Nature: The Perfect Antidote to Today’s Spiritual and Well-Being

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What's working on purpose anyway? Each
week we ponder the answer to this question.

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People ache for meaning and purpose at
work, to contribute their talents passionately

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and know their lives really matter.
They crave being part of an organization that

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inspires them and helps them grow into
realizing their highest potential. Business can be

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such a force for good in the
world, elevating humanity. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration to help
usher in this world we all want

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working on purpose. Now. Here
is your host, doctor Elise Cortez.

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Welcome back to the Working and Purpose
Program. Thanks for tuning again this week.

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I'm your host, doctor Elis Cortez, during your live from Dallas,

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Texas, which is home base for
me. If you don't know me yet,

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I'm a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose, organizational logotherapist, inspirational

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speaker, social scientists and author.
You can learn more about me at least

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cortest dot com, Orgusto Dashnall dot
com. Let me think, my partner

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and sponsor work proud. We are
a perfect collaboration. Everyone wants to know

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they matter and that the work they
do is meaningful and appreciated. Workproud is

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a mobile platform built to encourage employees
to share stories and recognize each other's contribution.

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Work Proud empowers hr embusits leaders to
help create company cultures where all employees

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are inspired to feel proud of their
work and proud of their company. Learn

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more at workproud dot com. With
us today is Swadi Thiagarajan. She's an

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Indian conservationist, documentary filmmaker and environmental
journalist. She is a core member of

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the Sea Change Project in South Africa, an environmental editor at the Indian Television

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News Network of INDETV. She is
the author of the book Born Wild,

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Journeys into the Wild Hearts of India
and Africa. She is the associate producer

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of the Oscar winning documentary My Octopus
Teacher and also produce The Animal Indicator featuring

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Anna Brightenbach, who is an interspecies
communicator. We'll be talking today about the

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work she does as a controvationist,
film producer and author. She joined a

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day from Cape Town, South Africa. Swari Wana com welcome to Working on

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Purpose. Thank you very much for
having me at least it's great to be

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on Thank you and it's your first
language Tamil or Hindi, well actually English,

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although I grew up in India,
my whole education system was pretty much

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from the beginning it was in English. Tamil is my mother tongue, so

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I do speak it, but even
at home, for most part, my

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parents and I spoke English and occasionally
sort of fell into Tamil and Hindi being

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the you know, sort of the
predominant language in Delhi. So when I

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moved to Delhi, I sort of
learned to speak it. Plus it's taught

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to us in schools. I can't
claim great proficiency in it, but yeah,

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enough to communicate. It's so beautiful. I learned about twenty five words

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of Tamil when I was in India
in twenty fourteen, So knowing a little

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bit about your background, I just
had to have at least a word in

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there for it. So thank you
for indulging me. So was very well

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said, thank you, thank you. I loved that word. So it

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is so beautifully welcoming the way it's
said, and I receive it as such.

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So I'm glad that you caught it
the way I meant it. So

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to situate this conversation for our listeners, I want you to all understand that

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I'm originally from Oregon, which is
a state that's known for environmentalism. I

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of course live here in Texas,
but I also have the opportunity in nineteen

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ninety two word of living in Rio
de Janeiro to be part of the ninety

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two Real Earth Summit that the United
Nations Conference on Environmental and Development had convened,

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and I got to see nations from
all over the world come together and

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work on this notion of how do
we how do we address the problems of

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the environment. So at the time, I was doing my master's degree,

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and so I focused my thesis on
the political, economic, and so full

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factors confuting to the Amazon Amazonian deforestation. So I do certainly care about the

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environment and sustainability in the world,
and I also really care about consciousness,

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which is how I want to situate
this conversation. So with that, Swatti,

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that's one of the many reasons I
wanted to have you on. I

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got so much from the various works
that you've done in the world already,

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I'm thrilled to have you. Thank
you so much. Else it's great to

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be on. So when I'm out
speaking to audiences Swatti, So often I

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pose the question to two audiences,
and what will you do with your one

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precious life? And as I really
got present to the work that you were

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doing in the world, it really
strikes me you are really doing something with

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your one precious life. You have
at least I would guess another fifty years

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in you, and you've already done
so much. And so what I'm interested

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in knowing is what are you pouring
yourself in today? What do you really

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stand for? What do you really
care about today? So, right now,

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at present, I work. I'm
still a conservation journalist. That's who

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I've been from the beginning. That's
the foundation of everything that I do.

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But I have worn different hats.
I've been an author, I've been a

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documentary filmmaker. But right now I
work for the Sea Change Project. And

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the Sea Change Project is a not
for profit organization. It essentially works for

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ocean conservation, essentially for the long
term conservation of the Great African sea Forest,

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which is the wonderful habitat that is
showcased in the film My Octopus Teacher.

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So our big first step as the
Sea Change Project was to firstly come

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to the realization that people not just
around the world but in Cape Town did

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not really know what the Kelp Forest
was all about or what it was even

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like, and so that there was
a lack of awareness. There's not that

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much science around Kelp Forest. A
few fantastic scientists working, but not made

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that public. And for us,
the Great African Sea Forest, which is

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what we've named our Kelp Forests,
which is right here, there's unbelievable wilderness

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on our doorstep, inspires us every
day. We're in the water every day.

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There's all these extraordinary animals, there's
extraordinary ecosystem. It's it's like an

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underwater forest. You know, think
of a forest on land with all the

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animals and birds and imagine it full
water. That is exactly what the Great

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Africancy Forest is beneath the waves.
So that's what Sea Change is focused on

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working on. We're also working towards
a global alliance to try and bring attention

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to help forests around the world.
So that's the sort of trajectory I'm on

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right now. It's so beautiful.
I definitely got very present to that by

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watching My Octopus Teacher eight times,
by the way, and I keep going

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back because there's just so much more
to learn from it, and I will

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continue to watch it, and I
keep telling everybody who will listen to me,

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you need to watch this film.
It's amazing. But I want to

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start first with your book says it's
so beautiful, and I loved how you

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wrote about each of the chapters,
and starting with the you know, the

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core predator, but you wrote chapters
on tigers, lions, and leopards,

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And by the way, leopards have
always been incredibly alluring to me. They're

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just so graceful and strong and intelligent, and I just loved how you really

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brought us into them to understand that
it was beautiful. And I also,

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of course, being who I am, I'm a social scientist and a meeting

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a work researcher, and I love
how you feature your uncle Siddharth and your

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father as your early initiators of your
love and stewarding of nature, and so

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to me, it really showcases the
powerful route through which we can find our

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purpose earlier in life, through our
passion and people who will help us nurture

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that. But I'm only deducing here
that this is actually your purpose. You

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may actually say it differently. How
do you consider how would you articulate your

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purpose. So I was very lucky
that my father took the time to spend

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that much time with me in wilderness, and his best friend, who was

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an ornithologist, my uncle Siddharth,
took so much time to spend with me,

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you know, taking me into the
wild, and it was really between

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the two of them that I learned
how to be happy in the wild and

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learned that that is my original home, that that is the home that I

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belong to, that all of us
belong to. And it was such a

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defining, inspiring, joyous thing for
me as a child, and that's what's

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sort of driven me all this while. So if I have a purpose,

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it would possibly be to be able
to share with people just how much joy

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and purpose and passion nature actually brings
to each of us and what it means

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to be deeply immersed or reconnected with
nature in a meaningful way. And I

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think that today, especially in the
world that we live in, sort of

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in this urban environment, sort of
surrounded by technology, you trapped in our

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these fast paced lives where we're just
trying to get ahead and do things,

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and everything is commercial and capitalistic,
and you know, it's all about getting

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ahead and getting ahead and getting ahead. I think we've kind of forgotten that

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we are the human animal, that
we are nature, and that this biosphere

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is our home, and that everything
that we think we're so clever about,

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all this technology that we've created,
these systems that we've both these belief systems

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in terms of faith and philosophy that
we've created, the definitions we give ourselves,

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all of it is built on a
foundation of nature, because that is

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who we are. And for me, the amount of peace and well being,

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good health, mental well being,
just joy and inspiration and hope that

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nature gives me every single day,
you know, to me, it's very

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important to be able to share that
with people in order to at least get

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people to look around at the world
around them, even if it's just twenty

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minutes to thirty minutes a week,
even but to have that much meaningful connection

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with that world that birthed you,
that actually nurtures you. Right now,

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the only reason that we survive,
you know, every we breathe, every

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bit of food that we eat,
every sip of water that we take comes

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from the natural world around us.
And to kind of understand that very primal

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connection that we have with nature,
So I would say that that would be

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my purpose is to be able to
always sort of tell these stories so more

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people can really reach out and reconnect
in a big way. Yeah, it

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is profoundly beautiful, Swatty, And
you know in the work that I do

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helping people to recognize that through our
unique lens of purpose, we can see

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things and do things that no one
else can see or do. And it

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really I really so see how literally
focused your perspective, your lens is on

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the world. That opens something really
special and dynamics, certainly in me,

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which is why I wanted to have
you on the program and share share you

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with my listeners across the world.
You have a very very specific lens that

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has been developed over the course of
your life that is really specific, and

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it opens something for the rest of
us that we couldn't do without you.

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Well, I you know, to
me, it's kind of like I don't

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know if I did it consciously.
So it's not like I woke up one

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morning and realized that this is what's
important and this is what I had to

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do. As I said, I
was very very lucky that it flowed organically,

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because before I could define many other
things. I knew nature. I

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was all of three or even maybe
younger when I started being taken out into

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nature, and I think that is
also very key. It's it's, you

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know, getting children into nature,
to get children to understand how important this

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world is around them, because you
know, every child, and I say

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this all the time, every single
child that is born in this planet is

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born wild. That's why I called
my show Born Wild. We are all

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born wild, and that act of
birthing, we are as wild as any

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wild animal that is born. You
could be born in a hospital, technology

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could help your mother deliver you.
You could even be a baby formed in

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a test tube. It doesn't matter. The birthing process is one of the

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wildest processes that there still are,
and when you come out as that baby,

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you're as wild as anything else.
It's life, and it's the rules

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that we've made, and it's the
roles that we choose that domesticates us in

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a sense and takes that wildness away. And I think that's such a loss

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to who we are as humans.
And I think it's this great nature disconnect.

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Some great authors have called it the
sort of the nature deficiency disorder.

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You know, I find that that
is perhaps one of the biggest reasons for

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why as humans today across the board, across the planet, there is so

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much fracture, so much anxiety,
so much depression, so much uncertainty,

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fear. It's because we've lost sight
of what is our original design, this

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beautiful feedback loop that we had with
this wild world around us, a world

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that basically opened up and said you
belong, this is your home. You

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know. It's like the philosopher J. Krishnamurthy who influenced me in Rishi Valley

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and then through my life because as
you would have read in the book,

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my father and uncle Sadat were also
very much into the Chrishnamurthy philosophy. One

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of the very profound things that he
talks about is how the fundamentals of violence,

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for example, starts and the way
we define ourselves. So the minute

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I stand up and I say I'm
an Indian woman Hindu, you know,

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doing this or doing that, or
of brown skin and all of it,

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all that language is the precursor to
violence. Because when I'm doing that,

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what I'm doing is I'm othering everything
else that is out there in the world.

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And the minute that othering begins,
the violence begins, and Christians.

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She would always say that that kind
of definition and holding out identity, having

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a needing that identity, came from
this disconnect that we have with nature.

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Because if one thing nature teaches you
is that we're all children of this planet,

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We're all born wild. It doesn't
matter what race, what religion,

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what creed, what philosophy, what
cast what country, anything that we belong

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to. We are phylum cordata,
class mammalia, kingdom, and amalia.

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We are the human animal. So
no nation states, no nation borders,

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no color, caste, race,
nothing, nobody can tell you that you

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do not belong because you belong.
This is your home. You are nature.

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And I think that very very strong
fundamental essence that you get, that

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sense of deep belonging that gives you
such a foundation in roots. I think

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it's incredibly crucial to have that,
and it worries me when children today don't

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have that, and certainly adults don't
seem to take the time out to look

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for it me as well, which
is a big reason I wanted to have

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you on Swatty Time for a short
break. I'm your host, doctor Lease

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Cortez. We've been on the Swati
Thiagarajan. She's a conservationist, documentary filmmaker,

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and environmental journalist. We've been talking
a bit about how she got into

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this conservationist space after the record.
To learn more about her documentary The Animal

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Communicator, and also her book Born
Wild, stay with this we'll be right

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back. Doctor Release Cortez is a
management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose and

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inspirational speaker and author. She helps
companies visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and

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develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused
cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance, and

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commitment within the workforce. To learn
more or to invite a lease to speak

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to your organization, please visit her
at a Lease Cortez dot com. Let's

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talk about how to get your employees
working on purpose. This is working on

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Purpose with doctor Elise Cortez. To
reach our program today or open a conversation

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with Elise, send an email to
Elise ali Se at Elise Cortez dot com.

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Now back to working on Purpose.
Thanks for staying with us, and

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welcome back to working on Purpose.
If you're just joining the program, my

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guest is Swadithia Garajan. She's a
conservationist, documentary filmmaker, environmental journalist.

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She is the associate producer of the
Oscar winning documentary My Octopus Teacher and also

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produced The Animal Communicator featuring Anna Brightenbach, who is an interspecies communicator. To

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Judge today from Cape Town, South
Africa, I'm your host, doctor Elise

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Cortez. So as we continue on
here, Swatty, this is such a

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great conversation, exactly what I wanted. By the way, I want to

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present some of the things that you
that I got from your book, because

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as you know, I read it
cover to cover, I take great notes.

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But one of the things that I
took from it that I thought was

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so crisp is something that you wrote
eloquently about your uncle's sort of who said

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for the mirror of his end,
he said, nature is not for the

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faint of heart. It is for
those who want their hearts filled, shaken

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and changed. That is so beautiful. Yeah. He would always tell me

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that looking at nature was sort of
like understanding yourself a lot better. So

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that connection loop is incredibly important.
And the reason why he would say that

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it's not for the faint of heart
is because, as I said, when

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you're in nature and you spend the
kind of immersive time in nature in a

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meaningful way, it kind of holds
up a mirror to who you are.

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So firstly you have to acknowledge who
you are. You see a lot of

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things that you may not have seen
clearly, so they could be preconceived notions

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about yourself that will change, preconceived
notions about the world that will change.

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Preconceived notions that you have about other
people in the world. That will change

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because what nature shows you is you
in your roast form and life in its

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rowst form, and the fact that
life is precious and it's beautiful, and

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it's everywhere, and that everything is
part of this one big, throbbing source

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of life, which means we are
all connected and we're all one. And

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if in your head you've had notions
of individualism, or you have notions of

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as people might in terms of how
they indoctrinated, in terms of thinking their

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religion is better than someone else's,
or their belief system is better than someone

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else's, or that their race is
more superior, or that what they're doing

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is more important, or any of
that, Nature will shatter those illusions because

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in the face of nature. All
you are is just yet another being in

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this massive web that comes together to
form life. And so it's really so

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that's what he used to mean.
Why not for the faint of heart.

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It was almost like, can you
stand up and find your truth? And

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you know, can you find your
original truth? And the way to find

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your original truth is by being in
nature a lot. And the other thing

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nature does is when you spend time
in nature, when you feel life all

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around you, and you see life
all around you. You see birth,

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you see death, you see hunting, you see growth, you see new

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leads, you see new plants,
you see dyeing trees, you see a

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baby bird being born. So much
happening all around you. It fills you

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with hope. It also fills you
with a deep sense of connection and empathy.

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And once that empathy is awakened in
you, it's the connection is not

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you don't just feel it for the
animals and the wild or the natural systems,

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but you start feeling it for fellow
human beings, and that empathy just

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flows. It's natural. That is
something that nature gives you. And I

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think that that's what he meant by
your heart being shaken and opened and changed

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and challenged. So it's a kind
of courage to be able to step into

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those spaces and say that you know
you want that change, you want to

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open yourself up for that. Yeah, oh that was so much better than

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what I just took from the book. Thank you for adding that in.

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There's one of that was gorgeous.
That whole other level there for me.

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And you're right, you know,
one of the reasons I wanted to have

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you on is because I do feel
I share your sentiment that people are missing

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the opportunity to connect with nature,
and they're missing that essential feedback mechanism in

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that sense that they're part of something
much bigger than themselves. So this notion

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of reconnecting is important. You do
that all across your life and all your

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twenty plus years experiences at an in
DTV. But for those of us who

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don't have that spigot immediately available to
you, the backyard that you live in,

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for example, what kind of a
perspective, what would you offer to

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the rest of us who are living
in these cement cities. What is astonishing,

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firstly is to understand that even if
you're living in a cemens city,

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in your trapped between four walls.
All the air that you're breathing is still

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coming from the fact that there is
a biodiverse ecosystem out there that's created this

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biosphere that enables for you to breathe, that enables you to live. All

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the food that comes into your house, it's produced by insects and bees and

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butterflies and birds and little animals that
go around spreading seeds and you know,

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allowing for agriculture to thrive, allowing
for fruits to thrive, vegetables, whatever

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it is that you eat, it's
all coming from the natural world. Even

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if you're opening a tap for water, it's not invented by the tap,

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it's not invented by technology. That
water is coming from this planet around you,

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you know, and that water.
What I love about water is when

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it rains, for example, every
time it rains, what it reminds me

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of is the fact that and this
I mean living in a city, you

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can step out of your house and
still feel and see rain. And next

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time you feel rain, just that
this is not new water. It's not

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new water that is falling out of
the sky. It's the same water that

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has existed since the formation of this
earth. When the gas is cooled and

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they became the oceans. It is
evaporation from the oceans that feeds the lakes

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and rivers that goes back into the
seeds. There's eternal cycle of water.

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So when that raindrop hits you,
it's the same raindrop that could have hit

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a dinosaur and gone down its neck. It's the same water drop that could

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fall or be exhaled out by a
blue whale. It's the same water drop

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that you know could have fallen down
ancient plants and leaves millions of years in

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the past, even before humans or
human like species, where we weren't even

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planned by nature or by the planet
at that time. But it's the same

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water. That is how intrinsic and
interconnected the whole system is. So to

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just even understand that, and then
you'll be surprised when you decide to do

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anything that takes a little bit of
things, in a little bit of meaningful

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practice, just how much nature there
actually is and what we think is a

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concrete city around us. You know, there's still trees and parts of the

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city. There's still green areas and
parts of the city, even if it's

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just one tree in your neighborhood.
That tree is still drawing water out of

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the soil that it's stuck in.
It's still growing, the leaves are still

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reaching out to the sky. It
is still photosynthesizing, it is still converting

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carbon into oxygen. You know,
it could be an evergreen tree, which

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means it's you know, in the
middle of winter, it could still be

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green, or it could be a
decidus tree. And maybe you noticed in

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the fall that it colors, the
leaves change color, and that in winter

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it drops all of its leads.
You get to know the life of this

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tree, and maybe watching that tree
allows you to see what birds come to

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that tree, or what insects go
up and down the tree trunk, or

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what lives in the soil that the
tree is standing in. So once that

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you open yourself up to that and
you start sort of really looking at life

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around you and not separate to you, seeing that you are part of that

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life around you. Automatically, when
that curiosity gets kindled, and slowly you'll

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find yourself seeking more. So this
bigot in a sense, would be that

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open up that curiosity, you know, turn that on for yourself, find

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it so to me, it's distressing
that children today will recognize or see more

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cars in one lifetime than they will
animals. Children will recognize five brands more,

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you know, better than they will
five birds. Children will recognize five

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celebrities more than they will five plants. So five you know, anything that's

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natural around them. So what if
that became the challenge. What if for

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the next year you decided to find
five trees in your city, five plants

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in your city, five birds in
your city, five insects in your city,

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five animals in your city, because
suddenly your city will what you've always

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thought of as home will be so
much more than just home, you know,

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because all of this is what becomes
or adds to what makes you feel

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like you belong, no matter where
you are, where you could have come

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from, or where you could have
settled down. It's that it's that deep

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recognition that makes you feel like you
belong. So it's that it's making that

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effort. It does take a little
bit of effort, you know, you

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can't just even for me. I
may have been taken into nature as a

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child, and I was very very
privileged and lucky that that happened. I'm

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still very privileged and lucky that I
have this wilderness on my doorstep. I

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completely understand there are people around the
world who struggle for so much, from

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you know, just putting food on
the table for their children, all the

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way through to keeping jobs or losing
jobs or livelihoods. And I understand that

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it's a massive, massive challenge.
And it's so much easier for me to

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talk about these things because I don't
have those challenges, and I am completely

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aware of that and respectful of that, and I understand stand the privilege that

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allows me to be saying these things. But even within that challenge, for

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your own self, for your own
mental, spiritual, and physical well being,

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take that curiosity, take that time, take that mindfulness, because it's

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incredibly, incredibly important. M oh
Swatty. I was going to actually read

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something from your book because I think
that what your right is so eloquent and

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so artistic and so colorful. But
the way you just spoke is the way

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you're right. So never mind,
I'm not going to read anything. It's

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just you already said it out loud. It's beautiful. Thank you. I

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want You're welcome. You're welcome,
so great to have you here. So

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I want to talk next something about
something you write in your book that I

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think is it's astoundibly important to talk
about. And this is something that you

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talk about in a great lesson that
you learn through the sloth bearers and the

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temptation to make the other the problem. I think this is so important,

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and so if you would, if
you will share with us the dilemma of

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conservation and distinguish lifestyle from livelihood and
when it comes to involving the locals,

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especially in conservation efforts. So one
of the sort of I find the big

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tragedies I would say in the modern
world that we live in is what I

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call actually what other scholars have called
and I and I especially love love the

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word. It's it's an epistemicide.
So it starts there. We've kind of

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murdered, in a sense, indigenous
knowledge and indigenous wisdoms. We are so

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caught up in how our education works, and how we are modern thinking humans,

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and how our science works and all
of this. We think everything we're

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talking about is some modern new discovery, when actually all of it is rooted

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and embedded in deep indigenous wisdoms.
And I think that not crediting those indigenous

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wisdoms, discrediting indigenous lives, livelihoods, belief systems has great detriment really,

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I feel to human progress, the
way we live actually and what we're doing

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to our to the world around us, that sustains us. So that's that

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would be the that that is something
that always I keep in mind. So

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when I in India, especially when
I spend time in wilderness, and I

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spend time with a lot of our
tribal communities, and I spend time with

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a lot of local, very very
poor communities that seemed to from my very

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privileged, educated lifestyle, seemed to
be leading a primitive life in a sense,

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or a cruel life, because if
you take the sloth bears, as

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I spoke about, it's a group
of people, one community called the Colndars,

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who use these bears as dancing bears, and they would, you know,

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make these bears dance. And it
was ironically tourists from around the world

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who would watch these dancing bears and
put money in the hat, if you

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will. And it's a it's a
very difficult life for the bears because a

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lot of them are removed from their
mothers when they comes from the wild,

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so it's a kind of poaching.
Then they are taken into these human households,

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and because they grow to become really
big animals that could be quite aggressive

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and violent, their teeth get taken
out, their claws get cut. The

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rope that's in their nose is like
a wound that never heals. So when

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the rope isn't there and they tug
on that rope, the pain actually makes

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them respond. So they're dancing because
they're being handled by that rope. But

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this so from you know, just
by when I'm saying all of this,

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I'm sure for a lot of people, they're thinking, oh my god,

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that sounds horrible. It sounds like
the animal is being tortured, and you

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know, how can this practice be? And that's what I thought when I

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initially saw it. It was when
I spent time with the family, and

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the whole perspective flipped because I saw
the elderly gentleman of the family share his

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food with his bear, and I
knew that that family was pretty much going

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hungry three times a day and they
barely had any food to feed themselves,

401
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and whatever they had, they're shared
with their bear. They love that bear

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in their own way. In my
very comfortable life, the way I will

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look after my dog. You know, for me, everything that's happening to

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the bear is horrible. But their
lives are so hard, so challenging,

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so cruel in a human way,
that the capacity that they have to love

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the bear has to be seen from
that level of survival. So they're not

407
00:30:18.839 --> 00:30:22.839
inherently cruel. They don't plan to
be, you know, hurting that animal.

408
00:30:22.920 --> 00:30:26.799
They'll be shocked if you tell them
that you think that they've been cruel

409
00:30:26.680 --> 00:30:33.119
to their animal. And I can
attach to that only because the minute this

410
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:38.240
community had the opportunity to give up
their bears for a better life where they

411
00:30:38.240 --> 00:30:41.799
could then start some other profession and
they could send their children to school,

412
00:30:41.839 --> 00:30:47.839
and they could potentially come out of
this four hundred year tradition of having dancing

413
00:30:47.839 --> 00:30:52.039
bears, most of them voluntarily handed
in their bears to that better life so

414
00:30:52.119 --> 00:30:55.480
that they could do something else.
Because when you can't feed your child,

415
00:30:55.960 --> 00:31:00.599
it's very very difficult to think beyond
that. It's very easy for me to

416
00:31:00.640 --> 00:31:03.559
point my finger and go, oh, this person is exploiting the environment this

417
00:31:03.599 --> 00:31:07.960
way, or that person is cutting
trees down. Oh, this person is

418
00:31:07.960 --> 00:31:11.440
doing that. But that's because I
don't have to worry about my next meal.

419
00:31:11.480 --> 00:31:15.319
There are communities around the world whose
entire survival comes down to what they

420
00:31:15.359 --> 00:31:19.920
have to do. And that is
what I call a livelihood challenge. My

421
00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:23.720
life which I think, I'm so
compassionate and I'm so kind, and I

422
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:29.559
feel so badly for all of these
animals. My life is the lifestyle challenge,

423
00:31:29.720 --> 00:31:33.400
and it's my life that's caused eighty
percent of the problems on this planet.

424
00:31:33.720 --> 00:31:37.160
The roads that we build, the
linear projects through forests, the habitat

425
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:41.079
that we've cleared, the steel and
mind that we mind, for the coal

426
00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:45.640
that we mind, for the electricity
that we use, the flying around the

427
00:31:45.680 --> 00:31:48.799
world that we do. You know, the way that we eat food that

428
00:31:48.839 --> 00:31:53.240
could be flown from thousands of miles
away and packaged in terrible packaging that comes

429
00:31:53.240 --> 00:31:56.160
to me just because it's convenient and
I'm not going to look for an alternative.

430
00:31:57.200 --> 00:32:00.720
You know, all of this stuff
all the time. Technology that I

431
00:32:00.839 --> 00:32:05.160
use that is powered by batteriies,
that uses rare metals that come from rainforests

432
00:32:05.160 --> 00:32:07.400
that are being destroyed so that I
can get on my phone. It's my

433
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:14.599
lifestyle, my consumerist lifestyle, that's
actually the problem. Livelihood has solutions.

434
00:32:14.640 --> 00:32:17.960
If someone is doing something just to
survive, you can find a solution for

435
00:32:19.000 --> 00:32:22.920
that. If someone is doing something
because it's convenient and it's a luxury statement,

436
00:32:23.000 --> 00:32:28.920
that's a much harder beast to actually
deal with because it means me making

437
00:32:29.079 --> 00:32:34.480
a conscious choice and changing who I
am to change my lifestyle, and that's

438
00:32:34.599 --> 00:32:39.039
always the bigger challenge. And local
communities do what they have to do simply

439
00:32:39.039 --> 00:32:43.279
because they're trying to survive. And
in most parts of the world, and

440
00:32:43.319 --> 00:32:49.559
this has been proven by science,
most of the most extraordinary biodiverse habitats that

441
00:32:49.599 --> 00:32:52.880
we have are still in indigenous lands, not even in protected lands. So

442
00:32:53.119 --> 00:32:58.559
there's notion that there is someone other
like I point my finger and go he

443
00:32:58.839 --> 00:33:02.079
or she is the problem about doing
that and going I am part of this

444
00:33:02.160 --> 00:33:07.200
problem, and you know I need
to step up and change first, and

445
00:33:07.240 --> 00:33:10.519
then you know we can work together
to try and change things. So this

446
00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:15.839
is a very important, big realization
that came to me through the course of

447
00:33:15.880 --> 00:33:20.920
my work as a journalist. Is
this notion that I had of me being

448
00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:25.599
a conservationist and saving the world.
It's so arrogant because you know, that

449
00:33:25.680 --> 00:33:30.640
precludes the idea that I am part
of the problem, and I constantly am

450
00:33:30.640 --> 00:33:35.079
blaming someone else for it, and
that just doesn't work. So yeah,

451
00:33:35.279 --> 00:33:39.240
I really feel that this is a
very very important thing for most people to

452
00:33:39.319 --> 00:33:44.319
know. Eighty percent of the problems
on this planet are in terms of climate

453
00:33:44.400 --> 00:33:47.359
change, in terms of all the
big challenges that we have is seventy companies.

454
00:33:49.119 --> 00:33:52.960
But we're all so busy pointing fingers
at each other and fighting with each

455
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:58.480
other and doing all of this that
we forget that we can come together and

456
00:33:58.680 --> 00:34:02.200
fight with our wallets and vote with
our wallets and without opinions and change life

457
00:34:02.240 --> 00:34:07.000
for the better and do something about
it. So I think it's this lifestyle

458
00:34:07.000 --> 00:34:12.639
and livelihood was a very very important
thing for me to understand. Yeah,

459
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:15.159
I completely agree, which is why
I wanted you to talk about it.

460
00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:19.280
That was incredibly important, and it
also showcases what I would say is both

461
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:23.880
empathy and consciousness. I willingness to
step way above these issues and separate the

462
00:34:24.119 --> 00:34:28.039
wheat from the chaff, if you
will. And I just really thought was

463
00:34:28.119 --> 00:34:30.800
I could not let you not talk
about that, So thank you for that.

464
00:34:30.840 --> 00:34:34.199
Swatty time for a short break.
I'm your host, doctor Release Cortez.

465
00:34:34.320 --> 00:34:37.679
We've been on the air with Swati
Thiagarjan, a conservationist, documentary filmmaker,

466
00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:43.000
and environmental journalist. She's the associate
producer of the Oscar winning documentary My

467
00:34:43.119 --> 00:34:46.320
Octopus Teacher, and also produced The
Animal Communicator featuring Anna Brightenbach, who was

468
00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:52.360
an interspecies communicator. We've been talking
about her perspective on conservation. After the

469
00:34:52.360 --> 00:34:53.960
break, we're going to hear more
about My Octopus Teacher the film. She

470
00:34:54.039 --> 00:34:58.639
is an associate producer. Let stay
with us, We're right back. Doctor

471
00:34:58.639 --> 00:35:04.760
Release Cortez is a man consultant specializing
in meaning and purpose and inspirational speaker and

472
00:35:04.800 --> 00:35:10.039
author. She helps companies visioneer for
greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired

473
00:35:10.119 --> 00:35:16.679
leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate
fulfillment, performance, and commitment within the

474
00:35:16.719 --> 00:35:22.239
workforce. To learn more or to
invite a lease to speak to your organization,

475
00:35:22.599 --> 00:35:25.400
please visit her at Elise Cortez dot
com. Let's talk about how to

476
00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:37.000
get your employees working on purpose.
This is working on Purpose with doctor Elise

477
00:35:37.079 --> 00:35:42.880
Cortez. To reach our program today
or open a conversation with Elise, send

478
00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:50.519
an email to Elise Alis at Elise
Cortez dot Com. Now back to Working

479
00:35:50.519 --> 00:35:59.440
on Purpose. Thanks for staying with
us, and welcome back to Working on

480
00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:02.920
Purpose if you're just joining the program
today. My guest is Swadiagarajan. She

481
00:36:04.079 --> 00:36:07.280
is a core member of the Sea
Change Project in South Africa and an environmental

482
00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:10.840
editor at the Indian television network called
in DTV. She's the author of the

483
00:36:10.840 --> 00:36:15.000
book Born Wild Journeys into the Wild
Hearts of India and Africa. To joined

484
00:36:15.039 --> 00:36:19.039
Janey from Cape Town, South Africa. I'm your host, doctor Elis Cortez,

485
00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:22.440
So now I have to tell you. Of course you already know this

486
00:36:22.440 --> 00:36:24.440
book because we had this great conversation. But the whole reason we're even sitting

487
00:36:24.519 --> 00:36:30.199
together here, Swatty, is that
I found my Octopus teacher last fall thanks

488
00:36:30.199 --> 00:36:32.119
to a friend who know, who
knows all about meeting and purpose. I

489
00:36:32.199 --> 00:36:35.440
watched it and then I watched it
again. I thought, this is so

490
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.880
amazing. I was having at that
time conversations with a woman named Elie Tahar

491
00:36:39.079 --> 00:36:44.599
in New Zealand. She and I
began speaking sometime we wore during the pandemic,

492
00:36:44.639 --> 00:36:46.440
and she is just amazing. She's
the founder of the Conscious Trader in

493
00:36:46.440 --> 00:36:50.599
New Zealand, and I told her, I have you Have you seen this

494
00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:52.639
film? And she's like, yes, I have. It's amazing. And

495
00:36:52.639 --> 00:36:53.880
I said, I want to talk
with somebody from that organization. It's so

496
00:36:53.920 --> 00:36:57.320
amazing. I want to somehow connect
to bring it to the world. And

497
00:36:57.360 --> 00:37:00.239
she said, true, Elie fashion, let me see what I do.

498
00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:02.679
And she finds you, and she
finds you and the three of us have

499
00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:07.960
this great conversation one Saturday morning ten
am my time in Dallas that afternoon whenever

500
00:37:08.000 --> 00:37:13.199
it was six gam or so your
time in South Africa the next morning on

501
00:37:13.239 --> 00:37:16.119
Sunday in New Zealand and talk about
this and I think it's just so amazing.

502
00:37:16.199 --> 00:37:20.360
Right, So that's how this whole
magic happened. So thank you again,

503
00:37:20.519 --> 00:37:23.079
Ellie Tohr. So when we go
to the film, I told you

504
00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:27.400
when we first met that one of
the big things that I keep going back

505
00:37:27.400 --> 00:37:30.400
to this film so why there's so
much in it, there's so much to

506
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:32.519
take from it, is I keep
going back and as I said, I've

507
00:37:32.559 --> 00:37:37.000
seen it eight times now and I'll
continue watching it. But the thing that

508
00:37:37.039 --> 00:37:39.679
I took away first and foremost is
that our natural world. For me,

509
00:37:39.760 --> 00:37:45.519
this is what I got is our
spirituality it's really our ultimate religion in many

510
00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:49.559
ways. And I don't remember what
you and I talked about when I brought

511
00:37:49.199 --> 00:37:52.239
that point to you, but would
you comment on that perspective and if that's

512
00:37:52.280 --> 00:37:54.880
at all close to what you were
trying to showcase or how it lands for

513
00:37:54.920 --> 00:38:01.920
you. So I think, clearly, what's the film? It was kind

514
00:38:01.920 --> 00:38:07.639
of like taking what we really wanted
to showcase was connection, and I think

515
00:38:07.679 --> 00:38:15.159
we wanted to showcase love, and
we wanted to showcase how that love and

516
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:20.119
connection in nature, all three together
can save your life, save your health

517
00:38:21.639 --> 00:38:24.000
the way you are because as I
said, there's this whole idea of the

518
00:38:24.079 --> 00:38:27.679
nature's mirror. You know, it
holds up this mirror to you. And

519
00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:31.760
I think so through Craig's personal journey
when he was going through the challenges that

520
00:38:31.800 --> 00:38:37.360
he was going through with burnout and
anxiety and depression and not feeling at that

521
00:38:37.440 --> 00:38:39.119
time, because you feel so exhausted
when you're going through those things, and

522
00:38:39.119 --> 00:38:43.159
you feel very shut down and you
feel like you can't like you're in this

523
00:38:43.280 --> 00:38:47.599
gray space and you can't really reach
out and do things, and I think

524
00:38:47.599 --> 00:38:52.679
it, you know, he for
him at that time, it was important

525
00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:58.400
to be able to recharge and reconnect, especially with his family that was me

526
00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:00.960
and my son, especially his son. And you know, because he had

527
00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:06.039
this great relationship with his kid,
but in that time, that in that

528
00:39:06.079 --> 00:39:07.239
time and he was feeling what he
was feeling, he didn't feel like he

529
00:39:07.280 --> 00:39:12.920
could be a great father, and
I think also not feeling that well physically,

530
00:39:13.079 --> 00:39:15.840
and to be able to go into
that environment, to be able to

531
00:39:15.880 --> 00:39:17.880
be in that cold water, and
then to have the experiences that he had,

532
00:39:17.920 --> 00:39:21.840
and then to have that relationship with
the octopus, it just it changed

533
00:39:21.880 --> 00:39:24.559
his life. It changed all our
lives, and it changed how we look

534
00:39:24.639 --> 00:39:29.320
to the world because then the big
question you have to ask yourself is if

535
00:39:29.360 --> 00:39:34.079
a human can fall in love with
a mollusk and a moleusk can trust a

536
00:39:34.159 --> 00:39:38.119
human, then what other wonderful things
are actually possible, you know, in

537
00:39:38.159 --> 00:39:42.920
life and in the world. And
in a way, I guess if you

538
00:39:43.000 --> 00:39:46.159
looked at religion, and a religion
is something that is just that gives you

539
00:39:46.199 --> 00:39:53.039
a certain mental and spiritual strength,
that gives you a kind of shining thread

540
00:39:53.119 --> 00:39:59.079
to hold on to in the middle
of what is a pretty chaotic world we've

541
00:39:59.119 --> 00:40:04.400
created around ourselves and a pretty chaotic
time that we are in right now with

542
00:40:04.440 --> 00:40:08.599
this pandemic, and if it can
give you that foundation, if we can

543
00:40:08.639 --> 00:40:13.199
bring you a certain level of comfort, if it can make you believe that

544
00:40:13.239 --> 00:40:17.880
things will be okay and that life
will go on and that you just need

545
00:40:17.920 --> 00:40:22.599
to have faith and step forward.
If religion can do that for you,

546
00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:24.880
then if you equate that with what
nature does for you, I think it's

547
00:40:24.880 --> 00:40:30.480
pretty similar, because that's really what
nature does is it always fills you with

548
00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:34.559
possibilities. It always shows you that
no matter what life finds a way,

549
00:40:34.679 --> 00:40:38.239
it always shows you that there's so
much that is out there that is so

550
00:40:38.320 --> 00:40:43.559
much bigger than you and beyond you. But yet you're still a very important

551
00:40:43.760 --> 00:40:46.239
part of it. So it's not
separate to you, you know. So

552
00:40:46.280 --> 00:40:50.400
again we come back to that sense
of belonging, that sense of connection,

553
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:55.239
that sense of knowing that this is
home and that you know, as as

554
00:40:55.280 --> 00:41:00.599
as bad as things get, we
still have a chance to fix things to

555
00:41:00.800 --> 00:41:05.159
make it better, uh, you
know, to come together to do something

556
00:41:05.519 --> 00:41:10.519
in order to just make life for
future generations better. Yeah. So I

557
00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:15.039
think that's that's really what the film
was very much trying to say, was

558
00:41:15.239 --> 00:41:21.440
that wild places and wild animals are
precious, that this is your true design

559
00:41:21.480 --> 00:41:27.880
and true home and that you belong
and that connection love is really as cliche

560
00:41:27.960 --> 00:41:31.480
as it sounds, the best way
forward. Yeah, yeah, I got

561
00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:34.920
all of that. It's so beautiful. And the other thing that I got

562
00:41:34.920 --> 00:41:37.679
to that you're that I think you're
speaking to but again I don' want to

563
00:41:37.679 --> 00:41:40.000
put words in your mouth. Is
what I also got from watching your husband

564
00:41:40.000 --> 00:41:44.800
Craig interact with it with the octopus
and really just tell her story and help

565
00:41:44.840 --> 00:41:49.159
us understand her. Is I got
this beautiful, tender interdependence that we all

566
00:41:49.199 --> 00:41:52.519
have together and maybe that's a connection
you're talking about. And actually ultimately this

567
00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:58.039
this large ultimate intelligence of the universe
that we all are part of and that

568
00:41:58.079 --> 00:42:01.679
we we are impact to buy and
now we also impact and effect. That

569
00:42:01.840 --> 00:42:07.320
was also very present for me.
No, absolutely, so, you know,

570
00:42:07.480 --> 00:42:12.559
just just in my own life,
Like so when I'm in a really

571
00:42:12.599 --> 00:42:15.280
good space and I'm feeling strong and
healthy and I'm in a very good mental

572
00:42:15.320 --> 00:42:21.400
state and I'm out in nature,
it's it's that's what comes right back at

573
00:42:21.400 --> 00:42:24.000
me. You know, all of
the beauty, the wonder, the blooming

574
00:42:24.039 --> 00:42:28.800
flowers, the ocean, the water, the waves, the animals. I

575
00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:31.199
mean that that's what I feel.
And I see there are days when I'm

576
00:42:31.199 --> 00:42:37.199
not in that greater mood and I'm
not feeling so good and and I'm not

577
00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:40.679
feeling maybe physically world, and I
find it much harder to adapt to the

578
00:42:40.719 --> 00:42:45.360
cold and to be in circumstances that
may not be physically very comfortable. It

579
00:42:45.400 --> 00:42:47.800
could be raining, it could be
windy, it could be too hot,

580
00:42:49.639 --> 00:42:52.039
and those things sort of crowd into
my mind and I find it harder to

581
00:42:52.119 --> 00:42:57.159
be in the moment. But again, that's the beauty with nature, is

582
00:42:57.199 --> 00:43:00.599
that it she does to be there, and then you have to push yourself

583
00:43:00.679 --> 00:43:05.559
past those things, and then again
you come back to that reset and that

584
00:43:05.639 --> 00:43:10.239
healing, because to be in nature
is to be very very very present.

585
00:43:10.960 --> 00:43:16.000
You have to pay attention to this
moment. You cannot be caught up in

586
00:43:16.559 --> 00:43:21.920
stuff that's happened. You cannot be
projecting into stuff that's going to happen.

587
00:43:22.039 --> 00:43:24.760
You can't be running lists through your
head about what you're going to do today,

588
00:43:24.840 --> 00:43:28.639
or what tasks you have left,
or what deadlines you have to meet,

589
00:43:28.719 --> 00:43:30.920
or what challenges that there are,
or just in general, Oh my

590
00:43:30.960 --> 00:43:34.920
god, the world is a mess. If you do all of that,

591
00:43:36.760 --> 00:43:39.400
you're going to actually, in many
many situations, put yourself in danger.

592
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:44.840
So in the ocean, for example, I need to be absolutely connected to

593
00:43:44.920 --> 00:43:46.679
the waves, to the water,
to the animals that I'm seeing, to

594
00:43:46.760 --> 00:43:50.880
the forest that I'm in, and
I have to be completely one hundred percent

595
00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:57.920
engaged to be aware of my surroundings
and that kind of connection, that deep

596
00:43:58.079 --> 00:44:02.800
engagement where there's nothing else twing your
brain. It's a beautiful, beautiful flow.

597
00:44:02.840 --> 00:44:06.880
I guess it's what a lot of
people can do with meditation, for

598
00:44:06.920 --> 00:44:10.719
example, and for me it works
in nature in that way, in a

599
00:44:10.760 --> 00:44:15.880
more profound way, I feel like
in nature. So that is sort of

600
00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:21.199
like the connection that I'm talking about, which which is like it's it's so

601
00:44:21.360 --> 00:44:24.280
nurturing, it's so healing because even
if as I said, for fifteen minutes

602
00:44:24.280 --> 00:44:29.559
a day you can quiet everything else
that's going on with you and just be

603
00:44:29.719 --> 00:44:34.639
in the moment and just feel and
be present and be aware of your breath

604
00:44:34.679 --> 00:44:37.880
and your body and your skin and
what you're seeing in life around you,

605
00:44:38.920 --> 00:44:45.159
it is incredibly healing. Yeah,
And I wonder what you've taught me so

606
00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:50.119
much already, just in your book
and watching The Animal Communicator, answering my

607
00:44:50.119 --> 00:44:52.920
octopus teacher and you, I don't
think that you said in one of our

608
00:44:52.960 --> 00:44:55.559
conversations, or I guess the one
conversation we had is you use this what

609
00:44:55.599 --> 00:45:00.719
accreside to be a very alluring term
called biological sentience. And I wonder if

610
00:45:00.760 --> 00:45:05.039
that's partly what you're talking about here
too, this awareness and such. But

611
00:45:05.079 --> 00:45:09.000
I also wonder if it's if there's
something about this ability is untapped or maybe

612
00:45:09.840 --> 00:45:15.199
not usually spoken about ability for us
as beings to be able to understand,

613
00:45:15.239 --> 00:45:21.599
instance each other. I help us
understand this great phrase. So every thing,

614
00:45:22.079 --> 00:45:27.360
all life is sentience. All the
plants that we see, all the

615
00:45:27.440 --> 00:45:31.920
animals that we meet, everything is
deep sentience. It has deep sentience.

616
00:45:31.960 --> 00:45:37.719
So when I made my Animal Communicator, the movie The Animal Communicator, it

617
00:45:37.840 --> 00:45:40.639
was the extreme of what a human
can do with that sentience. You know,

618
00:45:40.679 --> 00:45:45.199
the way Anna is able to communicate
with animals directly and get messages back

619
00:45:45.239 --> 00:45:51.719
from them directly. That is the
extreme form of that sentience for a lot

620
00:45:51.760 --> 00:45:54.159
of us, unless we spend a
lot of time in wilderness and train and

621
00:45:54.280 --> 00:45:59.480
learn to trust our intuition and spend
the kind of time that Anna has spent

622
00:46:00.239 --> 00:46:05.559
in wilderness, her life dedicated doing
what she does. Of course, it's

623
00:46:05.559 --> 00:46:09.320
going to be much harder to either
believe in that level of direct communication or

624
00:46:09.360 --> 00:46:13.440
be able to do it even if
we believe, because it's all practice.

625
00:46:13.480 --> 00:46:16.280
At the end of the day,
you just get better with practice. But

626
00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:22.559
what is fact is the fact that
the sentience exists. You know that a

627
00:46:22.639 --> 00:46:27.639
tree when it's being nibbled on by
a giraffe, when it's being over nibbled

628
00:46:27.639 --> 00:46:30.679
on, for example, that will
automatically release stannin into its leaves to make

629
00:46:30.719 --> 00:46:35.679
the leaves bitter so that the giraffe
will stop eating it. Now, one

630
00:46:35.719 --> 00:46:37.840
tree doing that, you can say
it's a biological defense. What's that got

631
00:46:37.840 --> 00:46:42.280
to do with sentience? You know, that could be just survival mechanism built

632
00:46:42.280 --> 00:46:45.079
into the tree so it doesn't get
grazed down to a numb. But it's

633
00:46:45.079 --> 00:46:50.000
not just that one tree. Every
other tree in that line of trees in

634
00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:53.119
that grove, in that forest will
release stannin because they know the minute the

635
00:46:53.119 --> 00:46:57.159
giraffe stops eating on this one,
it's going to move to the next and

636
00:46:57.239 --> 00:47:00.559
the next, and they all release
stannin. How do they know fig trees

637
00:47:00.639 --> 00:47:07.239
you know in India, for example, that feed the hornbills in seasons where

638
00:47:07.239 --> 00:47:09.360
the rains aren't going to be enough
or it's going to be a dry season,

639
00:47:09.760 --> 00:47:15.079
the same tree of the same sexual
maturity, which should all be flowering

640
00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:19.719
and blooming and fruiting at the same
time, will stagger their fruiting so that

641
00:47:19.800 --> 00:47:23.239
the birds have enough food to eat
for the entire season. And the reason

642
00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:28.039
for that, of course, is
also biological, and that these are the

643
00:47:28.079 --> 00:47:30.239
birds that eat the fruit and then
disperse the seeds, so it's also the

644
00:47:30.239 --> 00:47:35.280
survival of the tree is built into
that. But how do they all know

645
00:47:35.440 --> 00:47:37.400
and how do they stagger it so
beautifully that some of them fruit now,

646
00:47:37.440 --> 00:47:40.119
and then the next lot fruit,
and then the next lot fruit. And

647
00:47:40.159 --> 00:47:43.679
the fact is that they do that
when they know there's going to be a

648
00:47:43.719 --> 00:47:49.239
struggle and not a very nourishing season
for them to fruit through the entire season

649
00:47:49.960 --> 00:47:52.639
without the good rains. How do
they know that these are trees? And

650
00:47:52.639 --> 00:47:57.400
then we know they are scientists who've
done wonderful work with the whole fungal network

651
00:47:57.440 --> 00:48:00.679
and the roots of tree systems,
hidden life of trees, you know,

652
00:48:00.719 --> 00:48:04.320
the mother tree and how she nourishes
trees around her. How trees around a

653
00:48:04.400 --> 00:48:07.199
dead and dying tree will continue feeding
nutrients to that tree to keep it alive.

654
00:48:07.599 --> 00:48:10.840
How by cutting one tree that we
think is just a tree in a

655
00:48:10.880 --> 00:48:14.800
grove, we could actually be killing
the grove if we've cut down the mother

656
00:48:14.840 --> 00:48:19.760
tree, who has all the knowledge
and all the intelligence and all the biological

657
00:48:19.800 --> 00:48:22.239
experience of three four hundred, five
hundred years that she might have lived in

658
00:48:22.280 --> 00:48:27.440
that forest. So it is,
and I'm talking and I'm mentioning trees a

659
00:48:27.440 --> 00:48:30.519
lot, because it's easier to believe, perhaps that animals are more sentient.

660
00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:35.360
Any one of us who've had cats, dogs, any pet, you know,

661
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:37.480
we know that there is a personality
there. We know that there is

662
00:48:37.519 --> 00:48:42.679
intelligence intelligence there. You can't deny
it. It just you know. So

663
00:48:42.719 --> 00:48:45.280
when I'm talking about trees, I'm
trying to explain it to people as and

664
00:48:45.360 --> 00:48:50.559
so sentience is in life around you
and what that sentience should do. So

665
00:48:50.599 --> 00:48:54.559
you just tread on this world with
a lot more compassion. Swatty, that

666
00:48:54.679 --> 00:48:57.960
is just beautiful. We are out
of time, but I want to give

667
00:48:57.960 --> 00:49:00.440
you the chance to be able to
say in fifteen seconds or you want to

668
00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:06.440
leave us. Well, I guess
just that, you know, just remember

669
00:49:06.800 --> 00:49:09.199
this, you belong. You're a
child at this planet. You're the human

670
00:49:09.280 --> 00:49:15.039
animal, you are nature. It
is not separate to you. This beautiful

671
00:49:15.119 --> 00:49:17.840
biosphere that we live in, which
enables us to survive, survives because of

672
00:49:17.880 --> 00:49:23.960
biodiversity. Today the loss of biodiversity
is at a staggering, staggering rate.

673
00:49:24.119 --> 00:49:29.559
And so educate yourselves. You know, every day that you wake up in

674
00:49:29.599 --> 00:49:32.440
the morning, every choice that you
make can make a difference. So I

675
00:49:32.480 --> 00:49:37.920
guess it's as doctor Jane Goodall says, what kind of difference are you going

676
00:49:37.960 --> 00:49:42.119
to make? Because you are impacting
things and you are making a difference,

677
00:49:42.119 --> 00:49:45.639
So choose you know, wisely,
I would say that that's really important.

678
00:49:45.639 --> 00:49:50.559
And I know we always say we
only live once and we should go out

679
00:49:50.599 --> 00:49:53.599
and do stuff, but actually the
fact is you die once, as a

680
00:49:53.719 --> 00:49:58.679
very great man said, but you
live every day, and every day you

681
00:49:58.760 --> 00:50:02.760
have that choice and that opportunity to
make a difference. Yeah, swatty,

682
00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:07.239
what a beautiful way to finish Roman
Andre. As we say in Tamil,

683
00:50:07.280 --> 00:50:09.360
thank you very much for being my
guest. It's so be very welcome.

684
00:50:10.199 --> 00:50:15.960
Thank you and thank you. Want
to learn your welcome. Swatty so beautiful.

685
00:50:15.039 --> 00:50:20.079
Thank you for just filling my cup
all day and year. If you

686
00:50:20.079 --> 00:50:22.800
want to learn more about Swatty and
the amazing work that she's doing, maybe

687
00:50:22.800 --> 00:50:25.360
the best way to find her is
just going to the Sea Change project dot

688
00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:29.360
com. That might be the easiest
way to get to her. Let's think

689
00:50:29.400 --> 00:50:31.880
our partner and sponsor, work Proud, which helps companies build a platform where

690
00:50:31.920 --> 00:50:36.559
your workforce receives meniful feedback and thanks
for their work from people our aust Our

691
00:50:36.639 --> 00:50:38.719
company. Thanks for staying with this
rumbor that works at least a third of

692
00:50:38.719 --> 00:50:46.599
our lives. So see you next
week for another episode. We hope you've

693
00:50:46.679 --> 00:50:52.239
enjoyed this week's program. Be sure
to tune into Working on Purpose, featuring

694
00:50:52.280 --> 00:50:57.079
your host, doctor Elise Cortez,
each week on the Voice America Empowerment Channel.

695
00:50:57.719 --> 00:51:04.320
Together, we'll create a world where
business operates conscientiously, leadership inspires impassioned

696
00:51:04.320 --> 00:51:08.360
performance, and employees are fulfilled in
work that provides the meaning and purpose they

697
00:51:08.360 --> 00:51:13.039
crave. See you there, Let's
Work on Purpose.