840
looking for the page, but I
can't find it's a it's a coffee table

639
00:44:49.840 --> 00:44:53.440
books. You can go to Philanthropy
Misunderstood dot org dot org and you can

640
00:44:53.480 --> 00:45:00.519
get a copy there. But I
interviewed and I've connected with these people LinkedIn

641
00:45:00.360 --> 00:45:08.880
Bonnie and Michael who actually accidentally founded
a winery, Bigfoot Winery Barefoot I forget

642
00:45:07.800 --> 00:45:13.760
as Barefoot Barefoot and it became the
number one brand in America. And then

643
00:45:13.800 --> 00:45:17.360
the process they help nonprofits get funding. And I said, my wife's a

644
00:45:17.400 --> 00:45:21.360
graduate SMU. We were going to
Dallas and he said, they said,

645
00:45:21.400 --> 00:45:23.400
oh, you're got to meet Bob. And so I met Bob and we

646
00:45:23.440 --> 00:45:28.679
became fast friends and introduces me to
really great people like at least Cartes,

647
00:45:29.079 --> 00:45:32.440
and so it's this thread of good
people meeting good people, and you know,

648
00:45:32.519 --> 00:45:37.760
it's at this stage of life.
It's my third career and it's the

649
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:39.480
most meaningful, and the one where
I have the most impact, and the

650
00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:44.119
one where I'm having the best time. That's so great. We're almost out

651
00:45:44.119 --> 00:45:45.719
of time speaking of that. So
I want to ask you two things really

652
00:45:45.800 --> 00:45:50.400
quick. We talked on the phone
sometime ago, and I ask you what

653
00:45:50.519 --> 00:45:52.639
makes your heart see? And you
said, when people tell me that I

654
00:45:52.719 --> 00:45:55.320
made a difference in their lives,
why is that so important to you?

655
00:45:57.840 --> 00:46:00.400
We want to say to ourselves.
I work so hard and nobody cares.

656
00:46:00.639 --> 00:46:04.960
But people have come to me years
later and said, you told me this

657
00:46:05.320 --> 00:46:08.320
and it changed my life. And
I just commented on something, said well

658
00:46:08.320 --> 00:46:12.519
what about this? What about that? And one person said, I renamed

659
00:46:12.559 --> 00:46:19.199
my company because you said what about
this? And I am in above dolls

660
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:22.960
here and didn't have spoke at CEO
space and we have meal tables, and

661
00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:28.039
over the course of the last thirteen
years, I've facilitated conversations around three meals

662
00:46:28.039 --> 00:46:30.199
a day, eight hundred and fifty
of those. And so I've gotten really

663
00:46:30.239 --> 00:46:34.840
good at listening to people and saying, well what if and they go wow,

664
00:46:35.199 --> 00:46:37.719
and that touches my heart. You
know, I work for hire.

665
00:46:37.760 --> 00:46:42.440
People pay me for coaching and whatnot
because I've got this bad habit of eating

666
00:46:42.480 --> 00:46:45.239
and living in a house. But
the biggest payment is to see them be

667
00:46:45.320 --> 00:46:50.760
successful. Beautiful way to finish.
Thank you so much for joining us and

668
00:46:50.800 --> 00:46:53.000
giving us your heart, your soul, your expertise with our listeners and me.

669
00:46:53.239 --> 00:46:57.679
Thank you listeners. You want to
learn more about you his worker's publications,

670
00:46:57.679 --> 00:47:00.360
start by visiting his website, which
is Center Vision Leadership dot org.

671
00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:07.719
Let me spell that for you.
It's s y n er vsio n Leadership

672
00:47:07.880 --> 00:47:09.679
dot org. Last week, you
gus the Live show you Always Catch Up

673
00:47:09.679 --> 00:47:14.199
the Record a podcast. We were
on the air with js PreK talking about

674
00:47:14.199 --> 00:47:16.280
what he and those he interviewed for
his book are doing with their wealth to

675
00:47:16.280 --> 00:47:21.239
make a difference in the world.
Very promising and very inspiring. Next week

676
00:47:21.280 --> 00:47:23.719
we'll be on the air with Danny
Gutnek talking about his book Meaning at Work

677
00:47:23.719 --> 00:47:27.880
and It's Hidden Language. I stalked
to him on LinkedIn to bring him to

678
00:47:27.920 --> 00:47:30.039
you, so you be there.
I'll see you there. Rember at works

679
00:47:30.039 --> 00:47:35.239
at least a third of a life, So let's work on purpose. We

680
00:47:35.320 --> 00:47:38.119
hope you've enjoyed this week's program.
Be sure to tune in to Working on

681
00:47:38.199 --> 00:47:44.119
Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise
Cortes, each week on the Voice America

682
00:47:44.199 --> 00:47:51.079
Empowerment Channel. Together, we'll create
a world where business operates conscientiously. Leadership

683
00:47:51.159 --> 00:47:55.679
inspires impassion performance, and employees are
fulfilled in work that provides the meaning and

684
00:47:55.760 --> 00:48:00.119
purpose they crave. See you there, Let's work on purpose.