Marketing and Sales No Longer Sell - Customers Sell to Customers

WEBVTT

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There are some people that make their
work just another thing they have to do,

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and there are those that make their
work something that they want to do.

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Welcome to Working on Purpose with your
host Elise Cortes. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration from those
people who have found deeper meaning and

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personal connection to their work life.
It's beyond nine to five. It's working

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on Purpose. Now Here is your
host, Elise Cortes. Welcome back to

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the Working on Purpose Show. Thanks
for tuning in again this week. I'm

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your host, Elise Cortes, joining
you from Dallas, Texas, which is

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home base for me. This program
is all about helping people more meaningfully and

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productively connect with their work and equipping
organizations to do the same for their employees.

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So I bring on guests who have
a particular perspective or experience that I

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think expands the conversation, and I
often draw on my meeting or research I've

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been doing over the last fifteen years
as well is my own experience consulting,

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including the work I do today at
Insignium, which is a global management consulting

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firm. I'll get to the program
in justa MoMA, but a thank you

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to my media partner and sponsor,
jobbing dot Com. Jobbing dot com is

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the leading locally focused job board in
the nation, and they are dedicated to

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helping employers find quality talent in their
own backyard while giving job seekers control over

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their search that they can find work
close to home. Great partnership. Thank

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you jobbing dot Com. Last week, if you've missed the show live,

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you can always catch it via recorded
podcast. We were on the air with

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Mario McCracken, who is the revenue
leader at move Medical, where he leads

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the sales, marketing and customer success
efforts. He is also a thought leader

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who writes on LinkedIn and for inc. We talked about the art and science

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of building great teams and why doing
so bolsters the impact leaders can have with

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us. This week is Bill Lee, the founder and CEO of the Center

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for Customer Engagement, which provides consulting
and research services for senior management, as

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well as a global peer community and
educational services customer engagement implementation teams. He

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is the president of the Sumwhat on
Customer Engagement and the author of The Hidden

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Wealth of Customers. We'll be talking
about the criticality of cultivating customer relationships for

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the bottom line financial health of a
company, and also how doing so contributes

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to increased employee fulfillment and engagement.
I thought it was kind of fun to

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think about how we can actually love
and develop relationships with customers. On Valentine's

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Day, Bill Jos today from Dallas. Bill, welcome to Working on Purpose.

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Great to have you, Oh,
thank you. It's great to be

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here. So I want to start
by situating this episode for our listeners.

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So you and I have talked many
times, and the listeners who've heard the

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show know that this show is about
helping people more meaningfully and productively connect with

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their work, and most people in
some capacity ultimately work to serve customers.

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So of course customers are the center
of our universe, if you will.

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So I want to start with that. Bill, and you and I first

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met and talked about each of us
being passionate about the work that we do.

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Comment, if you will, on
this common connection of customers and why

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they're so important for all of us, no matter what kind of work we

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do. Well. This is about
as fundamental as you get. This goes

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back to Peter Drucker, who said
the purpose of businesses to create a customer

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and to serve a customer and the
keeper customer. That's that's why we do

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what we do. And if you're
uh in a firm and you're you've got

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employees, or if you yourself are
doing things that don't you know, the

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famous test is if you were to
stop doing what you're doing, now what

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any customer ever knows, And it's
a good rule to go by if you're

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if you're what you're doing doesn't pass
that test, then it's a good idea

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to rethink, maybe I should be
doing something else. You know. I

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forget what I was reading lately.
I try to do some kind of reading

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every day for at least half an
hour, and I was reading something about

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how if you're not always out there
hunting for customers, then of course you're

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you're you're losing the game. And
that makes a lot of sense to me.

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Now that's not just because of course
I hunt for customers, but and

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I look for them, but I
do. I think that your message about

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everyone in the organization of being focused
on find and cultivating those relationships is really

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important, which is another reason I
wanted to have you on the show because

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it connects to how they experience their
work right, and just finding and cultivating.

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It's also wants you to found them
and they become your customer and they're

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paying you money and they're using your
stuff. It certainly extends there as well

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well. And I'm going to talk
more about that kind of all of that,

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because you've got to go a deep
dive into that. But before I

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do, you your own story of
how you even got into this business is

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interesting. I know you've been in
all different kinds of work over your life,

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You've accumulated a lot different kinds of
experiences. But you told me the

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story when we first met of how
you got into this work, and I'd

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love for you to share with our
listeners. Sure I was doing. I

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had a side business that was providing
marketing, communications, consulting, and support

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to organizations and primarily technology firms.
Larger technology firms like Intel Lucent before they're

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before they merged with Alcatel, Compact, before they were acquired by Hewlett Packard

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and so forth, and then and
then later on Hewlett Packard and and and

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the Alcadelis and so forth, and
they were. These are people running what

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we're calling what are called customer reference
programs, which I had never heard heard

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of before. So the more I
got to know them, the more I

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began to think, Uh, you
know, first of all, this is

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kind of interesting that these people spend
their entire day thinking about the customers that

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they have that are successful enough and
willing to be a reference or an advocate

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to take interviews with analyst firms,
to speak at industry forums and so forth

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about the success they've had with these
companies. And it's like, WHOA,

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this is really interesting. And that
is the Internet came along and people were

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becoming more and more connected, and
it became easier and easier for uh,

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prospects and buyers to avoid the sales
people, you know, and avoid the

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marketing spend and go directly find somebody
who is a customer online who's like you

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and won't spend to you, will
tell you what the real deal is.

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It became far too easy for perspective
buyers to do that. I mean,

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we're seeing it, of course now
it's like second nature, but we're seeing

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with things like yelp. Amazon.
Allowing customer reviews on Amazon's website was very

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key, very very essential to Amazon's
ability to keep customers on their site long

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enough to purchase. So anyway,
we're seeing this really everywhere. It's old

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hat uh now, and it's like
this is really strategic stuff. So about

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but for you, uh until that's
six years ago. Find been at a

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book proposal of a Harvard Business Review
for a book on the strategic importance of

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customers like that, and I got
to deal with Harvard Business Review and that

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was kind of That's kind of what
got me going. You make it sound

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so easy, Bill, I know
it wasn't, and I know there was

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a lot of steps involved. But
when I look at the work that you're

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doing, I think there's just many
layers to it. And I looked,

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of course at some of the posts
that you have on LinkedIn and Twitter about

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companies going into these great links to
create and execute very complicated programs that are

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all about innovating new products and services
to increase sales, et cetera, competitions

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challenges, all that good stuff that
we're very used to. But yet,

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what you've done, if I've got
this writ and you tell me where I'm

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wrong, you've identified it a much
simpler path toward cultivating what you call marquee

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customer relationships. Instead, do I
have that right, And if so,

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tell us what you mean. Well, you know, when companies, let's

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say they launched a new initiative.
There's a lot of firms in mind,

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I will, in technology and software
that are taking their software to the cloud

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and they're there's they're shifting from you
know, one time purchase or a big

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licensing fee purchase, uh to monthly
subscriptions. That is very very disruptive to

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their business model. So uh,
it's very important to them. It's extremely

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important to them to have customers who
are very happy they have in that business

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model. They have to have high
retention rates, so they have to make

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them successful, and then they have
to get them talking about it. I

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mean, that's just that's just become
essential. So mar Key, customers,

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as you as you enter a market
and you're prioritized, you know, when

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you when you watch a new business
division or a new business in general,

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you have to be very careful with
how you invest your money. You know,

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your marketing budget, your sales budget, and so forth. So if

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you're just going after any customer,
know, I mean, salespeople tend to

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do this. Any sale is a
good sale, that's that can scatter your

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focus and that can really be very
damaging. It could be it can put

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you at really high risk of running
out of money before before you've really uh

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you know, tested and gotten your
business store. It needs to be so

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to to uh to you know,
prioritize what customers are you going to go

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after. You want customers who are
very influential in your market, customers who

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won't uh uh who who when when
when they do something. If they're using

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your service, then other people are
going to know about it because they're influential.

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There are people that other other customers, other buyers are watching uh And

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they're also very innovative themselves. That's
part of what makes them very influential.

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So these are the kinds of traits
that the Marquee customers have. And there

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was a very powerful research study done
by a guy named David G. Thompson

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about a decade ago. He's a
former mckensey consultant, and what he wanted

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to do was understand to get down
of the dynamics of rapid growth. You

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know, what is it that propels
in companies like Microsoft, like Amazon,

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like eBay and so forth. What
is it that they do that's different from

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those who don't achieve that level of
growth and what he found the major there

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were seven factors, but the most
important, the major factor that permeated all

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the other most of the others,
was that they found and cultivated and won

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the business and the long term relations
relationships with Marquee customers. That's who you

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focus on, Okay. So to
distinguish us for our listeners, Bill,

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So we enjoy a global listening audience
and we have listeners, lots of listeners

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in California, Texas, China,
Japan. So some of the people why

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not be professional salespeople. So I
think what I would like to distinguish for

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them and with you is what you're
talking about is way beyond just a really

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good referral network, which seems very
passive to me. Yes, yes,

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say more. Howl work often means
like I mean, I've seen it use

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like by professionals, maybe consultants or
maybe small firms that sort of band together

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and offer to refer each other.
You know, It's like, Okay,

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if you have a client that excuse
me that that you know you've got a

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good relationship with UH and and you
find out that they need my service,

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what it is that I can do
for them? Then you refer me and

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I do the same for you.
Is that what you mean by a referral

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networks? Uh? Yes, and
beyond that as well, Bill, I

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can tell you that for me,
I've certainly been on the lovely receiving end

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of a phone call when somebody calls
and says, hey, Eleise, I

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got your name a number from so
and so who was in one of your

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leadership programs, and she said it
was really great and thought, I thought

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maybe we could do something similar here
can we talk? So it's an actual

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client, This is a call from
somebody who took it was one of your

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customers. Yeah, so let me
lay it out for you. So this

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would be this would be someone who
doesn't know me, who's never met me,

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who's called me because they were having
a conversation with a client who was

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in a program that I led or
facilitated, and that person had a really

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good experience and was having a conversation
about the program to this person who called

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me, saying, hey, it
was really great value, you know,

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if you're looking for something or whatever
that piqued your interest. She shared her

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number with this person who then called
me, and I was on the lovely

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receiving end of that. Now,
these are not mark they're not marquee,

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but it's referral, and it's nothing
that I really did proactively, right,

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And you're right, I mean that's
that. So that's a referral from a

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client, and that's that's huge.
That is part of this. So just

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imagine if you intentionally cultivated clients in
the particular market who were very prominent.

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People in the market knew them like
they were the uh you know, they

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served in the professional association, they
were their business model was respected. People

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like to pay attention to what they
do because you know, they're very good.

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So imagine you have somebody that's more
at that level, uh than some

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you know some well you know some
some customers who may not be at that

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level. And it's still great that
they do that, and you want to

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encourage that. But but if you
if you really sought out the marquees or

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some people call them m vps in
your market and and and were able to

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get them doing that sort of thing, think how powerful that would be that

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people in the market And if you
you know a lot of a lot of

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my clients, for example, will
get a customer like that and I'm thinking

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of citrics is a really good example
of a firm centric systems now just playing

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citrics. Uh. They uh,
they very much cultivate really marquee customers from

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for example, you know customers like
JP Morgan, uh, Miami Children's Hospital.

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Uh. You know companies that are
highly well known and highly respected in

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their markets, and they're very good
about cultivating them. So so that's that's

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what I'm talking about. Make sure
that you're going after that that level,

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that quality of a customer. Another
word, another word that I use for

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them is the eagles in their market. You know, the winners, the

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ones that are that are known for
being all they can be. They're innovative,

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they're on the cutting edge. Everybody's
watching them. That's who you want

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uh to target and go after.
And if you if you're not going yet,

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this is a question that's it's sometimes
some tough love that I give the

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clients, but if you're not going
after that kind of customer, you might

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think about, well, why are
we in this business? Mm hm.

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As you were talking a bill,
the image I got in my head was

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something with a big megaphone behind it
or in front of it, it blasting

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out the message. I got that
that it would be impossible not to notice

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that message almost is that what you're
saying? No what In fact, it's

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it's sort of like like maybe the
reverse of that. It's like somebody talking

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quietly, you know whatever, the
people are flocking. It's like there were

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these old commercials. This is I'm
dating myself, but there's this commercial that

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EF Hutton used to put to put
on go When when EF Hutton talks,

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everybody listens. Got it, got
it, got it, got it great.

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So it's like you don't have to
go out, you know, you

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know, the the megaphone and going
out and and uh, you know all

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this uh you know, all this
marketing where you're ubiquitous, you're everywhere and

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you're really like being loud, so
to speak. That's not the idea.

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The idea is that you have somebody
that people in your market want to listen

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to. They want to know what
they're doing, and they'll seek that out.

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When Citrix is doing like let's say
it's annual uh you know, it's

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like it's it's yearly sales kick off
or whatever, and the CEO is there,

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and the press is there, the
media is there. You know,

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it's it's people watch Citrix is respected
themselves, and then when they put a

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customer on like uh, you know, a major global bank or a major

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hospital, they put them up on
stage and start talking about what they've achieved

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and what they're doing. You know, people are going to listen. I

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got that and perfect. Isn't that
just a perfect time to go for a

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break? I'm your host, Elise
right with that, I mean, that

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is a powerful point. Let's go
on a break. I'm your host,

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Elise Cortes. We've been on the
air with Billy who is the founder and

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CEO of Center for Customer Engagement,
which provides consulting and research services for senior

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management, as well as a global
peer community and educational services for customer engagement

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implementation teams. He is the president
of the Summit on Customer Engagement and the

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author of The Hidden Wealth of Customers. He joined us today from Dallas,

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Texas. We've been talking a bit
about this whole notion of customer advocacy.

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We'll talk more about it after the
break. Stay with us. We'll be

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00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:45.960
right back. Friend us on Facebook
to keep up with what's empowering the world.

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00:17:47.400 --> 00:17:53.400
Voice America Empowerment Alis Cortez is a
speaker and engagement and development catalyst.

236
00:17:53.559 --> 00:18:00.079
She designs and delivers professional development,
leadership and engagement workshops and can bring her

237
00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:04.160
expertise to your organization. She will
help ignite meaningful development within your workforce that

238
00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:10.160
will increase employee engagement, performance and
retention. To learn more or to invite

239
00:18:10.160 --> 00:18:15.880
Elise to speak to your organization,
please visit her at www dot Elisecortes dot

240
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com. She would welcome the opportunity
to help get your employees working on purpose.

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257
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Now back to Working on Purpose.
Thanks for staying with us, and

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00:20:12.599 --> 00:20:15.720
welcome back to Working on Purpose if
you're just joining us. My guest is

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00:20:15.720 --> 00:20:19.079
Bill Lee, the founder and CEO
of the Center for Customer Engagement, which

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00:20:19.079 --> 00:20:23.000
provides consulting and research services for senior
management, as well as a global peer

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00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:27.880
community and educational services for customer engagement
implementation teams. He is the president of

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00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:32.640
the Sumwhat on Customer Engagement and the
author of The Hidden Wealth of Customers.

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Bill has spoken to a wide variety
of business audiences such as the International Advertising

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Association, the Business Marketing Association,
the American Marketing Association, Forced to Research,

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the Net Promoter Annual Conference, the
Veritas President's Forum, the Marketing Executives

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Networking Group, and it goes on
and on and on. The man really

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00:20:51.079 --> 00:20:52.559
does know his stuff. It's so
awesome to have you on, Bill,

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Welcome back, all right, So
great to be here. Yeah, it's

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00:20:57.400 --> 00:21:00.559
just it's a really you know,
there's a lot that we can that I

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00:21:00.559 --> 00:21:03.359
want to peel back for our listeners, because, as you and I talked

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00:21:03.400 --> 00:21:07.480
on the break, some of the
people listening this might be a really really

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novel concept for them, this notion
of cultivating marquee customers, and so I

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want to make sure that they really
walk away with a good understanding of what

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we mean and why it might be
something for them to check into. So

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to get to that point, why
might companies be reticent to adopt a customer

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obscure approach like we're talking about here, Well, I think there's actually a

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couple of questions there. Most of
them get that they need some sort of

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customer advocacy, now, by which
I mean customers providing references like we talked

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00:21:38.440 --> 00:21:44.039
about earlier, and referrals and talking
to the media, you know, their

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industry, the industry media for their
vendor, and sometimes they be speaking at

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INNDISY events and so forth. So
I think most people get the importance of

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that. But then I was talking
to a very accomplished chief customer in Silicon

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Valley. There's actually well he's he's
just he's a very accomplished guy. There's

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no question, and he thought when
I raised the issue of a Marquee customer,

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excuse me, he actually was sort
of recoiled a little bit. And

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I asked, it sounds like,
you know, he sort of fell silent,

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and I said, uh, you
know, I said, gosh,

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uh, is there something that that
I'm missing here? Did did? Did

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you know we're not connecting on this
issue or what's the deal? And he

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said, well, a Marquee customer
is somebody like Walmart, right, They're

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a big parking, famous brand,
you know, gigantic farm. But nobody

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wants you know, nobody wants them
for a customer because they're a vendor killer.

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They'll squeeze your margins, they'll they'll
you know, they just they have

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no regard for the vendors. And
uh so I explained to him, well,

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that's not a marquee customer. Uh
So, it's it's helpful. I

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mean, when I talk about this
topic, I always you know, I

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00:23:04.200 --> 00:23:10.079
describe what a market customer is.
They're influential in the market. Other buyers

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will listen when they talk. They're
highly innovative themselves. They will help you

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be innovative. Uh and they also
regard you as important to their business.

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You're not just like another vendor or
a commodity. They regard to you in

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some way as important to their business, their business strategy. So that's what

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they are. And then I'm quick
to point out, you know, now

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this doesn't mean famous brands. Now
they might be, but not necessarily.

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And then Walmart is a perfect example
of a famous brand that would would almost

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certainly not be a marquee customer.
And then and then some people think,

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well, it must be our biggest
revenue customer, and it's like, no,

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maybe it might be, but the
traits are the ones that that I

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just describe those three traits. Those
are the that will give you leverage and

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00:24:02.839 --> 00:24:07.640
if you if you're a lot of
companies and especially sales departments are focused on

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00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:10.759
the next sale and on that big
you know, that big kill. You

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know, somebody that's going to be
you know, a six or seven figure

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contract. They focus on that,
and they think, well, that must

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be a marquee customer. And it's
like, well, they'll pay you a

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00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:23.559
lot of money, you know,
and that's great, But true markete customers

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will give you a leverage and value
h five x, ten x for more

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00:24:30.880 --> 00:24:33.920
than just the money that they pay, because of the referrals, the the

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00:24:34.039 --> 00:24:40.039
branding that they help you achieve,
the notoriety and awareness that they help you

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00:24:40.079 --> 00:24:44.559
achieve, and so forth and so
on. They're the leverage of They're the

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00:24:45.400 --> 00:24:51.000
customers that provide real leverage beyond just
what they're paying you. Mm hmmm.

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I get this bill. And what
I'm really really getting present to is just

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how beautiful the strategy of this whole
thing is. And certainly I can imagine

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it takes an incredible amount of effort
and finesse to be able to land a

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client like this, a customer like
this yes, it does. Yeah,

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which is where you come in right, yeah, yeah, And just quickly

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because I do want to I want
to talk next a little bit more about

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the insights of how this effects a
company's culture. But just you know,

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00:25:22.160 --> 00:25:26.440
to presences for our listeners. You
know, when you are working with clients,

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I'm sure that you have a gamut
of services that you can provide,

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00:25:32.279 --> 00:25:34.279
but are you in part coaching them
on how to be able to go after

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clients like this? I have started
to and the last well, I'm right

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00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:45.240
now ramping up I P I've done
research. Part of what we do is

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00:25:45.680 --> 00:25:51.680
research, and I've noticed in the
research that we do and also various anecdotical

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00:25:51.759 --> 00:25:53.960
case studies that we come up with, that it seems to be that it

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00:25:55.720 --> 00:26:00.720
is confirming Thompson's research that yes,
the companies that are doing for example,

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00:26:00.720 --> 00:26:06.119
sit I mentioned Citrics. They're not
hugely well known, but fairly well known

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00:26:06.160 --> 00:26:11.880
technology firm that happens to be quite
good at cultivating marquee customers as I was

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00:26:11.920 --> 00:26:18.400
talking about, and they they recently
went through some rather tough times, but

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00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:22.039
then they finally there were another software
firm that needed to go to the cloud,

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00:26:22.119 --> 00:26:26.279
that needed to dramatically change the platform
for their software and so forth and

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00:26:26.319 --> 00:26:30.880
so on, and they were struggling
a bit with this, but they've made

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it through their revenues back up and
growing again. They rebounded very well,

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00:26:36.279 --> 00:26:40.519
and I would, you know,
I would, I would not hesitate to

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say that they will. Their long
term relationships with the marquee customers that they've

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00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:51.119
cultivated over years was a big help
of that. Mm hmmm. Well,

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00:26:51.160 --> 00:26:53.160
I'll say one thing that we say
very often here an Insignium, and that

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is that relationship is the foundation of
all results. And so what you're talking

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about certainly jives with just the general
work that we do too. And then

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00:27:02.960 --> 00:27:06.319
related to that bill you started to
get here, and I really want to

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00:27:06.359 --> 00:27:10.119
bring this home for our listeners who
are also looking at how this topic is

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relative to how they can more meaningfully
and productively connect with their work. One

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00:27:12.960 --> 00:27:15.839
of the things that you said when
I first met you is that companies that

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focus on strong customer advocacy also often
have very vibrant cultures that encourage their employees

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00:27:22.519 --> 00:27:26.960
to unify in solidarity of their service. There's something about that that being focused

357
00:27:27.279 --> 00:27:32.559
on these kinds of customers and in
this kind of a capacity that's very energizing

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00:27:32.640 --> 00:27:37.480
and has an effect. So I
would be interested to hear what is a

359
00:27:37.519 --> 00:27:40.839
company, what does this kind of
a company culture look like? What are

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00:27:40.880 --> 00:27:45.160
employees doing? And saying that distinguishes
them? Well, it's the way I

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00:27:45.200 --> 00:27:49.519
look at it is. I think
I've got a new paper that I've just

362
00:27:49.559 --> 00:27:56.440
come out with. It's called growth
by hanging out. And what it means

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00:27:56.519 --> 00:27:59.880
is it's like a basic piece of
wisdom that was known since we were kids.

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00:28:00.359 --> 00:28:03.799
Uh, And that is it matters
and and and and then when we

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00:28:03.799 --> 00:28:07.839
started having kids are own. Uh, it matters who you hang out with

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00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:11.519
and if you've I use a story
of uh, some high school boys that

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00:28:11.559 --> 00:28:17.480
I work with at my church when
one when when I meet with them every

368
00:28:17.480 --> 00:28:19.839
week and what are called life groups, and when one of them gets off

369
00:28:19.960 --> 00:28:25.000
on the wrong track or he's not
showing up, uh, and I find

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00:28:25.000 --> 00:28:27.200
out what's what's going on? I
finally say, where's John. Uh,

371
00:28:27.319 --> 00:28:32.039
We'll use the name John, what's
happened to him? And I'll hear things

372
00:28:32.079 --> 00:28:34.240
like, well, you know,
he's cutting class, and somebody else will

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00:28:34.279 --> 00:28:37.559
say, uh, you know,
I think I think his grades are dropping.

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00:28:38.039 --> 00:28:41.720
And then someone else will say well, I saw him the other day

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00:28:41.759 --> 00:28:45.759
hanging out with some pretty sketchy looking
dudes. And then the other kids in

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00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:52.519
the group will say five friends.
That's a little code phrase we have and

377
00:28:52.599 --> 00:28:56.680
what it means is you are the
average of your five closest friends. So

378
00:28:56.759 --> 00:29:02.160
if you're hanging out with uh,
you know losers, If you're hanging out

379
00:29:02.200 --> 00:29:06.039
with uh, you know, kids
with bad attitudes, kids that are kind

380
00:29:06.039 --> 00:29:10.799
of nihilistic about their lives and so
forth, well guess what you're gonna You're

381
00:29:10.839 --> 00:29:14.319
gonna go south. And that's why
that was their conclusion on what was happening

382
00:29:14.319 --> 00:29:18.759
with John. He was hanging out
with sketchy kids. The average of his

383
00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:22.920
five you know, people that he
was the average of his five closest friends

384
00:29:22.920 --> 00:29:26.319
had gone down. And it works
in the other way too. If you

385
00:29:26.400 --> 00:29:30.519
hang out with kids who are excelling, uh, you know, the winners,

386
00:29:32.039 --> 00:29:33.720
kids who are on a path to
be all they can be, well

387
00:29:33.759 --> 00:29:37.240
that's gonna lifts you up as well. I mean, look at the Olympics.

388
00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:44.240
You see athletes, all the dude
that do these incredible things together and

389
00:29:44.279 --> 00:29:47.759
if you look back on their on
their history and their development, they've been

390
00:29:47.880 --> 00:29:51.839
hanging around the very best as much
as they can. They hang around the

391
00:29:51.880 --> 00:29:56.160
best. Uh, and and that's
what pushes them to get good as well.

392
00:29:56.359 --> 00:30:00.960
Well. That same concept, that's
Thompson's research, that's sa concept works

393
00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:04.599
for organizations. Uh. So you
want if you're cultivating and you'll just take

394
00:30:04.640 --> 00:30:08.839
any customer, uh you know,
if you're if you're if any customer,

395
00:30:08.839 --> 00:30:12.400
if every sale is a good sale, and you're taking just any customer that's

396
00:30:12.400 --> 00:30:17.799
easy to make a sale to,
then uh, you're not necessarily surrounding your

397
00:30:17.880 --> 00:30:21.839
organization with the best people with the
best customers, the ones that will push

398
00:30:21.880 --> 00:30:26.799
you in a good way. But
when you do, at least when you

399
00:30:26.920 --> 00:30:34.480
do target and cultivate those kinds of
customers, then here's what happens. Uh.

400
00:30:34.559 --> 00:30:40.519
First off, they keep you on
your toes in ways that organizational change

401
00:30:40.519 --> 00:30:45.359
efforts by themselves cannot do. Right. If you've got the CEO or your

402
00:30:45.839 --> 00:30:49.680
or your HR people, uh you
know, uh, you know working on

403
00:30:49.720 --> 00:30:56.160
some culture change initiative or some reorgan
initiative that's going to get those get a

404
00:30:56.200 --> 00:30:59.359
lot of resistance. Everybody that's been
involved in those now knows about that.

405
00:31:00.079 --> 00:31:03.599
But if you get the voice of
the customer, if you've got actual customers,

406
00:31:03.680 --> 00:31:10.240
especially your best marquee customers, asking
for those changes. That resistance goes

407
00:31:10.240 --> 00:31:15.279
away. Wow, you know what, No, go ahead, I'll comment

408
00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:19.880
afterwards. Go ahead. So that's
well, I was just going to say,

409
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:26.880
that's that's that is the I think
that's the most powerful motivator to motivate

410
00:31:26.920 --> 00:31:32.039
people to change. It's hard to
argue with what customers, especially are best

411
00:31:32.039 --> 00:31:34.000
customers want. How are you going
to how are you going to argue against

412
00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:38.160
that? Mm hmm. You You've
just given me something here, Bill,

413
00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:41.720
and I'll share it with all of
us here, and that is that.

414
00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:45.000
You know, obviously, we as
a firm do organizational transformation kind of work.

415
00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:48.200
We do work with it organizations,
through the leaders all the way through

416
00:31:48.200 --> 00:31:52.720
the organization to help them change.
And we do that around some kind of

417
00:31:52.720 --> 00:31:56.480
a major initiative that they need to
embrace in order to move the business forward.

418
00:31:56.960 --> 00:31:59.599
And what I'm reminded of when you
when you just spoke their Bill is

419
00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:04.519
one of the clients are working on
right now is absolutely working around and through

420
00:32:04.720 --> 00:32:08.480
a very large important customer request initiative
and we're doing a breakthrough project with them.

421
00:32:09.000 --> 00:32:15.480
So this breakthrough project really requires them
to change radically the way they work

422
00:32:15.519 --> 00:32:20.200
together as an organization to create products
and bring them to markets to serve this

423
00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:24.759
particular customer who's asked for this particular
change. And we're talking marching orders here.

424
00:32:24.920 --> 00:32:30.039
So I really get when you when
you talk about what if the customer

425
00:32:30.079 --> 00:32:34.839
helps bring up your game and that's
what ripples through how it changes how you

426
00:32:34.920 --> 00:32:37.920
act and how you how you serve. That is a perfect example, and

427
00:32:37.960 --> 00:32:42.440
that's I totally get what you're talking
about now that you've brought that together in

428
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:50.599
those terms. Yeah, there was. One of my favorite stories is a

429
00:32:50.599 --> 00:32:55.000
business transformation that Hewlett Packard pulled off
back when Carley feel In with CEO.

430
00:32:57.359 --> 00:33:00.799
This was in the early two thousands, and they were at this functional uh.

431
00:33:01.119 --> 00:33:05.359
You know, for those who knowed
their history, they were about as

432
00:33:05.400 --> 00:33:09.000
dysfunctional an organization as you can get. Uh. This is unlike to the

433
00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:16.480
early two thousands and their uh they're
enterprise business the business itself to big giant

434
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:24.519
corporations. Uh. They decided to
pull off a very a very aggressive and

435
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:31.799
ambitious uh organizational change change in their
positioning and so forth. They wanted to

436
00:33:31.799 --> 00:33:37.400
go from being a technology provider to
these enterprise customers. They wanted to be

437
00:33:37.440 --> 00:33:43.720
a trusted advisor. So uh,
now that all sounds great, but the

438
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:47.599
key thing was that they talked to
their leading customers. They started this initiative

439
00:33:47.680 --> 00:33:52.960
with just two of their enterprise customers, but obviously these were two extremely important

440
00:33:53.720 --> 00:33:59.759
enterprise customers. Uh. And they
started with them, and they basically worked

441
00:33:59.759 --> 00:34:01.599
with a customers to say, how
will this look? What is it you

442
00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:06.640
want from us? Uh? You
know, how can we create more value?

443
00:34:06.640 --> 00:34:09.000
How can we achieve this trust advisor? Uh? You know, well

444
00:34:09.039 --> 00:34:13.039
with you and a lot of the
things these customers want. Something like that

445
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:19.320
A lease is is sometimes pretty daunting. It's like whoa yeah, but that's

446
00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:22.079
the kind of push you know that
Olympic athletes give each other. Right,

447
00:34:22.159 --> 00:34:25.320
you're working with the best, you're
you want to allow them to push you

448
00:34:25.360 --> 00:34:31.000
in that direction. So h with
customers asking and wanting this, uh,

449
00:34:31.079 --> 00:34:36.159
you know, organizational resistance, nothing
there, you know. And then then

450
00:34:36.199 --> 00:34:39.679
when they got those wins, they
walled it out again to another five or

451
00:34:39.760 --> 00:34:46.960
seven enterprise customers with similar results,
with big gains and revenue from these customers.

452
00:34:47.920 --> 00:34:52.519
Again, they were able to do
it very quickly. And you know,

453
00:34:52.559 --> 00:34:55.519
this wasn't taking years, and then
finally with that success and all that

454
00:34:55.599 --> 00:35:00.199
you know, customer input that they
responded to and it was translating beautifully to

455
00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:05.440
the bottom line. They rolled it
out globally for the entire business after that.

456
00:35:05.840 --> 00:35:08.960
So this is a huge win for
Human packers back when they were in

457
00:35:08.960 --> 00:35:13.880
the middle of all this dysfunction.
Mm hmmm, That to me is a

458
00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:19.440
test, you know, that's a
test for how powerful you know, if

459
00:35:19.519 --> 00:35:22.599
you will the voice of the customer, and even in an organization that was

460
00:35:22.599 --> 00:35:27.480
suffering like they were. Mm hmmm, I got it very clearly, because

461
00:35:27.480 --> 00:35:30.519
again, so much of the work
that we do is around helping our clients

462
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:34.679
produce breakthrough results, in other words, things that were not seen as possible

463
00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:38.039
without you know, being able to
write the compass on and rivet it on

464
00:35:38.079 --> 00:35:43.239
that particular promise or possibility that they
created for themselves. And very often it's

465
00:35:43.280 --> 00:35:50.559
around producing a revenue target, satisfying
a client, changing it's its place in

466
00:35:50.559 --> 00:35:53.880
the marketplace in terms of its numerical
ranking, those kinds of initiatives, and

467
00:35:53.920 --> 00:35:58.920
you're right, when we align the
people around those kinds of things, everybody's

468
00:35:58.920 --> 00:36:01.960
hearts and minds are all focused on
that and You're right, the resistance melts

469
00:36:01.960 --> 00:36:06.320
away. Yeah. I mean one
thing I like to do when people talk

470
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:09.119
about we want to be we want
to go from being number four, number

471
00:36:09.119 --> 00:36:15.320
two, or you know, or
goals like this, My first question,

472
00:36:15.480 --> 00:36:21.599
excuse me, is can I talk
to some of your customers, your leading

473
00:36:21.599 --> 00:36:27.039
customers, And I use, I
basically use the definition of marquee customers.

474
00:36:27.679 --> 00:36:31.000
Let me talk to them, and
so I'll talk to them and I'll ask

475
00:36:31.119 --> 00:36:37.880
them what they want from the relationship
where they're where they're not getting it,

476
00:36:37.400 --> 00:36:40.360
and so you know, I'll go
into some depth with them. And if

477
00:36:40.400 --> 00:36:46.280
what they want doesn't align with these
with this goal that management has decided to

478
00:36:46.280 --> 00:36:51.039
come up with it, then uh, you know, I go back and

479
00:36:51.079 --> 00:36:52.880
I say to the management, this
is a red flag. Why are you

480
00:36:53.000 --> 00:36:58.440
doing this? If customers don't care
about it, or if it's not aligned

481
00:36:58.440 --> 00:37:00.800
with what they really want from you, why are you doing why spend intergear

482
00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:06.599
cycle on it? Exactly? Yeah? Cool? All right, Well that

483
00:37:06.760 --> 00:37:08.440
is another good place for a break. So hold that thought and that breath

484
00:37:08.440 --> 00:37:10.880
for just a second. Their Bill, I'm Alice Cortez, your host.

485
00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:14.719
We've been on the air with Billy
the founder and CEO of the Center for

486
00:37:14.760 --> 00:37:19.800
Customer Engagement, which provides consulting and
research services for senior management, as well

487
00:37:19.800 --> 00:37:23.880
as a global peer community and educational
services for customer engagement implementation teams. He

488
00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:28.760
is the president of the Summit on
Customer Engagement and the author of The Hidden

489
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:31.239
Wealth of Customers. He joins IT
today from Dallas, Texas. After the

490
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:34.480
break, we're going to talk about
his summit, as well as a bit

491
00:37:34.519 --> 00:37:39.280
more about how what we've been speaking
about connects to how employees enjoy their work

492
00:37:39.320 --> 00:37:42.960
in a more meaningful fashion. Stay
with us, we'll be right back.

493
00:37:53.559 --> 00:37:58.679
Friend us on Facebook to keep up
with what's empowering the world. Voice America

494
00:37:58.719 --> 00:38:06.000
Empowerment Alice Cortes is a speaker and
engagement and development catalyst. She designs and

495
00:38:06.039 --> 00:38:10.559
delivers professional development, leadership and engagement
workshops and can bring her expertise to your

496
00:38:10.679 --> 00:38:16.039
organization. She will help ignite meaningful
development within your workforce that will increase employee

497
00:38:16.039 --> 00:38:21.519
engagement, performance and retention. To
learn more or to invite Elise to speak

498
00:38:21.559 --> 00:38:27.079
to your organization, please visit her
at www dot Elisecortes dot com. She

499
00:38:27.159 --> 00:38:31.840
would welcome the opportunity to help get
your employees. Working on Purpose, We're

500
00:38:31.880 --> 00:38:37.239
making it easier to listen to the
Voice American Talk Radio Network wherever you go.

501
00:38:37.400 --> 00:38:39.719
In addition to listening live, you
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502
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503
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504
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505
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get ready to tune in the Voice America

506
00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:13.280
Mode land by air cast. Look
along, We'll stop big s. Get

507
00:39:13.320 --> 00:39:17.880
inspired, encouraged and connected on our
Lively Award winning Healthy Living Power Hour Star

508
00:39:17.960 --> 00:39:23.480
Style Be the star you are with
host and empowerment architect Cindya Brian, live

509
00:39:23.639 --> 00:39:29.199
every Wednesday at four pm Pacific on
the Voice America Empowerment Channel. Tune into

510
00:39:29.239 --> 00:39:34.000
the Power Party for positive, uplifting, life changing talk radio. Visit Starstyle

511
00:39:34.119 --> 00:39:51.239
Radio dot com. You follow us
on Twitter for more great ideas at Voice

512
00:39:51.239 --> 00:40:04.559
America Empowerment. This is working on
Purpose with Elise Cortes. To reach our

513
00:40:04.559 --> 00:40:07.920
program today, please call in to
one triple eight three four six nine one

514
00:40:08.000 --> 00:40:13.880
four one again that's one triple eight
three four six nine one for one.

515
00:40:14.079 --> 00:40:21.199
You may also send an email to
Elise ali Se at elisecortes dot com.

516
00:40:21.320 --> 00:40:27.960
Now back to working on Purpose.
Thanks for staying with us, and welcome

517
00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:30.119
back to working on Purpose if you're
just tuning in. My guest is Bildi,

518
00:40:30.199 --> 00:40:34.480
who is the founder and CEO of
the Center for Customer Engagement, which

519
00:40:34.480 --> 00:40:37.840
provides consulting and research services for senior
management, as well as a global peer

520
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:43.559
community and educational services for customer engagement
implementation teams. He is the president of

521
00:40:43.599 --> 00:40:46.239
the Somewhat on Customer Engagement and the
author of The Hidden Wealth of Customers.

522
00:40:46.719 --> 00:40:51.559
So before the break, we were
talking a bit about really how this focus

523
00:40:51.639 --> 00:40:57.280
on customer afflicacy can impact and strengthen
culture and unite people. What I want

524
00:40:57.280 --> 00:41:00.159
to do next to finish that conversation
if we can, Bill, is I

525
00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:04.320
want to connect the dots on how
serving customers and serving them well, especially

526
00:41:04.320 --> 00:41:07.559
marquee customers who really bring up your
game, contributes to more meaningful connection to

527
00:41:07.599 --> 00:41:10.239
work. So if you would comment
on that, and then I know I've

528
00:41:10.239 --> 00:41:15.760
got a couple of things to add
to it as well. Sure you know

529
00:41:15.800 --> 00:41:21.559
a great example of that is Salesforce
originally Salesforce dot Com now just Salesforce.

530
00:41:22.159 --> 00:41:24.599
Uh. This is you know,
they provide a serum platform, and they

531
00:41:24.679 --> 00:41:30.800
are the ones that invented cloud,
cloud computing, uh, cloud software and

532
00:41:30.840 --> 00:41:35.039
so forth, you know, software
as a service. Uh. And it's

533
00:41:35.119 --> 00:41:38.840
it was Mark Benioff and Salesforce that
invented all that and what they were doing

534
00:41:38.880 --> 00:41:44.840
it was a response to the enterprise
software of farms like Oracle and SAP who

535
00:41:44.840 --> 00:41:51.480
were just serving their customers badly.
Uh. They were just very briefly they

536
00:41:51.519 --> 00:41:57.400
would charge sometimes millions of dollars for
their enterprise software to these to these customers,

537
00:41:57.840 --> 00:42:00.480
and then once they dumped it off
and installed that it's like from from

538
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:05.760
from here on, you're on your
own. That was their attitude. It

539
00:42:05.800 --> 00:42:08.519
was just horrible the way they were
treating these customers. And finally they started

540
00:42:08.519 --> 00:42:14.639
to kind of abel against this.
Well Benioff responded to that by starting he

541
00:42:14.719 --> 00:42:16.760
was he had worked, he was
a star at the Oracle, and he

542
00:42:16.960 --> 00:42:23.440
went off and started Salesforce in his
apartment there in San Francisco. And uh

543
00:42:23.480 --> 00:42:28.280
so his when he was starting this
with his with his original employees and so

544
00:42:28.360 --> 00:42:35.239
forth, they were so jazz by
getting customers and then working with them every

545
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:38.719
step when they developed a product or
you know, some some version of software

546
00:42:39.639 --> 00:42:44.800
or whatever, modifications and so forth. And as they were developing their platform,

547
00:42:45.159 --> 00:42:50.719
they love to do it in an
iterative process with the customer to make

548
00:42:50.800 --> 00:42:55.000
sure that they're that the customer is
really getting exceptional value from the software.

549
00:42:55.039 --> 00:42:59.639
And that was so motivating to their
to the employees, right. It wasn't

550
00:42:59.679 --> 00:43:01.199
just better standing out. He's a
big, huge guy. He's like,

551
00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:06.039
he looks like a tackle in the
NFL. And it wasn't just him standing

552
00:43:06.079 --> 00:43:07.440
up and demanding this, you know, and say that's what we got to

553
00:43:07.480 --> 00:43:15.000
do. It's like they were working
directly with customers to achieve exceptional customer service

554
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:19.800
and customer outcomes. And that's that's
what is there that you can do.

555
00:43:19.880 --> 00:43:24.280
That's more motivating than that. M
M. I got that, And what

556
00:43:24.320 --> 00:43:28.639
I was thinking of when we were
when we were connecting these thoughts is very

557
00:43:28.760 --> 00:43:31.639
much along those same lines about that
how motivating that is. The Other piece

558
00:43:31.679 --> 00:43:36.159
that I thought was really interesting is
when you think about what I know from

559
00:43:36.159 --> 00:43:37.920
my own research, Bill, I
mean, I've been investigating how people experience

560
00:43:37.960 --> 00:43:43.119
meeting in their work for fifteen years
and I'm working on a book from the

561
00:43:43.159 --> 00:43:46.119
research as we speak. One of
the things that people find really motivating is

562
00:43:46.239 --> 00:43:50.440
this feeling of being competent. And
so if they feel like, wow,

563
00:43:50.480 --> 00:43:52.719
I'm really doing this work well,
I'm serving this customer really well and look

564
00:43:52.760 --> 00:43:58.119
at this as an amazing customer.
There's something about knowing that you're good at

565
00:43:58.119 --> 00:44:01.840
something, that you nailed something that
really is very motivating as well also,

566
00:44:02.400 --> 00:44:07.920
right, and then also there's that
notion of being held to a standard that,

567
00:44:07.079 --> 00:44:10.440
as you say, these clients will
teach you something and cause you to

568
00:44:12.239 --> 00:44:15.000
work at a higher level. There's
something about that too that's also very motivating.

569
00:44:15.039 --> 00:44:17.840
For people to be held to that
standard and know that they can actually

570
00:44:17.840 --> 00:44:24.320
meet it. That's also motivating.
Yeah, agreat totally. Yeah, it's

571
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:29.679
good stuff. So this is fun
to talk about and on the heels no

572
00:44:29.800 --> 00:44:34.000
less, I know you're working furiously. You've got your twenty eighteen, some

573
00:44:34.039 --> 00:44:37.519
of it on customer engagement coming up
right around the corner in March. I

574
00:44:37.559 --> 00:44:39.719
want to talk about that a little
bit here, Bill, because I think

575
00:44:39.760 --> 00:44:44.519
it will help also our listeners understand
what it is that you're up to and

576
00:44:44.960 --> 00:44:49.519
how your work impacts the clients.
You're working with and really also again just

577
00:44:49.800 --> 00:44:55.039
how you're socializing these efforts in sense, I've always wanted to actually create some

578
00:44:55.159 --> 00:44:59.199
kind of a conference. First,
I got to ask, why did you

579
00:44:59.199 --> 00:45:01.280
start hosting this? This is your
second year, why did you start hosting

580
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:07.639
it? Well, when I first
started working with these folks, I would

581
00:45:07.360 --> 00:45:08.599
they you know, I was working
with them, and I got to be

582
00:45:08.880 --> 00:45:15.480
known among several of these these people
that were running these old customer reference programs,

583
00:45:15.039 --> 00:45:17.719
and then they would start asking me, can you Especially when the Internet

584
00:45:17.760 --> 00:45:22.639
was coming along, everybody had to
you know, their their company, you

585
00:45:22.679 --> 00:45:25.239
know, off of the Internet and
so forth, and they would start posting

586
00:45:25.360 --> 00:45:30.760
customer reference stories, you know,
success stories. And then at some point

587
00:45:30.760 --> 00:45:34.519
they're doing videos with these customers and
so forth, talking about, you know,

588
00:45:34.599 --> 00:45:37.400
how well they're being served by these
companies. And then they'd start looking

589
00:45:37.440 --> 00:45:44.280
at other people's websites like the Let's
say, somebody at Intel would look at

590
00:45:44.719 --> 00:45:49.039
a Cantel Loosen's website and so that's
pretty cool. I'd like to talk to

591
00:45:49.079 --> 00:45:52.199
whoever's running the reference program over to
I Caitels. So they would contact me

592
00:45:52.280 --> 00:45:59.519
for this can you introduce me?
And so I started doing this and after

593
00:45:59.559 --> 00:46:02.000
I heard this enough, I then
said, don't you want have some kind

594
00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:07.639
of professional association or something where you
get together? Why he said? The

595
00:46:07.679 --> 00:46:10.760
answer was always no, but if
you ever hear one, let me know

596
00:46:12.000 --> 00:46:17.880
I'm there. So we started.
I partnered with a software provider to this

597
00:46:19.239 --> 00:46:24.119
audience that I was working with and
who had a pretty good sized database.

598
00:46:24.840 --> 00:46:29.400
And also I partied with another firm
that had experienced an event planning which I

599
00:46:29.480 --> 00:46:34.079
knew nothing about. And we put
on a show and we got, you

600
00:46:34.079 --> 00:46:37.960
know, almost twice as many people
as we expected. And I charged a

601
00:46:37.000 --> 00:46:40.519
lot more than people said I should, because otherwise, you know why I

602
00:46:40.559 --> 00:46:45.719
do it. And so we were
off and that was first of one.

603
00:46:45.719 --> 00:46:51.360
It was two thousand and five in
Scottsdale, and we've been doing it ever

604
00:46:51.480 --> 00:46:55.800
since. You know, when I
listened to you talk, Bill, what

605
00:46:55.920 --> 00:47:00.000
I get and I want the listeners
to catch this too, as it strikes

606
00:47:00.039 --> 00:47:05.119
me that you've got what I call
a really good sniffer, meaning that you

607
00:47:05.239 --> 00:47:10.280
can really be present to conversation,
possibility and opportunity and create something you You

608
00:47:10.440 --> 00:47:14.559
have a unique ability, it seems
to be able to listen to what's going

609
00:47:14.559 --> 00:47:19.079
on in the marketplace, and to
respond to it with an offering that has

610
00:47:19.199 --> 00:47:22.360
value that people want to pay for. And I think it's really remarkable.

611
00:47:23.239 --> 00:47:25.880
Well this is this this well,
I guess we could say this is an

612
00:47:25.880 --> 00:47:30.559
example I did. There's been sometimes
where where it's self flat in its face,

613
00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:37.719
you know, But that's how you
learn, that's how you that's how

614
00:47:37.760 --> 00:47:40.519
you learn and adapt and then get
better. I feel like, if I'm

615
00:47:40.559 --> 00:47:45.440
not failing also once in a while, that I'm probably not pushing harder though

616
00:47:45.719 --> 00:47:51.960
presuing moments of the boundaries hard though. I appreciate that coming it was one

617
00:47:51.960 --> 00:47:55.639
of those things that didn't work out
pretty well well. And I also appreciate

618
00:47:55.719 --> 00:48:00.079
the the the the the embrace of
failure. And one of the things that

619
00:48:00.119 --> 00:48:04.840
we talk about within our firm is
the book Black Box Thinking, which encourages

620
00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:08.280
failure, frequent failure in order to
find even greater successes. So I echo

621
00:48:08.400 --> 00:48:12.760
that and appreciate that too, and
and also the humility with which you are

622
00:48:12.800 --> 00:48:15.480
delivering that, So thank you for
that. It's just great for all of

623
00:48:15.559 --> 00:48:19.960
our listeners to get that as they're
thinking for themselves individually built. Some people

624
00:48:19.960 --> 00:48:23.519
are listening to the show because they're
trying to reinvent themselves. They're trying to

625
00:48:23.559 --> 00:48:28.400
consider how to bring up their own
game and sales, and so what you're

626
00:48:28.440 --> 00:48:32.000
saying about really putting yourself out there
is and you know, risking failure is

627
00:48:32.280 --> 00:48:36.639
important for them to hear and remind
them that, look what you've done.

628
00:48:36.679 --> 00:48:38.440
So it's just and that's so much
of what I try to do on the

629
00:48:38.440 --> 00:48:45.199
show build is to really really empower
my listeners with information, resources, inspiration

630
00:48:45.360 --> 00:48:46.960
so that they'll go after their dreams. So thank you for saying that.

631
00:48:47.000 --> 00:48:52.679
That way you did it was great. So back on the summit, what

632
00:48:52.840 --> 00:48:57.320
I also find fascinating about what you're
doing is you know, you've created a

633
00:48:57.519 --> 00:49:01.840
platform to let to let your your
clients and your associates socialize about the same

634
00:49:01.880 --> 00:49:05.360
stuff that you care about, which
I think is just brilliant. It's like

635
00:49:05.440 --> 00:49:10.280
a moving excellence, right. So
I'm interested to understand who attends this summit

636
00:49:10.400 --> 00:49:15.119
and what do they actually get from
the experience. Well, these are the

637
00:49:15.559 --> 00:49:20.599
these are the folks that implement.
They're at the implementation level. They tend

638
00:49:20.639 --> 00:49:24.400
to be senior managers, managers,
directors of what are often called customers.

639
00:49:24.480 --> 00:49:30.199
There's some of them are still called
customer reference programs or customer advocacy programs or

640
00:49:30.280 --> 00:49:35.599
customer marketing programs and so forth.
These are the people that implement these programs.

641
00:49:35.639 --> 00:49:39.199
They you know, they set up
the operation, They develop relationships with

642
00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:45.039
their with their customer advocates and hopefully
with their marquee customers. They work with

643
00:49:45.199 --> 00:49:52.440
them to get out and tell their
story and get interviewed by the market and

644
00:49:52.599 --> 00:50:00.679
so forth. And it's this resource, these customers who are both successful and

645
00:50:00.280 --> 00:50:06.320
influential in the marketplace. Uh.
I think, uh, I think it's

646
00:50:06.400 --> 00:50:10.880
clear that these are these are the
most important resources, growth resources that companies

647
00:50:10.960 --> 00:50:15.920
have these days. And they're and
they're in charge of that. They're in

648
00:50:15.039 --> 00:50:19.920
charge of developing those relationships. So
uh that's what we do. And we

649
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:24.159
talk about the h the various issues
that they run into. You know,

650
00:50:24.199 --> 00:50:28.760
there's always in any profession, there's
always pain points. You know, there's

651
00:50:28.760 --> 00:50:34.119
always puzzling situations. And they get
together and uh uh and talk about them,

652
00:50:34.159 --> 00:50:36.880
and we and most of the presenters, I mean, I lead off

653
00:50:36.880 --> 00:50:40.800
from the keynote and then we get
we get a couple of one or two

654
00:50:42.119 --> 00:50:45.440
high profile people. We've had Don
Pepper's, uh, Fred Reichl. These

655
00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:51.679
are these are big names in the
customer customer strategy world. And then but

656
00:50:51.800 --> 00:50:53.800
most of them are are are their
peers. These are people. They are

657
00:50:53.840 --> 00:50:59.360
doing very interesting, very good work. Uh. They'll they'll submit a proposal

658
00:50:59.440 --> 00:51:01.280
to present to me. It's kind
of an honor for them to get to

659
00:51:01.360 --> 00:51:07.119
do that, which which I'm honored
by of course. And uh, and

660
00:51:07.239 --> 00:51:09.800
that's what most of the time is
spent is just with their with their peers.

661
00:51:10.880 --> 00:51:15.719
And that's when when when I'm at
this event, the most excited I

662
00:51:15.880 --> 00:51:21.440
see people is when uh, they
they're surrounded by peers who understand what they

663
00:51:21.519 --> 00:51:25.239
do. It's a very human reaction. They don't always feel understood or appreciated

664
00:51:25.320 --> 00:51:30.840
in the organizations. And now there
with a bunch of people that understand what

665
00:51:30.039 --> 00:51:35.239
they do, they understand their common
pains and their common frustrations, and their

666
00:51:35.320 --> 00:51:37.599
joys, you know, and their
their victories, they are able to share

667
00:51:37.639 --> 00:51:43.320
all that. So it's pretty satisfying. Mm hmm. I am liking it

668
00:51:43.440 --> 00:51:45.599
too. You know, Wow,
I found my people. This is my

669
00:51:45.760 --> 00:51:51.000
tribe, right and there is something
very empowering about that. Yeah, and

670
00:51:51.119 --> 00:51:53.599
you and your team brought that together. I just I really applaud that Bill

671
00:51:53.639 --> 00:51:59.719
and I just really admire that fantastic
you know, the the your comment earlier,

672
00:51:59.800 --> 00:52:02.320
but kind of being in the moment
and listening. Uh, It's it's

673
00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:07.079
really so important that that you go. I see a lot of people,

674
00:52:07.599 --> 00:52:10.199
they will go into a sales call, they will go into a meeting where

675
00:52:10.199 --> 00:52:15.800
they're trying to get budget for their
program, and they're all you know,

676
00:52:16.000 --> 00:52:22.239
just they're they're they're all focused on
what they want and that's not where the

677
00:52:22.440 --> 00:52:23.440
that's not where the big win is
going to come from. It's going to

678
00:52:23.559 --> 00:52:28.360
it's going to come from understanding what
the other person, you know, the

679
00:52:29.039 --> 00:52:34.280
buyer, the prospect, your boss, the board, it's understanding what they

680
00:52:34.400 --> 00:52:38.119
want to need, being very very
clear on that. And uh, I

681
00:52:38.159 --> 00:52:44.719
mean I've seen I've seen training where
people are trained on connecting. There's some

682
00:52:44.960 --> 00:52:49.199
very good work being done now on
training people to connect with with others,

683
00:52:49.400 --> 00:52:52.119
with their you know, with their
peers, with their with with the people

684
00:52:52.159 --> 00:52:54.440
they're leading, with their leadership,
and so forth, how to connect on

685
00:52:54.679 --> 00:53:00.920
one on a human basis. And
when you when you see people approach a

686
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:05.079
situation in the usual way, like
a salesperson who's trying to land a big

687
00:53:05.159 --> 00:53:09.039
deal and you see them approach that
and they're nervous. They you know,

688
00:53:09.199 --> 00:53:13.000
they forget what they're going to say. They're worried they'll blow it, you

689
00:53:13.079 --> 00:53:17.239
know, because they're focused on getting
the deal. So the training is that,

690
00:53:17.400 --> 00:53:21.239
Okay, let's try to you know
this all this is being videotaped in

691
00:53:21.239 --> 00:53:23.199
a workshop, so it's a safe
environment. And they say, okay,

692
00:53:23.400 --> 00:53:28.480
let's try it again in this time. I want you to think about how

693
00:53:28.559 --> 00:53:35.320
can you find out what's on this
guy's mind? And the transformation is remarkable.

694
00:53:35.360 --> 00:53:38.880
All of a sudden, they're relaxed, they're they're much more you know,

695
00:53:38.920 --> 00:53:44.360
they're much more charismatic, they're much
more they're they're connecting much more with

696
00:53:44.480 --> 00:53:51.079
the other person by getting working to
understand and asking questions and really listening and

697
00:53:51.159 --> 00:53:54.960
stop worrying about whether this fits with
my agitim, let's just understand their agenda.

698
00:53:55.519 --> 00:53:58.639
So powerful and then when you do
it, when you know, when

699
00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:04.440
you adopt that mindset and guess what, you're going to start understanding these people

700
00:54:04.599 --> 00:54:07.639
that you want things from. I
love that well, Phil, and that

701
00:54:07.840 --> 00:54:09.199
is a perfect way to finish the
show. We are out of time,

702
00:54:09.280 --> 00:54:13.039
and that couldn't have been a better
way to close the show. Thank you

703
00:54:13.159 --> 00:54:15.199
so much for joining me today.
It's been great to have you as a

704
00:54:15.239 --> 00:54:19.840
guest. Well, thank you,
Lise, I've really enjoyed it. If

705
00:54:19.840 --> 00:54:22.360
you want to learn more about Bill
Ye and the Workiness team do at the

706
00:54:22.360 --> 00:54:25.039
Center for Customer Engagement, or his
books or the upcoming Somewhat on Customer Engagement,

707
00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:30.360
visit their website at Center for Customer
Engagement dot com. Join us next

708
00:54:30.360 --> 00:54:35.119
week when we talk with Henda Samaran
about her newly released memoir called Grit Under

709
00:54:35.159 --> 00:54:38.719
My Nails, one woman's extraordinary journey
to discover it's all possible, including survival.

710
00:54:39.039 --> 00:54:42.239
See you then, and remember,
workers at least one third of our

711
00:54:42.320 --> 00:54:51.960
life, So let's work on Purpose. We hope you've enjoyed this week's program.

712
00:54:52.280 --> 00:54:55.320
Be sure to tune into Working on
Purpose featuring your host Alis Cortes,

713
00:54:55.679 --> 00:55:00.360
every Wednesday at six pm Eastern Time
three pm Pacific Time on the Voice America

714
00:55:00.440 --> 00:55:05.559
Empowerment Channel. This week, find
your life's purpose at work