Intrinsic Motivation: The Drive Beyond Employee Engagement

WEBVTT

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There are some people that make their
work just another thing they have to do,

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and there are those that make their
work something that they want to do.

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Welcome to Working on Purpose with your
host Elise Cortes. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration from those
people who have found deeper meaning and

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personal connection to their work life.
It's beyond nine to five. It's working

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on Purpose. Now Here is your
host, Elise Cortes. Welcome back to

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Working on Purpose show. Thanks for
tuning again this week. I'm your host,

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Alise Cortes, joining you live from
Dallas, Texas, which is home

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base for me. If you've been
tuning in for a while, you know

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this program is all about helping people
create more meaningful and purposeful lives and equipping

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leaders insight organizations to cultivate meaning and
purpose that elicit's passion, inspired contribution,

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innovation, and persevering performance. I
talk with my guests to draw on their

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expertise and share my own experience consar
speaking and developing workforces across the globe.

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Every week. In these conversations,
I hope you walk away with something you

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can immediately put to use and if
I can do anything to help you along

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your journey. Go to my website
at at Leastcortes dot com and use the

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contact me feature to message me and
let's open a dialogue and explore what's going

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on for you and how I might
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community to nurture your own purpose or
bring it out to the world. You

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are offered on site or via webcast. You're interested in the Women on Purpose

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Thought Leadership Summit in Portland later this
fall, or you want me to come

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and speak for your company or conference
in anyway, I'm in talk to me

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and I'm happy to help. Now
onto this week's program with us is Matt

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Johnson. He is the founder and
CEO of motive X. He and his

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team are on a mission to disrupt
the way organizations approach retention, change management,

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and leadership development. We'll be talking
about what he knows best motivation.

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We'll discuss how the lack of the
understanding of it propels so many poor human

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capital results inside organizations, and how
when leveraged well, leaders can create work

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environments, job task and team interactions
that a list inspired and persevering performance.

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Matt comes to us from the Pennsylvania
area. Matt, welcome to Working on

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Purpose. Hey, Lis, thanks
for having me on the show. I

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really appreciate that you are so welcome. All right, so well, let's

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get into it here. I'm going
to take as much as I possibly can

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out of you in the time that
we have. Are you ready, sure?

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Okay, looking forward to it here
me too, Okay, So right

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out of the gate. One of
the things that really struck me about what

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you're up to, Matt is you
position in an article that, with unemployment

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now at only three point eight percent, that this is the time for CEOs

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and organizational leaders to focus more unemployee
engagement and retention than on recruitment and hiring.

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I completely agree with that. So
first, why do you think so

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many companies tend to spend time and
money and recruiting rather than engagement and retention.

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I think the phrase, you know, it's a complicated question, but

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I think one of the things that
I saw in my my experience, so

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I was with an employee engagement a
large global agency for close to nine years.

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And one of the things I saw
in that space which led, you

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know, to what I'm doing now, is the fact that, you know,

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engagement is such a nebulous, you
know kind of you know thing that

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companies are trying to you know,
achieve, right, So there's different many

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different definitions, and companies you know
look at you know, surveys and other

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other factors to try to figure out
what, you know, what fully engages

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their employees. And as we see
from the results of it last you know,

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let's just take fifteen years, engagement
really hasn't budged. It's still at

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a pretty you know, pretty nominal, uh, pretty kind of a pathetic

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level, at around thirty two to
thirty three percent globally. So one of

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the things I think that you organizational
leaders you know, look at is the

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fact that you know, they really
haven't figured out a solution for this,

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you know, to really drive engagement. They they can identify who is engaged

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who is not engaged, but any
any actionable kind of follow through to figure

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out how to actually increase it has
not. It's kind of fallen on that's

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on the wayside. So I think
from a standpoint of looking at you know,

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the you know, acquisition side of
things, it's a lot more concrete,

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and it's a lot more you know, it's a little sexier. Proposition

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for organizations is to look at,
you know, trying to hire that,

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you know, to try to hire
that you know, someone who someone who

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is you know, in a very
attractive position coming from another, you know,

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another competitive organization or you know someone
who's considered that kind of you know,

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hypo or rock star uh, you
know, rockstar leader, opposed to

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looking internally and seeing how they can
potentially develop someone that they you know,

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that they might not might not you
know, be able to address at this

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time because the fact of lack of
lack of data and insights to be able

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to do that. I know this. I'm not sure if that answered your

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question directly, but so, you
know, I just I just think it's

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one of those factors where I don't
think they know how to do it.

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I really I think they you know, they HR has taken the lead on

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doing surveys, but surveys it's the
same thing as you know, taking your

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cholesterolll year over year. You can
you can look what your cholestero is,

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or you can look at what your
what your weight is. But if you

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don't have any action plans on,
you know, any mitigation plans on how

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to address that from a wellness perspective
or a weight perspective, or uh,

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you know, even even from a
prescription perspective, you're not going to be

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able to lower, you know,
lower lower your you know, cholestero or

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weight. And it's the same thing
with engagement. You know, they it's

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a it's a number they you know. Unfortunately, companies organizations have turned engagement

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from a verb to a noun,
and that's where the biggest and I think

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that's where the biggest mistake has has
fallen upon us over the last you know,

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five ten years, is that it's
one of those things where you know,

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they benchmark it every year, but
other than that, they really don't

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do anything to help improve the situation. Mm hmm, got it, Matt.

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And that was that was There was
a lot that you gave in that

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answer. Thank you. Just a
couple of things in response. One,

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I really appreciate that you distinguish that
it is easier to be able to address

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recruiting than it is engagement because there's
a person missing. We need the person,

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and that's easier to see sometimes than
the extent to which there is discretionary

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effort being put forth in an organization
and things are really getting done in the

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most effective efficient way. Totally get
that. So that that gives our listeners

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some access, I think to this
topic in a way that maybe they didn't

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before. And second, I do
think it's fair for me to say that

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I began my human capital career almost
twenty years ago as in the recruiting space.

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So I made a very good living
in recruiting, Thank you very much

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so, and I appreciate my fellow
recruiters today. I just think that to

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your to your perspective, I think
there's another way that organizations youd be looking

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at human capital and how they're going
about developing it and encouraging it to give

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their best during the day that they're
there. Yeah, I agree, and

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I'm in recruiting. You know,
don't take it the wrong way. Of

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recruiting is incredibly important, and this
you know, certainly with you know the

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fact there's always going to be you
know, there's always going to be attrition,

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and it's going to you know,
you're going to have your you know,

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your your folks that you know,
you're regrettable turnover and you're you know,

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unregrettable turnover, and so there's always
going to be the need to you

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know, to demand the pipeline,
uh, you know for you know,

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for future growth and you know folks
that are going to be on tap for

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where you know, the future mission, values and vision of the organization.

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And you know, having high skill
talent and talent that you know hopefully is

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engaged in what your organization is doing
is critical. But it should be looked

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at the same way where marketers look
at you know, customers and the customer

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life cycle and and that's really where
it falls down, you know, from

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an internal organizational standpoint, they don't
look at it the same way you know

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they they it's it's very uh,
it's very tactical opposed to being a strategic

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more of a strategic endeavor. And
that's where hr sometimes not their fault,

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but they're tasked with you know a
lot of the you know, recruitment and

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retention issues, but they don't have
necessarily you know, the dota line to

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a lot of the folks that really
make you know, sernable difference and you

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know, and championing and proselytizing,
you know, at the top of the

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organization, you know, they're kind
of left in a left in a vacuum,

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try to solve all themselves without the
resources and budget and so on and

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so forth. So, uh,
it's a yeah, it's it's you know,

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I don't envy the problem that they
have. We're trying to hopefully help

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them somewhat here and you know,
so we can do a little bit here.

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That's you know, that's what we're
trying to do. Well, I'm

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right, man, That's what you
and I are both up to here,

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right, That's what we get up
in the morning, right, We're here

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to help. But what you just
said about the people at the top not

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being maybe being able or even throughout
the organization being able to proselytize the mission

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of the organization, maybe maybe that
gets to you. Cite a very interesting

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figure when one of your articles by
corn Faerry that by it says, by

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two thousand and thirty, the talent
shorts will result in a two point three

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I think it's a million, billion, trillion, trip brilliant trillion dollar unrealized

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annual revenues Okay, three trillion dollar
unrealized annual revenues. Okay, so first,

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what does that really tell us?
What does that mean? What that's

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saying is from the lack of having
the right people in the right positions and

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having you know, and maybe you
know, being short on you know,

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certain roles within a within a you
know, a team division or you know

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project, you know you're losing out
not only on the you know, the

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productivity standpoint, but also you know, the intellectual capital. I think actually

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has a you know that's always a
very qualitative subjective measure, but I think

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you know, having folks that you
know that that understand and are calibrated to

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the mission and you know, again
are engaged in the mission of the company.

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Uh, when you have high turnover, we're not filling the right positions.

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Everybody's exposed at that point. And
you know, we've we've found a

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lot of our research when you know, when teams are down, you know,

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either managers are down and filling in
other territories or filling in other departments.

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That's sustainable for short periods of time. Everybody can kind of say,

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listen, we can all pull up
for bootstraps and help out but when it

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goes to it extended periods because of
the lack of you know, feeling of

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certain roles and having high quality leadership, that that takes its toll. And

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that's that's when you start to see
you know, burnout, and you know,

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just basically looking at the fact that
you know, they're going to look

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for other other positions that they're you
know, getting paid you know, the

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same or more with with maybe less
responsibility or less you know, burden of

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what they need, you know,
what's put upon them. I totally get

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that, Matt. Just this afternoon, I'm having a conversation with a company

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here in Dallas that I'm working with
has that very same problem. The attrition

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is out the door, off the
charts, and people are just tired of

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watching a revolving door and picking up
where somebody left off. And you know,

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it's just it's a problem that's completely
aspiring out of control. So hence

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the dialogue. Now that gets me
to this next question that I want to

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ask you at by the way,
Matt, So, one of the things

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you said on the phone, which
I thought was really interesting, is that

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you said companies are afraid to discover
what employees want and need seems crazy to

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me. Why would they be afraid
to know? Yeah, it does seem

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crazy. Well, you know,
I don't necessarily have you know, the

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the quantitative you know that. I
mean, we've done a lot of uh

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you know, a lot of research
on this and talk to a lot of

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folks and had a lot of focus
groups and and you know, and through

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our assessment, you know, it
reveals a lot of things. But I

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think one of the biggest reasons is, you know, they're they're afraid that

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they won't be able to if they
find out what, you know, what

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where the gaps are for you know, that fulfillment and alignment for you know,

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for their employees, that they won't
be able to meet the needs because

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maybe they feel like they won't have
you know, the resources, the time,

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the budget, you know, the
you know, whether it's a learning

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platform or learning you know learning uh, you know learning elements that you're included.

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I think there just you know,
it's it's the same thing I find

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when uh, you know training,
you know trainings. Look, you know,

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does a training indiative for you know, a sales launcher for employee based

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It's very far in few between that
you know, the really go the extra

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yard to find out the ROI on
that because they're afraid that what if it

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doesn't what if it what if it
doesn't turn out that you know, they

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find anything that that with you know, they really drove any actionable impact or

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objectory or business results, and then
it's kind of put upon them that,

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you know, the program was wasn't
a success. So I think the exposure

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to an organization if they if they
find, if they find they don't have

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the environmental factors that they can change
or do anything with to actually you know,

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create that alignment for their employees.
Uh, you know they're fully exposed.

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But you know if they don't,
if they don't, if they don't

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measure it, they'll never know what
to do. I mean they yes,

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I mean they they definitely could could
have them, and they probably do have

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them somewhere. They might not be
really available or not might not be communicated

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the way they should be saying on
boarding or other you know, the other

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areas of the you know, the
organization. But you know, if they

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hide from it, they're never going
to be able to improve. It's always

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going to kind of stay the same. You know, they're going to stay

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the same, you know, kind
of just basically lackluster point in time.

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So I think it's I think it's
just great they don't you know, they

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don't they don't have what an employee
would actually want. Well, I think

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your point about, man, this
is so great for our listeners. So

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listeners catch this what he's saying here. So it's far better for us to

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know what's what stands in the way
of our employees being engaged in getting what

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they really want from work that it
is not to know and not be able

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to have take any action from that. But I also want to recognize that

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I do understand, I can appreciate
that's that can be a terribly overwhelming thought

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for an organization or a leader to
go, well, gosh, what if

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we find out that they want twenty
six things and we can give them too.

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I understand that. I think that
gives our listeners something to be able

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to stand in too. So thanks
Matt, that was great. Sure,

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Okay, so before we go on
break here, I want to get one

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more question in here. But that
I that I think really totally expands the

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conversation, at least from my vantage
point from what I'm doing on the show.

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And that is that you talk about
engagement as being being the legging indicator

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of performance in companies, not the
leading indicator. I I love that,

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and I agree, but say more
sure so when employees measure engagement or satisfaction,

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sometimes they you know, they're they're
exchange you know, their exchangeable kind

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of terms. You know, they're
they're they're really looking at you know,

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kind of past occurrences from what their
experiences are within your organization. You know,

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whether they feel you know, leadership
is communicating whether they feel like their

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benefits plans have been up to par
you know, in the past. It's

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all it's all things that are you
know, that are that are past focus

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and not looking at something that's predicting
what employees want or desire or what will

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be kind of future trends that they
can get ahead of it. They're always

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you know, working working in kind
of you know, in past time in

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order to you know, try to
you know, up the anny with what

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they're doing. And then a lot
of times what they find is, you

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know, by the time they make
any moves on, you know, what

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they find through a you know,
through a through a survey or you know,

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just working with with employee groups that
they're already behind where they need to

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go. So and so with motivation, we're you know, looking at you

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know, the predictors of what someone
desires. It's it's showing what someone you

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know, what someone wants future,
why is not what someone had in the

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past. Mm hmmm. We're gonna
talk a little bit more about that,

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but let's go ahead and grab our
first break if we can. Matt,

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I'm your host, Alice Cortez.
We're on the air with Matt Johnson,

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the founder and CEO of motive X
Solutions. He joins you today from Philadelphia.

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We've been talking about the problem of
employee engagement in the workplace. After

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the break, we're going to get
into some of the opportunities there are to

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address it. Stay with us,
we'll be right back. Alise Cortes is

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a speaker and engagement and development catalyst. She designs and delivers professional development,

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leadership and engagement workshops and can bring
her expertise to your organization. She will

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help ignite meaningful development within your workforce
that will increase employee engagement, performance and

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retention. To learn more or to
invite Elise to speak to your organization,

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please visit her at www dot Elisecortes
dot com. She would welcome the opportunity

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to help get your employees working on
purpose. This is working on Purpose with

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00:16:41.759 --> 00:16:45.360
Elise Cortes. To reach our program
today, send an email to a lease

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00:16:45.720 --> 00:16:56.519
Alic at Aleasecortes dot com. Now
back to working on purpose. Thanks for

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seeing with us, and welcome back
to working on purpose. If you're just

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joining us. My guest does Matt
Johnson, the founder and CEO of motive

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X. He and his team are
on a mission disrupt the very way organizations

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approach retention, change management, and
leadership development. I'm your host at Least

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Cortes. So, Matt, just
before the break, we were talking a

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bit about, you know why engagement
is the is the lagging indicator of performance.

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I want to get into something a
little bit more deep that I think

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is really important for our listeners to
understand, because, as you said,

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engagement seems like it's just it's kind
of it's this sort of abstract idea,

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this concept that they don't really have
a lot of access to. So we

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want to give them access to the
to the topic in a way that opens

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it for them. So you distinguish
how organizations measure engagement and satisfaction. Though,

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motivation is important to understand because it
draws on underlying psychological factors that inspire

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employees to bring persistence, intensity,
and discretionary effort toward a particular goal or

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set of goals, which, of
course I see the same thing from the

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work that I do. Tell us
more about that. Distinguish those those pieces

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for us. Sure, A good
example is, you know, take the

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motivation of recognition. So you know, typically what would be just give an

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example, what typically is is look
dot on a survey or opposed on the

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survey to employees whether job satisfaction,
engagement survey around recognition. Well, we'll

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ask the question, you know,
have you been recognized by your manager in

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the last fourteen days or last thirty
days or something along those lines. And

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where the problem lies is that you
could have the whole organization say no,

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we haven't, I haven't been recognized. The company kind of panics and said,

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you know, we need to spend
you know, one hundreds of thousands

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or even millions of dollars on you
know, trying to create the culture recognition.

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We're falling down on that, and
we don't They're not asking the question

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though, how much do you care
about it? How much does that how

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much does recognition drive your day to
day uh, you know, motivation,

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productivity and everything else you know around
it. So it's it's you know,

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the one thing that I've seen in
my experience in the kind of enterprise engagement

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space is that not only you know, I think or looking at you know,

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companies are looking at the wrong measurements, but they're also when they do

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find something, they create this you
know, kind of umbrella approach to everything,

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which then maybe accounts for forty percent
of the population, but the other

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sixty is like, well, we
didn't ask for this, we don't want

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this, and this is actually you
know, taking away from you know,

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things that I actually we do,
you know, like desire and or motivated

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buy and whatnot. So it just
just not not enough drilled down for what

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you know, actually people care about. Mm hmmm, I completely agree with

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that. I failed to also mention
that I spent about three years working for

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also an employee engagement organization, which
is I learned a lot and I love

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the work and I consider the work
that I'm doing today to help people discover

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their passion, inspiration, purpose to
be really a growth component of what I

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was doing then. So I want
to say that I've been in that space

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too, and I love it.
Okay, I want to go on next

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to the idea of extrinsic and intrins
motivation for our listeners. I think most

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of us have heard those terms before. I studied them myself, but distinguish

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them for us. Sure, you
know, starting with extrinsics. So extrinsic

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is things that are kind of outside
of us that that create you know,

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can create you know, drive,
purpose and motivation. You know, things

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like salary benefits could be even things
like you know, uh title, you

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know, looking at wanting to you
know, be promoted. H a lot

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of you know, a lot of
care and stick. We've heard. There's

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those turns before a lot of the
things that you know, extrinsic rewards that

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mentioned a lot, and there are
things like you know, when a company

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goes above over and above kind of
the you know traditional comper salary where they're

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you know, providing points programs or
gift cards or you know, travel and

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centive programs. Uh. The punitive
side is you know, things like you

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know, if you're if you don't
get this project on time you're going to

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go on a plan or you're you
know, you're you're not gonna be able

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to You're not gonna be able to
you know, you're gonna have to you

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know, work the next you know, ten saturdays. So extrinsic is really

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outside for us. Is that impact
you know, your motivators and you know

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things that affect your kind of day
to day work life, right, and

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they're also in personal life too,
But just we're talking about you know,

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in the workplace where we're intrinsic motivators
are things that are you know, inherent

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in someone. So this is kind
of what what cats you up in the

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morning is kind of the best way
to think about this. These are things

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that are coming from within and you're
doing initiative or task or project because of

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the fact that it gives you pleasure. You know, it provides learning opportunities,

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it provides growth, and you're doing
it because of the fact that you

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know it could be reasons, uh
for you know, collaboration, because you

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enjoy working with your team, you
know, your teammates or your colleagues,

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or the fact that you know you're
altruistic and you enjoy you know, mentoring

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you know, new employees or other
ones that you've you know, kind of

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taken under your wing because you've experienced
certain things. So you're doing it because

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of the fact that it's just inherent
who you are, and it actually you

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know, creates kind of that that
you know, alignment and purpose in your

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dated life. M hm. And
that really gets of course to the stuff

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that I like to talk about,
right. So part of the reason that

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I wanted to have you on the
show, Matt is I think that the

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whole motivation for me, it speaks
to it's the juice of life, right,

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It's the stuff that fires life,
and so of course we want to

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be able to get access to that
and be able to find a way to

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unleash it, if you will,
and nurture it. And thus, therefore

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you say that motivation is the leading
indicator and predictive of engagement, satisfaction,

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and whether or not somebody intends to
leave an organization. Completely agree. And

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you also went on to say in
one of the articles that it really does

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get to more of the core of
the person whatever matters to them. So

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say a little bit more about that, and then I want to comment as

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well. Sure, So when you
talk about motivation, let's well stay on

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the intrinsic kind, So the inherent
kind and that and again intrinsic motivators.

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You know, a few examples that
people might be aware from recent literature from

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you know, the Dan Pinks of
the World and some other behavior royal economists

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and such, or things like autonomy, collaboration, a sense of purpose learning,

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you know, mastery learning, things
of that nature. Recognition is a

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big one. So the whole thing
around motivation is it's one thing to know

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what motivates someone, right, So
that's that's Yeah, if I at least

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if I know that you're motivated by
you know, collaboration working in teams,

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that's great. But if you don't
have the opportunity to tap into that in

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your current workplace, that's a big
disconnect. So the whole thing here,

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and I know you're a big fan
of looking at fulfillment and alignment for for

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folks in the you know, in
the workplace, it's creating those It's really

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about the fact that we all have
our motivators whatever, whatever strong you know,

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some are stronger than others. And
the fact is instead of managers trying

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to you know, quote unquote motivate
you by saying you need to do that.

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It's understanding your motivators and it's really
looking at how do you enhance or

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change the environment to meet those motivators
you already have. So that's a much

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you know, and in behro economics
terms, it's called you know, that's

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called the restraint. You know,
there's a driving forces and the restraining forces,

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and they're more of the environmental fact
environmental factors of someone who loves to

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if you love to collaborate, it's
you know, giving you more situations to

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work in teams, or to pick
who you can work with on a project,

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you know, to lead a project, those type of things. So

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you know, that's really what it
is. It's a lot easier to you

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know, tap into the environment than
is to try to change you the person.

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You know, you already have your
motivators. Yeah, and and so

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there's two things I'd say to that
then if I can, Matt. So

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One is you know, would that
that requires that the manager or the leader

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know the person right, what are
what are those key intrinsic motivators for them?

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What what what is it that lights
their fire? And then two what

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I find so amazing is you know, it's so easy to be able to

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help employee and it's not easy.
It's part of your languaging and you need

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to learn how to do it.
I don't want to say it take that

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away from it, but to be
able to help people understand how their their

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individual role fits into the overall execution
of the organization's mission. And when you

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can do that, when you can
language that intrinsically, that really opens a

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space. And just quickly, I
was out at a networking event last week

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and I was talking to a woman
and I asked what she did and she

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said, well, I work in
a mortgage business and I'm a and I

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said, so you make people's dreams
come true. And she stood there and

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she looked back and she went,
yeah, I guess so I said,

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well, why don't you introduce yourself
with that? And you know it was

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just she goes, I don't think
about it that way during the day because

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I get caught up in the in
the weeds. I'm like, I totally

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get that. But you know,
that's to me, that's one of the

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examples of how to tap into the
existing environment and language something that's already there

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to connect it in a way that
elicits that or taps into that intrinsic motivation.

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It's just it's there, you just
have to tap into it. I

397
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totally agree. Absolutely, it's a
beautiful thing. Yeah, yeah, and

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00:26:03.400 --> 00:26:04.880
it's it's not that hard, but
I do you do have to get into

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the habit of it. And that's
part of what I work with when I'm

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doing leadership development as well. Okay, the next thing that you talked about,

401
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which I think is gold and Matt, I love that the way you

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handle this and the way you address
this, you and your team. So

403
00:26:17.680 --> 00:26:21.359
you talk about how the Gallop engagement
tool does not have a pull through plan

404
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on the difficiency of the engagement results. So I don't know that I've ever

405
00:26:25.920 --> 00:26:30.559
heard the term pull through plan.
So let's talk about that. Sure,

406
00:26:30.640 --> 00:26:32.839
So, and I don't want to
it's a single out Gallop. I mean

407
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Gallops their survey. You know it's
been you know, it's been kind of

408
00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:40.480
the foremost employee engagement survey for you
know, for a couple of decades.

409
00:26:40.480 --> 00:26:45.640
Now. What happens in those surveys
and whether it's Gallop or another you know,

410
00:26:45.640 --> 00:26:48.680
another consultancy that's the survey is that
you know, typically they'll they'll provide

411
00:26:48.680 --> 00:26:53.039
the you know, leadership or hr
you know where the results are. And

412
00:26:53.640 --> 00:26:56.119
not always, but you know,
most of the time, you know,

413
00:26:56.160 --> 00:27:00.000
they kind of just leave the you
know, and now it's electronic, but

414
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:03.039
before it was a you know,
a big, big pile of reports you

415
00:27:03.079 --> 00:27:07.799
know, to both kind of lovely
admire and realize, well, what do

416
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:10.759
I do next? So it's really
the what do I do next? From

417
00:27:10.799 --> 00:27:12.759
an actionable standpoint. So when you
talk about pull through, it's looking at

418
00:27:14.039 --> 00:27:17.680
you know, if I find out
there's a deficiency within you know, recognition,

419
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:22.759
or within you know leadership, communication, and or within uh you know,

420
00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:25.960
say there's you know a gap in
the fact that there's you know,

421
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:29.559
not very a very autonomous environment at
the organization. There's you know, kind

422
00:27:29.559 --> 00:27:33.839
of a micromanaging kind of a culture
there. Like the whole thing of what

423
00:27:33.880 --> 00:27:37.440
do you do next? How do
you create you know, not only a

424
00:27:37.480 --> 00:27:41.920
systematic, you know kind of organization
enterprise wide approach, but how how can

425
00:27:41.960 --> 00:27:47.799
you work with you know, individual
frontline leaders and managers for them to kind

426
00:27:47.799 --> 00:27:49.480
of lean into their situation because everybody
situations will be a little different, right,

427
00:27:49.519 --> 00:27:52.119
So and you're also if you wait
for the organization, especially if it's

428
00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:56.960
a you know, Fortune five hundred
company with fifty thousand employees, you know,

429
00:27:56.039 --> 00:28:00.160
it may take three years for them
to you know, create that systematic

430
00:28:00.240 --> 00:28:03.799
change for some of the things that
are considered efficiencies in organization. So it's

431
00:28:03.799 --> 00:28:07.039
a lot easier for a manager to
look at those things and kind of pick

432
00:28:07.079 --> 00:28:10.279
the low hanging fruit and say,
well, you know, I can I

433
00:28:10.279 --> 00:28:12.880
can make incremental changes by you know, shifting this or changing that, or

434
00:28:14.319 --> 00:28:18.440
doing my best to be you know, taking the you know, corporate communication

435
00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:22.119
and kind of translating it for my
team. Uh so they understand the why

436
00:28:22.160 --> 00:28:23.400
behind while we're doing things, or
at least, you know, at least

437
00:28:23.480 --> 00:28:26.559
as far as you know, we
can, we can you know, gather.

438
00:28:26.720 --> 00:28:30.880
So so I think that's that's the
biggest issue is again it's it's you

439
00:28:30.880 --> 00:28:36.480
can lovely admire you know, your
your eighty one score and your engagement score,

440
00:28:36.599 --> 00:28:40.200
but to increase that to an eighty
five for the next year, it's

441
00:28:40.240 --> 00:28:44.119
it's doing those things that actually you
know, create that you know, that

442
00:28:44.279 --> 00:28:48.640
positive behavior change, and that's what
usually is lacking. Mm hmm, Okay,

443
00:28:49.400 --> 00:28:55.160
two things, if maybe one one
for sure one is that I hear

444
00:28:55.200 --> 00:28:57.960
this all the time when I'm wor
here with organizations about their leadership development and

445
00:28:57.960 --> 00:29:00.880
what I'm trying to help with,
and when we talk about if they do

446
00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:07.240
do an employee engagement survey. I
am astonished at the number of organizations who

447
00:29:07.279 --> 00:29:11.640
don't share even just base level results
with the whole team. They don't even

448
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:12.720
know. There's a big old vacuum
out there. I have no idea.

449
00:29:14.000 --> 00:29:17.119
Well, that Engagius story that we
took way back in January, what happened

450
00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:19.720
with that? I mean, what's
your what's your perspective on that? Yeah,

451
00:29:19.839 --> 00:29:22.680
I used to see that a lot
with I mean, I still see

452
00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:25.519
it. But when I was with
when I was with my former company that

453
00:29:25.559 --> 00:29:27.519
you know, we would actually come
in a lot of times and and do

454
00:29:27.559 --> 00:29:33.240
a lot of the tactical and the
strategic efforts to do the pull through for

455
00:29:33.400 --> 00:29:37.559
the results or the you know,
fishing efficiencies they would see. So,

456
00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:38.640
you know, so what happens there, You know, when you when you

457
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:45.000
have those times where the organization waits
four months or they never you know a

458
00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:48.559
lot of times that they never see
or hear the results of the you know,

459
00:29:48.599 --> 00:29:52.400
of the survey and and that,
and then the companies wonder why participation

460
00:29:52.519 --> 00:29:56.440
is down, you know, year
after year. Why you know, people

461
00:29:56.799 --> 00:30:00.400
have that kind of mantra click click
five to survive where the you the results

462
00:30:02.039 --> 00:30:03.880
or organic or they're not you know, they're not really you can't really trust

463
00:30:03.920 --> 00:30:07.640
the results because you know, people
are just saying, you know, kind

464
00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:08.319
of screw it. You know,
if they're not going to do anything about

465
00:30:08.319 --> 00:30:11.119
it, why should I care about
this? And just you know, just

466
00:30:11.160 --> 00:30:15.799
click click click, and so you
know, one of the things one of

467
00:30:15.799 --> 00:30:18.519
the mechanisms that you know, companies
are starting to do a little more or

468
00:30:18.559 --> 00:30:22.039
what you know, some of the
uh the companies that are that are building

469
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:26.920
in you know, whether it's pulse
surveys or other types of you know,

470
00:30:26.240 --> 00:30:33.720
is at least having a quick hit
report for the individuals that they can least

471
00:30:33.759 --> 00:30:37.880
see, you know, whether it's
you know, their team information or whether

472
00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:41.519
it's their own personal information, how
it compares to the rest of the organization

473
00:30:41.640 --> 00:30:45.079
or the rest of their team.
And so that doesn't make an excuse not

474
00:30:45.279 --> 00:30:48.920
to you know, have a deep
dive dive into you know, what the

475
00:30:48.960 --> 00:30:52.720
company is going to do to you
know, kind of try to create solutions

476
00:30:52.720 --> 00:30:56.839
for the big problems in the organization
or or at least communicate that they acknowledge

477
00:30:56.839 --> 00:30:59.200
those kind of get the elephant out
of the room on those. So,

478
00:30:59.680 --> 00:31:00.960
you know, that's one of the
things again where I think there's a disconnect

479
00:31:00.960 --> 00:31:04.240
between HR and leadership. Where leadership
a lot of times when it comes to

480
00:31:04.279 --> 00:31:07.559
engagement and other types of you know, assessments that are related to that,

481
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:11.599
it's kind of like a clickbox,
right, this is something we need to

482
00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:14.200
you know, we need to do
annually. But do they really are they

483
00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:17.400
leaning into that, are they championing
that? Are they on the side of

484
00:31:17.440 --> 00:31:18.759
the HR to say, hey,
listen, when we get these results back,

485
00:31:18.920 --> 00:31:22.440
you know, we need a steer
committee that's going to communicate out to

486
00:31:22.599 --> 00:31:26.240
each of the divisions of the teams
and saying that, hey, we got

487
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:29.079
the results. We're going to be
communicating these in the next couple of weeks

488
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:32.160
for the next you know, within
thirty days, and then we went you

489
00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:34.599
know, folks from kind of the
ground level to be part of that as

490
00:31:34.640 --> 00:31:40.119
well, to get people, you
know, get people you know kind of

491
00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:44.359
entrenched into the organizational mission. You
know, they can they can be part

492
00:31:44.400 --> 00:31:48.720
of you know, the changes in
the organization. So that's really still very

493
00:31:48.799 --> 00:31:53.640
that's extremely far and few between at
this point, still unfortunately, but you

494
00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:59.200
know, at least some of the
initial you know, the initial reporting of

495
00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.599
individual data is being put out there, so at least it gives, you

496
00:32:02.599 --> 00:32:06.240
know, at least it's it's one
of those things that at least kind of

497
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:07.599
keeps the worse from the door for
a little bit until they can get,

498
00:32:08.079 --> 00:32:12.839
you know, a bigger swap of
data and report that. Yes, And

499
00:32:12.920 --> 00:32:15.640
I'll just quickly comment, I want
to make sure and acknowledge this because I've

500
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:19.000
worked with I work with many many
leaders on these kinds of issues and in

501
00:32:19.039 --> 00:32:23.640
their own development, I do recognize
that an employee engagement report can really indicate

502
00:32:23.920 --> 00:32:28.200
and show something of a leader that
maybe he or she isn't really ready to

503
00:32:28.359 --> 00:32:31.960
share publicly, that they maybe don't
communicate well, or they don't give enough

504
00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:36.000
praise or whatever it is. And
I really want to recognize and acknowledge,

505
00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:38.960
you know, it's it's being a
leader is not for the faint of heart,

506
00:32:39.000 --> 00:32:43.680
and I really appreciate the journey that
people are on to develop themselves to

507
00:32:43.680 --> 00:32:46.680
become better leaders. And I don't
want to imply that, you know,

508
00:32:46.759 --> 00:32:51.079
that any judgment or whatnot that you
know if you're not sharing your results.

509
00:32:51.119 --> 00:32:53.400
I do understand why. I just
know that the negative ramifications of not doing

510
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:58.880
it or I think outweigh the good, but recognize maybe some of the why

511
00:32:58.920 --> 00:33:01.240
behind that as well, visually why
people are reticent to share their results.

512
00:33:02.160 --> 00:33:06.799
Yeah, I agree, and with
that, let's grab our last break.

513
00:33:06.839 --> 00:33:10.079
Matt goes by, so fast,
doesn't it. I'm Elise Cortez, your

514
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:13.359
host. We've r in the air
with Matt Johnson. He is the founder

515
00:33:13.440 --> 00:33:16.000
and CEO of motive X. You
Don't It? Today from Philadelphia, we've

516
00:33:16.039 --> 00:33:21.279
been talking a bit about the opportunity
that organizations have to really address employee engagement.

517
00:33:21.559 --> 00:33:23.519
After the break, we're going to
talk about what companies can do armed

518
00:33:23.519 --> 00:33:27.599
with the knowledge of what motivates their
workforce. Stay with us, We'll be

519
00:33:27.680 --> 00:33:52.440
right back. Alice Cortez is a
speaker and engagement and development catalyst. She

520
00:33:52.559 --> 00:33:58.359
designs and delivers professional development, leadership
and engagement workshops and can bring her expertise

521
00:33:58.440 --> 00:34:04.720
to your organization help ignite meaningful development
within your workforce that will increase employee engagement,

522
00:34:04.839 --> 00:34:07.800
performance and retention. To learn more
or to invite Elise to speak to

523
00:34:07.840 --> 00:34:14.559
your organization. Please visit her at
www dot Elisecortes dot com. She would

524
00:34:14.639 --> 00:34:24.320
welcome the opportunity to help get your
employees working on purpose. This is working

525
00:34:24.360 --> 00:34:30.199
on Purpose with Elise Cortes. To
reach our program today, send an email

526
00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:37.760
to a lease Alise at Aleasecortes dot
com. Now back to working on purpose.

527
00:34:38.719 --> 00:34:42.320
Thanks for staying with us, and
welcome back to working on purpose.

528
00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:45.239
If you're just tuning in, My
guest is Matt Johnson. He's the founder

529
00:34:45.239 --> 00:34:47.480
and CEO of motive X. He
and his team are on a mission to

530
00:34:47.480 --> 00:34:52.159
disrupt the way organizations approach retention,
change management, and leadership development. I'm

531
00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:54.800
your host, Atlise Cortes. Love
what you're up to. By the way,

532
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:59.079
Matt, that's fantastic. I'm with
you. Thank you, You're welcome.

533
00:34:59.599 --> 00:35:01.840
So I hope that this next thing
that we're going to talk about is

534
00:35:01.960 --> 00:35:07.639
encouraging to our listeners. I hope
that this gives them pause to consider that

535
00:35:07.679 --> 00:35:10.039
there really is something in here for
them, and that is I read in

536
00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:15.119
one of the articles that you that
you have out that it's about the future

537
00:35:15.199 --> 00:35:19.840
leader, and that future leaders tell
their managers stop trying to motivate your people

538
00:35:20.239 --> 00:35:28.039
instead put them in situations where they
are motivating themselves. Yeah, I think

539
00:35:28.039 --> 00:35:30.639
this is you know, this is
really what we've found from our research,

540
00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:32.639
you know, because what we're what
we're measuring in our you know, in

541
00:35:32.679 --> 00:35:37.159
our assessment tools, is that we're
measuring not only what someone desires or you

542
00:35:37.159 --> 00:35:42.000
know, what their ideal motivators are, but what they're getting out of the

543
00:35:42.039 --> 00:35:44.239
current workplace. Like I mentioned earlier, So it's really looking at that.

544
00:35:44.360 --> 00:35:46.800
You know that it's that misalignment,
your gap between what I want and what

545
00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:51.639
I'm getting. And so if you
just provide a little bit more what you

546
00:35:51.639 --> 00:35:53.239
know from those time motivators, if
you provide if there's a gap there,

547
00:35:53.239 --> 00:35:58.400
if you can you know, if
you can provide your employees with more of

548
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:00.639
that, you know, whether it's
learning out opportunities that they're you know high

549
00:36:00.679 --> 00:36:05.119
in learning, uh, you know
recognition, if there's a gap within recognition,

550
00:36:06.199 --> 00:36:07.519
you know, things like collaboration.
We mentioned earlier about you know,

551
00:36:07.559 --> 00:36:14.039
creating more more you know, teamwork
environments or opportunities for collaboration and teamwork.

552
00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:17.000
So's it's the things you know,
and what we found in our especially when

553
00:36:17.039 --> 00:36:22.719
we have those kind of stakeholder leadership, you know, kind of consoles.

554
00:36:22.039 --> 00:36:25.559
Yeah, after the assessment is that
there's there's so many elements. I mean

555
00:36:25.599 --> 00:36:29.760
basically what I what, you know, what our what our team does when

556
00:36:29.800 --> 00:36:31.239
we sit down with our you know, sit down with our clients is really

557
00:36:31.239 --> 00:36:35.639
get them talking. You know,
get enough constituents in the room, whether

558
00:36:35.679 --> 00:36:38.079
it's you know, folks from marketing
HR. You know, we can get

559
00:36:38.280 --> 00:36:42.119
a CFO or a CEO or you
know, if it's a mid sized company,

560
00:36:42.119 --> 00:36:45.159
we can get the CEO in the
room, but get them talking about

561
00:36:45.159 --> 00:36:47.199
things. And what ends up happening
is really they come to realize there's a

562
00:36:47.199 --> 00:36:51.920
lot of a lot of things that
they can you know that I call it

563
00:36:51.920 --> 00:36:55.920
the low hanging fruit, that they
can make small changes that would affect a

564
00:36:55.960 --> 00:36:59.920
lot of what they're seeing. And
the kind of the I don't I hate

565
00:36:59.920 --> 00:37:02.519
to called negative results because it's really
the assessment not punitive. It's really just

566
00:37:02.840 --> 00:37:07.639
it's really kind of exposing where the
disconnects are within the organization from a motivational

567
00:37:07.679 --> 00:37:12.159
standpoint. But if you're able to
identify those, then then you can put

568
00:37:12.280 --> 00:37:15.679
people in better positions from a standpoint. If there's a gap in learning,

569
00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:21.679
you know, to create more more
learning opportunities and have them lean into their

570
00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:25.679
you know, into their motivators that
they actually desire and care about. Okay,

571
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:29.880
So I love that, and in
fact, I thank you for letting

572
00:37:29.920 --> 00:37:31.239
me take your assessment. And let's
just talk a little bit about that,

573
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:34.239
because again, what I want to
do here, Matt is I want to

574
00:37:34.239 --> 00:37:37.840
give our listeners as much actionable access
to this stuff as we can, to

575
00:37:37.920 --> 00:37:42.679
open the space so they can see
how they can move the dial. So

576
00:37:43.000 --> 00:37:49.039
your assessment measures ten along ten motivational
dimensions, and obviously, for me am

577
00:37:49.039 --> 00:37:52.679
no surprise, the mind team up
very high for autonomy and learning Shark.

578
00:37:53.039 --> 00:37:55.440
I learned so much by doing this
radio show. That's why I do it

579
00:37:55.440 --> 00:38:00.320
Twitter and twenty six episodes in.
But I want to talk about how leaders

580
00:38:00.320 --> 00:38:04.719
and companies can use their results to
create that more compelling work scenario and environments

581
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:08.119
to increase motivation. So let's get
specific. So let's say that somebody is

582
00:38:08.199 --> 00:38:14.679
high in autonomy and innovation for their
motivation. So what could a leader do

583
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:17.519
to address those motivational needs in the
work environment or their job assignment or even

584
00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:21.840
the team dynamics. Sure, so
we do it you know, so our

585
00:38:21.840 --> 00:38:23.960
assessment, there's uh, you know, a couple of different components. Sore.

586
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:29.599
There is definitely a team or kind
of a group aggregate approach to looking

587
00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:31.599
at if there's you know, if
there's trends within teams, divisions, or

588
00:38:31.679 --> 00:38:36.400
you know, throughout the enterprise.
And then there's the individual component where a

589
00:38:36.440 --> 00:38:40.480
manager can you focus on the motivators
and the gaps and those motivators with the

590
00:38:40.480 --> 00:38:45.119
individual to kind of create a kind
of a I hate to call a performance

591
00:38:45.159 --> 00:38:47.159
plan. We're not saying this takes
a place of a performance review, but

592
00:38:47.239 --> 00:38:51.559
it certainly can create a conversation that
you know, a lot of times would

593
00:38:51.559 --> 00:38:55.639
be maybe a little difficult conversation or
it could be an anecdotal conversation doesn't provide

594
00:38:55.679 --> 00:39:01.280
necessarily the framework to make changes.
So if it's autonomy where most people would

595
00:39:01.320 --> 00:39:06.559
be a little apprehensive to talk to
the manager about them being a micro manager

596
00:39:06.599 --> 00:39:08.639
and not allowing them to say work
from home once or twice a week,

597
00:39:08.760 --> 00:39:13.679
or to you know, to not
be uh, you know, handheld with

598
00:39:13.760 --> 00:39:16.119
assignments that they you know, that
are they're over their desk all the time

599
00:39:16.119 --> 00:39:20.320
looking at where they are in the
progress. So this basically creates a very

600
00:39:20.320 --> 00:39:24.000
safe environment, you know, for
a manager to be able to see if

601
00:39:24.360 --> 00:39:30.199
there's trends across their teams and to
look at what can we do now that

602
00:39:30.239 --> 00:39:31.800
we see that there's a big gap. You know, Hey, our whole

603
00:39:31.840 --> 00:39:37.119
team wants collaboration or they want innovation, but they feel like they're not getting

604
00:39:37.119 --> 00:39:39.760
it. So let's let's address that. What what can I do as a

605
00:39:39.800 --> 00:39:44.599
manager and what are we maybe is
the organization not providing that we can kind

606
00:39:44.599 --> 00:39:46.719
of hit it, hit it from
both ends, but also how can how

607
00:39:46.719 --> 00:39:50.960
can my team if we sit down
and look at you know, the individual

608
00:39:50.960 --> 00:39:53.800
results and have a conversation with the
team, how can the individuals kind of

609
00:39:53.800 --> 00:39:58.519
from a bottom up approach lean into
those as well. There's a lot of

610
00:39:58.519 --> 00:40:01.719
scenarios that we see with say learning, for example, that yes, the

611
00:40:01.719 --> 00:40:06.599
the organization certainly can provide learning opportunities
when it comes to you know, whether

612
00:40:06.639 --> 00:40:09.119
company has a learning management system provides
you know, the kind of training or

613
00:40:09.159 --> 00:40:15.039
whether you know they offer off site
seminars or continuing education or mentoring. But

614
00:40:15.199 --> 00:40:17.960
a lot of times the individual,
uh, you know, there's a responsibility

615
00:40:19.119 --> 00:40:22.320
there to say listen, you know, I want more learning. You know,

616
00:40:22.400 --> 00:40:24.920
instead of just mentioning something you know, in the lunch room to their

617
00:40:25.039 --> 00:40:28.559
manager, they can put together,
you know, a one page kind of

618
00:40:28.559 --> 00:40:30.719
executive summary that says, here's a
seminar I'd love to go to. Here's

619
00:40:30.719 --> 00:40:34.639
how I think it could have could
you know benefit you know, my my

620
00:40:35.119 --> 00:40:39.039
current and future you know, my
future, you know, situation here in

621
00:40:39.079 --> 00:40:43.199
the organization, and here's where I
think it could help our team and kind

622
00:40:43.199 --> 00:40:45.840
of put together you know, kind
of put together proposal, and not enough

623
00:40:45.840 --> 00:40:52.719
people do that where they you know, basically you know, create hu situations

624
00:40:52.719 --> 00:40:54.880
where a manager will will be taken
seriously you know, or really you know,

625
00:40:54.920 --> 00:40:59.000
look at how could you know this
is something that obviously means something to

626
00:40:59.679 --> 00:41:02.559
themployee or my you know, my
my team, and we need to really

627
00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:07.360
take it seriously. Mm hmm.
Just really quick on that front, Matt.

628
00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:09.679
It's so interesting. I gave an
interview on a show called The Cheeky

629
00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:15.960
Scientist last week, and this is
for is to help PhDs around the world

630
00:41:15.000 --> 00:41:20.679
get more meaningful, well paid work. And the person that was interviewing said

631
00:41:20.719 --> 00:41:23.519
that, you know, if people
that have probably a PhD are maybe more

632
00:41:23.519 --> 00:41:28.119
inclined to and need to learn more
than you know, the average person across

633
00:41:28.159 --> 00:41:30.239
the planet, and I would I
would certainly put myself in that category of

634
00:41:30.320 --> 00:41:34.599
my PhDs in human development. But
the way point being, I love what

635
00:41:34.639 --> 00:41:37.039
you're saying about this notion of well
if this is important to Now what what

636
00:41:37.159 --> 00:41:40.719
I see your the work that you're
doing can do is it opens the dialogue.

637
00:41:40.760 --> 00:41:45.880
So if we now know that one
team member is motivated by autonomy and

638
00:41:46.320 --> 00:41:51.760
learning, Okay, so now what
we've we've now there's a recognition on both

639
00:41:51.800 --> 00:41:54.199
sides of the table that they need
that want that. Okay, Now,

640
00:41:54.360 --> 00:41:57.920
as you say, now, can
we put it on the employee to go

641
00:41:57.960 --> 00:42:01.360
out there and create a proposal or
a training plan for themselves that maybe meets

642
00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:05.639
within the budget or whatever it is
that lets them at least ask for what

643
00:42:05.679 --> 00:42:08.239
they're looking for. And to me, that's that's where the opportunity is.

644
00:42:08.320 --> 00:42:13.400
Right if we can at least get
the employee and the manager talking about what

645
00:42:13.440 --> 00:42:15.840
they want and need and how to
create a better, more compelling environment,

646
00:42:15.880 --> 00:42:22.000
then we're moving the needle exactly.
Yeah, totally great. Okay, Okay,

647
00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:24.639
so you know I can't let you
go without asking the next question,

648
00:42:24.760 --> 00:42:28.159
right, you know, I got
to talk about meaning and purpose because that's

649
00:42:28.159 --> 00:42:34.119
my space. So I know that
when I'm out speaking to audiences that those

650
00:42:34.239 --> 00:42:37.800
really land for people. People are
hungry for me, They're hungry for purpose.

651
00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:43.239
And so I find that organizations that
address that are just they're better situated.

652
00:42:43.400 --> 00:42:49.079
And so what is your perspective or
your experience and how companies can harness

653
00:42:49.119 --> 00:42:53.599
these motivations in the workplace. So
this, you know, the whole idea

654
00:42:53.639 --> 00:42:58.639
around this. I mean we've created
you know, kind of a business case

655
00:42:58.679 --> 00:43:00.519
around you know, how this can
lead to you know, we we actually

656
00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:04.880
have a self contained roy Uh.
We did a whole men analysis of our

657
00:43:04.920 --> 00:43:07.119
pH ds to create you know,
to to look at by closing the get

658
00:43:07.239 --> 00:43:12.400
like closing the gaps even incrementally,
you know, the significance of driving you

659
00:43:12.440 --> 00:43:15.960
know, engagement productivity. Uh,
you know actual numbers for you know,

660
00:43:16.480 --> 00:43:20.800
dollar numbers for you know, turnover
costs and things of that nature. But

661
00:43:20.880 --> 00:43:23.000
the truth, the true, you
know kind of the true mission that we're

662
00:43:23.000 --> 00:43:29.719
on is about creating fulfillment in the
workplace and creating you know, purpose in

663
00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:34.239
the workplace. And when when when
the motivators are aligned, you're starting going

664
00:43:34.280 --> 00:43:37.199
to have, you know, a
much easier time you know, kind of

665
00:43:37.400 --> 00:43:43.480
create reducing that friction for employees to
be you know, in in alignment with

666
00:43:43.519 --> 00:43:45.840
the mission, with the mission value
and and the kind of the meaning of

667
00:43:45.880 --> 00:43:52.519
the organization. So that I think
what you're talking about with meaning and fulfillment

668
00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:55.440
is incredibly important, and it's you
know, it's paramount for what we're what

669
00:43:55.480 --> 00:43:58.920
we're you know, what we're trying
to build here. But a lot of

670
00:43:58.960 --> 00:44:01.000
times from a standpoint of individuals,
they get they get that, but from

671
00:44:01.000 --> 00:44:04.840
a standpoint of the organization, a
lot of times that's too fluffy for them.

672
00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:07.320
Unfortunately, at this point, at
least, I don't think it will.

673
00:44:07.360 --> 00:44:10.880
I don't think it will stay that
way. But unfortunately, when you're

674
00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:15.559
talking to you know, uh,
you know, VP of operations or a

675
00:44:15.559 --> 00:44:19.000
sales leader, uh, they want
to see what can what can it do

676
00:44:19.119 --> 00:44:22.079
to drive you know, retention,
and what can it do to and drive

677
00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:28.119
drive discretionary effort which will then lead
to productivity and sales numbers increases. But

678
00:44:28.159 --> 00:44:31.679
the whole idea here is to create
meaning and purpose for the individuals and which

679
00:44:31.760 --> 00:44:36.199
leads then to all the things we're
talking about. Absolutely, that was the

680
00:44:36.239 --> 00:44:38.079
part that I was going to take
next exactly. So I agree that that

681
00:44:38.280 --> 00:44:42.760
is the you know, really that's
if you have to kind of identify kind

682
00:44:42.760 --> 00:44:45.679
of the singular most important part of
this, it's that's what it's doing.

683
00:44:45.760 --> 00:44:51.079
It's created, it's creating alignment,
meaning and purpose for the individual. Right,

684
00:44:51.159 --> 00:44:53.039
And so how I was going to
bring that over is that, you

685
00:44:53.039 --> 00:44:55.840
know, if we understand what what
is meaning, well, it's what's meaningful

686
00:44:55.920 --> 00:45:00.719
certificate to the to the individual.
And so if learning is to that to

687
00:45:00.800 --> 00:45:02.440
that person, well, then that's
meaningful. And that's how you can map

688
00:45:02.480 --> 00:45:07.000
it over. And that's why I
think what you're doing is so useful because

689
00:45:07.000 --> 00:45:09.960
it really does get to the place
where it can help create a work environment

690
00:45:09.960 --> 00:45:14.320
that is more meaningful, more motivating
for the for the organization, for the

691
00:45:14.360 --> 00:45:16.599
for the individual. And then when
you think that a leader, a big

692
00:45:16.639 --> 00:45:20.280
reason that I'm doing the work that
i'm doing mat is, you know,

693
00:45:20.719 --> 00:45:23.239
work is a really important part of
life. It's about forty percent of our

694
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:28.079
life in fact, and so one
if we can we as leaders, can

695
00:45:28.159 --> 00:45:35.039
create a more meaningful environment that elicits
motivated employees. Wow, we've just impacted

696
00:45:35.079 --> 00:45:37.599
forty percent of their lives. I'm
up for that. And that's that's legacy,

697
00:45:37.639 --> 00:45:42.320
that's contribution, that's making a difference
in the world while you're executing to

698
00:45:42.360 --> 00:45:45.119
the mission. I think that sounds
pretty amazing. It does to me,

699
00:45:45.840 --> 00:45:50.480
right, I'd get up for that. Yeah, all right, we're almost

700
00:45:50.519 --> 00:45:52.599
out of time, mat I want
two more questions if I can, really

701
00:45:52.639 --> 00:45:55.679
quick. So I got to believe
that as you've been doing this work,

702
00:45:55.719 --> 00:46:00.920
that you've stumbled across maybe some interesting
insights or glean something about companies or how

703
00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:06.599
they're managed or human capital, then
maybe you didn't expect anything show up that's

704
00:46:06.639 --> 00:46:10.000
been surprising for you. I think
one of the things, so just to

705
00:46:10.400 --> 00:46:15.119
kind of key on one of our
motivators that typically would not be thought of

706
00:46:15.159 --> 00:46:17.480
as I mean, it's it's an
intrinsic motivator. But one of those things

707
00:46:17.480 --> 00:46:21.679
that isn't isn't necessarily talked about the
literature and things like you know, like

708
00:46:21.760 --> 00:46:25.280
Dan think of that is rationality.
So you know, rationality is the motivator

709
00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:31.760
where someone desires having you know,
kind of logical transparency, the why behind

710
00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:37.119
decisions and organizations and what we've seen
in the last you know, I'll say

711
00:46:37.119 --> 00:46:40.280
the last you know ten to twelve
months since we've you know, launched the

712
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:45.079
assessment in a commercial you know kind
of commercial form. Is that there's so

713
00:46:45.159 --> 00:46:47.400
many organizations that are going through you
know, change, all kinds of change

714
00:46:47.400 --> 00:46:52.159
management, whether it's you know,
acquiring other companies, merging with the companies,

715
00:46:52.119 --> 00:46:55.440
RP implementations, or just you know
reorganizations or or you know kind of

716
00:46:55.440 --> 00:47:00.920
cultural transformation. The one thing that
we're seeing across the BOLD is rationale.

717
00:47:00.039 --> 00:47:05.519
Is a huge gap and rationality because
a lot of times the organization is either

718
00:47:05.559 --> 00:47:07.599
thinking, well, we don't want
to you know, we don't want to

719
00:47:07.599 --> 00:47:10.000
bore the you know, our employees
with the minutia what's going on day to

720
00:47:10.079 --> 00:47:15.239
day about decisions, but they're also
you know, there's a lot of times

721
00:47:15.239 --> 00:47:16.920
where they're kind of keeping things from
because it's you know, they're kind of

722
00:47:16.920 --> 00:47:21.880
behind closed doors about negotiations or things
that are going on. But what that's

723
00:47:21.920 --> 00:47:25.039
doing is that's driving a that's driving
a huge you know, huge, uh

724
00:47:25.519 --> 00:47:30.039
you know, huge gap within you
know, people within the organization feeling like,

725
00:47:30.519 --> 00:47:32.960
you know, they understand the purpose
and the why behind why decisions are

726
00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:37.599
being made that affect them, the
affect their day to day the existence of

727
00:47:37.679 --> 00:47:42.199
the organization. So that's a communication
issue, and that's one that's that's you

728
00:47:42.239 --> 00:47:45.840
know, on the surface, is
easily solved, you know, and again

729
00:47:45.880 --> 00:47:47.960
it's just it takes leadership to be
able to say, you know, we

730
00:47:49.000 --> 00:47:51.519
need to be more transparent with with
things that we can be. I mean,

731
00:47:51.559 --> 00:47:54.079
there's certain things you know, from
a standpoint of if there's an acquisition

732
00:47:54.159 --> 00:47:57.119
or something like that going on,
they can't you know, they can't reveal

733
00:47:57.159 --> 00:48:00.960
certain things to a certain point.
But but not have people guessing and not

734
00:48:01.079 --> 00:48:04.760
have people saying, well, I
guess I should get my resume together because

735
00:48:04.760 --> 00:48:08.639
we're going through the fourth the fourth
change in the last two years. So

736
00:48:08.800 --> 00:48:15.639
it's really you know, again being
openly transparent and you know, just allowing

737
00:48:16.000 --> 00:48:19.960
people to understand the why behind why
things are going on. And it doesn't

738
00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:22.079
mean they asked. You have to
agree with every decision that a company or

739
00:48:22.159 --> 00:48:27.079
leadership is making, but as long
as they understand why they're doing, why

740
00:48:27.079 --> 00:48:30.880
they're going the path they're going,
then it's a it's it's it alleviates a

741
00:48:30.920 --> 00:48:36.079
lot of that friction and disconnect.
M excellent point. Okay, So rationality

742
00:48:36.079 --> 00:48:38.760
and communication is super important. We
are pretty much out of time, but

743
00:48:39.280 --> 00:48:42.679
in twenty seconds, what would you
all like to leave our listeners with.

744
00:48:45.320 --> 00:48:47.559
I think the you know, the
kind of the final point I'll make here

745
00:48:47.639 --> 00:48:51.800
is the fact that you know,
when you're thinking about you know, motivation

746
00:48:52.840 --> 00:48:55.760
and other things like purpose and everything, it's you know, when you're working

747
00:48:55.760 --> 00:49:00.239
with other individuals. So it's not
just from a standpoint of top down or

748
00:49:00.239 --> 00:49:01.440
bottom up, it's you know,
the peer to peer part of this is

749
00:49:01.440 --> 00:49:06.840
incredibly important to understand, Uh,
you know, what motivates your team members

750
00:49:06.880 --> 00:49:08.400
and what you know, what kind
of drives them from a standpoint of you

751
00:49:08.400 --> 00:49:13.360
know, things that they desire,
and how how can we be better we

752
00:49:13.679 --> 00:49:17.880
you know, we be better colleagues
and friends and kind of teammates by understanding

753
00:49:17.880 --> 00:49:21.360
that as well. So one of
the things we've seen that's that's been highly

754
00:49:21.360 --> 00:49:25.400
successful is when this information and there's
no anonymity to this, so you know

755
00:49:25.440 --> 00:49:29.960
this this is one assessment that is
not scrubbed from a data point because there's

756
00:49:29.960 --> 00:49:34.519
really no wrong answers. But when
when groups or teams have shared this within

757
00:49:34.760 --> 00:49:42.199
peer groups, there's been a far
greater acceleration of driving that environmental factors because

758
00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:44.960
they all can kind of say hey, this is what this is what is

759
00:49:44.960 --> 00:49:51.000
missing, here's what I suggest,
and understanding each other just creates a far

760
00:49:51.079 --> 00:49:54.159
more aligned and fulfilled environment for everybody
involved. That's a great point. And

761
00:49:54.199 --> 00:49:57.519
with that, Matt, we're out
of time. I thank you so much

762
00:49:57.559 --> 00:50:00.880
for joining us. It has been
a pleasure to have this convers with you.

763
00:50:00.920 --> 00:50:02.199
No, thank you so much.
Leise really appreciate it and this great

764
00:50:02.239 --> 00:50:06.800
show. Absolutely and listeners. If
you want to learn more about Matt Johnson

765
00:50:06.840 --> 00:50:12.559
and the company motive x or their
motivation assessment, visit either revivemotivation dot com.

766
00:50:12.599 --> 00:50:17.000
I love that, revivemotivation dot com
or motivexsolutions dot com. Last week,

767
00:50:17.000 --> 00:50:20.320
if you missed the live show,
you can always catch it via recorded

768
00:50:20.360 --> 00:50:23.079
podcast. We were on there with
Sophie McLean, who shared her intense pursuit

769
00:50:23.119 --> 00:50:28.119
of adventure. Yearning to discover an
existential meeting and escape the tedious routine of

770
00:50:28.119 --> 00:50:31.280
her life, and in confronting her
own sadness and despair, she chose numerous

771
00:50:31.320 --> 00:50:37.480
experiential and spiritual expeditions to develop her
consciousness and competencies, which she now uses

772
00:50:37.519 --> 00:50:42.000
to coach and train leaders and politicians
across the world. Pretty riveting conversation.

773
00:50:42.760 --> 00:50:45.960
Next week, we'll be talking with
Maria Fuller, who runs two brands designed

774
00:50:45.960 --> 00:50:49.719
to empower our next generation of girls. She is truly on a mission.

775
00:50:49.960 --> 00:50:52.599
Tune in and we'll see why.
See you there. Remember that works at

776
00:50:52.639 --> 00:50:59.519
least one third of our life,
So let's work on purpose. We hope

777
00:50:59.519 --> 00:51:02.800
you've enjoyed this week's program. Be
sure to tune in to Working on Purpose,

778
00:51:04.159 --> 00:51:08.519
featuring your host Alis Cortes, each
week on the Voice America Empowerment Channel.

779
00:51:09.039 --> 00:51:31.639
This week, find your life's purpose
at work