FIXED: Where Fine Art Meets Improving Solutions and Communication

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What's working on purpose anyway? Each
week we ponder the answer to this question.

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People ache for meaning and purpose at
work, to contribute their talents passionately

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and know their lives really matter.
They crave being part of an organization that

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inspires them and helps them grow into
realizing their highest potential. Business can be

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such a force for good in the
world, elevating humanity. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration to help
usher in this world we all want

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working on purpose. Now Here is
your host, doctor Elise Cortez. Welcome

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back to the Working on Purpose Program. BAKS for tuning in again this week.

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Great to have you. I'm your
host, doctor Elise Cortez John.

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You live from Dallas, which is
home based for me. If you don't

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know me yet, I'm a management
consultant specializing and meaning and purpose organization,

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lawal therapist, inspirational speaker, social
scientist, and author. My team and

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I help companies discover and articulate their
purpose to throw it through their culture and

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operations. We work with forward thinking
or forward reaching organizations to develop inspirational leaders

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who create cultures where people actually want
to come to work and do their best.

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And we revide programs like the Grab
Your Guster that enable individual team members

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to discover and unleash their passionate purpose
at work to catalyze fulfillment, engagement,

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and productivity. You can learn more
about us and how we can work together

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at at least Cortez dot Com.
With us today is Amy Herman, a

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lawyer and art historian who uses works
of art to sharpen observation, analysis,

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and communication skills. By showing people
how to look closely at painting, sculpture,

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and photography, she helps them hone
their visual intelligence to recognize the most

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pertinent and useful information, as well
as recognized biases that impede decision making.

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She's the author of Fixed, How
to Perfect the Fine Art of Problem Solving,

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which we are talking about today.
You know, today from New York

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City, a meet, Welcome to
working on Purpose. Want to be here,

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you know, as I was saying
before we came, just as the

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Rooch chatting Greek, we got on
air, and I was just reflecting,

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I mean, I don't know what
I did. It'd be so so fortunate

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and blessed to get to host the
show because I get to meet people like

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you. I would otherwise have no
reason to meet. It is crazy.

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I feel equally lucky, and I
really believe the universe aligns in certain ways

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and when people cross paths, we
really have to leverage those opportunities and make

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the most of them. So I'm
really very happy to be here. Awesome.

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I do have to warn you right
now, though, that I have

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been known to get to know a
couple of guests here and there on the

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show, and then when I'm traveling
in their area sho up on their doorstep.

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I'd be thrilled. I'd be thrilled
New York brings you here soon it

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happens. I've done it in Sydney, Australia and all kinds of places,

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So that's great. Yeah, it's
great. I think so too. You

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know, you just get to know
each other in a different level. It's

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amazing, so absolutely. And the
other thing that I just take to light

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in amy is what you're doing.
I'm just so I love the word gobsmacked,

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right, gobsmacked and delighted by your
approach to helping people to learn to

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better be prop resolved than their communicators
through the use of art. I love

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when we can, you know,
juxtapose seemingly very disparate fields to produce very

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dynamic results. And so you know
what I think, what I really appreciate,

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And we're going to talk about your
aspects of each of your chapters.

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But you open you say something very
interesting. You say, art and artists

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themselves often get a bad rap for
being complicated, optus, and even obscene.

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That is exactly why they provide the
perfect backdrop for problem solving, since

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Irish is today are similarly convoluted.
Rest assured, you say, you don't

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need any art history training or previous
knowledge to benefit from this process, just

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to open your eyes and an open
mind. So this isn't just about the

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study of art, you say,
it's about using art to study ourselves and

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their problems we face every single day. That's amazing. I love listening to

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the words, and it really boils
down to one simple thing at least,

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that life is messy. Life is
a messy right now, and everything is

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broken. And I really do believe
that the best things happen on the exit

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ramp of our comfort zone. And
what is the opposite ramp of our comfort

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zone For so many bowl is the
idea of looking at art. Because people

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say I don't get art. I
don't have a background in art. I

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don't even like it. And I
say to them, let's go out of

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your line your linear lives, point
A to point B, and let's go

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to point C and point D.
Let's go to the exit ramp of our

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comfort zone. Look at things in
a different way, so that when I

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bring you back to your world,
you're going to see things more perceptively.

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So by stepping into a world with
which we are not familiar, I believe

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that changing your environment and changing what
you look at changes the way you see

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everything. And to give you a
great quote that I read on a wall

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text recently in a museum, and
I never read walltext. It says,

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how we look at things is fundamental
to what we see. How we look

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at things is fundamental to what we
see. Oh, this is already just

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delicious. I knew it would be. So here's the problem. I'm not

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gonna let go off here. You're
gonna be with me all night. We're

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just gonna hang and have a conversations. You know, Sorry, you know

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that's not so. This is great, you know, And in your book

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you do this so beautiful. I
love you. There's so many all of

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your images that you put in there, and then you challenged us to what

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do you see? And does this
offend you? If it does, why

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it's amazing, right? And I
just went into that and I looked at

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that it was so and I thought
to myself, I need to take one

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of Baby's courses. Well. One
of the reasons that I do this is

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because I want people, as they
are either reading the book or taking my

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course, I want them to become
self aware. You know, we all

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know what we think, we know
what our capabilities are, our strengths and

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our weaknesses. But when I ask
you to look at a work of art

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and I say what do you see? You know it's not how much you

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know. I want you to tell
me what you see. And to give

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you a perfect example, if I
put two police officers or two attorneys in

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front of the same painting and I
asked them to spend ten seconds with this

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work of art and to tell me
what they see, I will get two

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very very different versions of what they're
looking at. And you're saying yourself,

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well, if this is what's happening
in the museum, what's happening at the

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crime scene, what's happening in them
what's happening in the boardroom. We can't

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assume that anybody sees the world or
our work exactly the way we do throughout

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eyes attached to our brain. So
I'm using art as the data to illustrate

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for that, to illustrate that for
all of us. That's so gorgeous.

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That's so gorgeous. Now speaking,
you mentioned lawyers. I think it's fascinating

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exactly how did this happen? You're
an art historian and a lawyer, among

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other things. I mean, this
is like a crazy train wreck. I

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mean, whatever, Well, I
have to say, as my son will

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say over and over again, one
of my favorite lines is don't see as

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opportunities, make opportunities. And my
whole career path has been making opportunities sometimes

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where they didn't necessarily exist. I
am what I call a recovering attorney.

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I am an attorney by training,
and I was a practicing litigator for five

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years. But I knew in my
heart of hearts that I was passionate about

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art history, and I didn't want
to waste a legal education. I didn't

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want to waste all that good training
as a litigator. So I thought there

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has to be a way to combine
the practical aspects of each of these disciplines,

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legal analysis and visual analysis to create
something that could actually be entrepreneurial and

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useful for people. So twenty two
years ago, when I left the practice

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of law, I went to work
at the Frick Collection and I went to

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work there as the assistant to the
director, and I saw that there was

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a whole in the education department,
and I started volunteering part of my time

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in the education department and learned about
the field of museum education, and eventually

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I became the head of education.
I went back to school and got an

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advanced degree in art history, but
never let my legal skills go. And

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while I was at the Frick Collection, I started this program and it was

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for medical students only. The idea
was to take medical students out of a

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hospital, out of a clinical setting, bring them to an art museum,

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teach them how to analyze works of
art, with the idea that when they

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returned to the hospital they would be
better observers of and communicators with their patients.

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This was not my idea. They
were doing it at Yale, and

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with Yale's very gracious permission, they
let me start a version of it in

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New York City. So I invited
Cornell Medical School to come to the Freak

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Collection, and voila. We had
an amazing medicine in art program. But

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things took a turn in two thousand
and four when I adopted it and moved

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out of medicine. M okay,
a couple of things. First, It's

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clearly part of your superpower your superpower
set is that ability to be able to

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bring again seemingly very disparate worlds together. I mean, that's that's a superpower

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Amy, And I know you know
that now listeners and viewers for you,

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those of you that are trying to
figure out, oh, you know,

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should I stay in this career I've
been in for twenty years that I hate,

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or could I go into this fastly
wild different thing over here? I

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take a point a note from Amy's
story here, and I bet there are

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some interesting threads there for you to
help you bring those two worlds together in

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a really dynamic way, just like
Amy did. So. Amy, that's

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amazing. It is. What you
say is absolutely true. I knew that

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my AHA movement was that art history
moved me. But I had to make

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the move from something that was so
passionate to making a practical, fulfilling career

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that could also contribute something to the
greater good. I also think it's interesting

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that you wanted to go and I
heard the word entrepreneurial, so you clearly

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there was something about being an entrepreneur
that was important to you. What was

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important about that? It was I
had been working in the prior to working

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in the law. My whole family
had come from then nof for profit sector.

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And I thought, you know the
idea of developing a company, because

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I wasn't following it anyone's footsteps.
Here combining these two disciplines, legal analysis

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and visual analysis, I said,
there's something bigger here. And when I

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told you I switched. I left
medicine in two thousand and four. It

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was one of those aha moments.
I was out to dinner with friends and

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I was telling them that my medical
students had myopia, very very narrow vision.

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It was all about kidney stones and
hematomas and MRIs. And someone asked

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the question, and here's the threat. We always have to keep asking questions.

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Someone said, why are you just
doing this for medical students. Why

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aren't you doing this for people other
people who need observation skills. I said,

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like whom my friend said, cops, why aren't you doing this for

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homicide detectives? And I thought,
I don't know why am I not?

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So Monday morning, I picked up
the phone and made a cold call to

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my local police department at the NYPD, And it took seven transfers, seven

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transfers for me to get to the
right person who heard what I was saying.

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And six months later, every newly
promoted captain in the NYPD had to

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come to my museum for this training. I just got several layers of goosebumps

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on that. Sorry, Amy,
thank you very much. I was worth

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the prize of admission. That's brilliant, so brilliant, you know, and

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so really quick. And I guess
that's so much I want to extract at

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your book. You know, this
whole thing about for me, the journey

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of being an entrepreneur. It's it's
about realizing my potential for me. That's

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what it is is. I wanted
to navigate through that process of creating something

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that's mine. It's my IP programs
and consulting that are from my creation,

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but then stealing it and bringing it
into being into a business to me,

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that's I don't know. There's something
about that that is like I want to

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do that. That's what I needed
to do in my lifetime. It's the

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it's the perfect illustration of the growth
mindset. You say, I'm good,

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I love what I do, but
I need to be better. And I

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had really a formative moment, a
critical juncture. I had invited the FBI

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to come to the Frick Collection for
this training because the collaboration with the NYPD

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hit the front page of the Wall
Street Journal and my world exploded. So

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a group from the FBI came to
the Frick Collection, and I remember when

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we left, the special agent in
charge says, you know what do I

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owe you? And I said,
oh no, it's my honor to have

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you come to the Frick Collection.
And this goes back to your entrepreneur question.

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And he puts some cash in my
hand and he said to me,

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don't give this away for free.
This is valuable. Don't give it away.

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And I thought to myself, we
could be onto something. This could

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help people. I could develop in
this growth mindset, get better and better

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and use art and develop this to
be something bigger and better. Then it's

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that. Then it's initial iteration,
and that's what it has thrown into.

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And I don't want to. I
don't want to minimize the role that the

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art the Wall Street Journal played when
they profiled my collaboration with the NYPD.

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It was on the front page,
above the fold of the Wall Street Journal,

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and companies read it all over the
world and they said, hey,

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if she's teaching the New York City
Police Department how to you know, enhance

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their observation skills, maybe she can
do it for my company as well.

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And my world exploded. Then I
think it's just brilliant. It's so inspiring,

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so inspiring, and you do talk, you do share that example of

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how of being paid like that in
your book, which is dis gorgeous.

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So thank you, You're welcome.
Okay, so let's get into your book

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a little. I want to What
I want to do is I want to

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I want to take a piece from
most all of your chapters, maybe not

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all of them, so the listeners
and viewers have an idea of just what

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they're what's in store for them,
and this will be teaching for them,

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of course, in this conversation.
So starting in your clean your Lenses chapter,

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you say When we are engaged in
a constant study of the self,

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we are better able to diffuse difficult
situations and manage difficult people. The better

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we know our own by season behaviors, and more effective will be a problem

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solving, crisis averting, and leading
others to their greatest potential. Sounds amazing,

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it does, but it comes down
to one very simple line. When

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I said before that no two people
see anything the same way. When I

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ask my readers and my participants to
clean their lenses, what I'm asking them

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to realize is that we need to
meet. If we're going to be effective

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problem solvers. We have to understand
that there's always another way to see something,

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and that we have to while we
might not agree with other people,

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we have to validate that they're going
to see things differently and meet them where

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they are, so that when we
clean our lenses, we have an opportunity

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to say, you know, maybe
there's another way of looking at this,

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and I might not agree with how
my colleague is looking at the problem,

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but let's look at it together.
Because I believe that selfishly, multiple perspectives

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make for better decision making, and
you can't adapt multiple perspectives until you clean

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your lenses to understand that you can
see a single problem from multiple points.

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Oh Amy, two things. So
I have taught cognitive psychology, where we

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learned, of course, that you
know, your vision is very much construed

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in your in your mind, and
I love when you when you really specified

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that. Nope, no two people
see the same thing. So I remember

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distinctly. I dated somebody for a
while, really really beautiful bright man.

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It's so interesting, and we'd be
out and about and he'd say, did

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you see did you see that?
Like? What would you talk about?

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And he would look like, you
fool, did you not see that?

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I mean, he was, you
know, really really just like flabbergusted,

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and just how stupid I was that
I didn't see what he saw. I'm

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like, dude, that's not how
vision works, Darlin. Sorry to disrupt

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this for you, but I'm not
looking at even what you're looking at you.

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If I were, I wouldn't see
the same thing. So it was

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amazing a really really smart man,
and he took it for granted that everyone

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saw the world the way he did. And the things about looking at art

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is that it heightens our awareness that
no two people see anything the same way.

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And if two people describe a painting
differently, as I said before,

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it makes them think, well,
wait a minute. You know what's happening

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on the job where I'm assuming that
all my colleagues see our work and our

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objectives and our goals and our analytics
all the same way, And in fact,

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no one does right. So art
is the great leveler, and it

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makes us realize that nobody sees anything. And this goes into the personal realm

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as well, our husband's, wives, partners, children, nobody sees the

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way they do. And when you
say to someone in exasperation, as I've

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done many times, can't you see
this? You have to really walk that

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back and say, maybe they can't. And it's up to me to be

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able to articulate what I see,
to give them into to guide them and

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give them insight into seeing what they
see. Yeah, they don't get a

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little magical like pouring device into our
minds that you know, to sort of

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jump in there and see just what
we're seeing on that screen. Yeah,

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not so beautiful. That point is
already great for our listeners of viewers.

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I know, let's grab our first
break. I'm your host, doctor Release

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Cortez. We've gone there with Amy
Herman. She's the author of Fixed,

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How to Perfect the Fine Art of
Problem Solving. We've been talking a bit

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about just how she got into this
space and a bit about her book.

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We're going to keep going after the
break. Stay with us, We'll be

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right back. Doctor Release Cortez as
a management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose

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and inspirational speaker and author. She
helps companies visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders

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and develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning
infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,

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00:16:33.799 --> 00:16:38.360
and commitment within the workforce. To
learn more or to invite a lease to

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speak to your organization, please visit
her at a lease Cortez dot com.

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00:16:42.960 --> 00:16:55.080
Let's talk about how to get your
employees working on purpose. This is working

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on Purpose with doctor Release Cortez.
To reach our program today or open a

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conversation with Elise, send an email
to Elise ali Se at Elise Cortez dot

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00:17:06.319 --> 00:17:12.039
com. Now back to working on
Purpose. Thanks for staying with us,

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Welcome back. Before we get back
to the program, letting me just share

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with you and invite you to check
out the book that I put out in

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November of twenty twenty. It's called
Purpose United, How Inspiring Leaders Unite Passion

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and Elevate cause it's it's on Amazon. And I really wrote that book to

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awakend readers to their passion and their
purpose and transform them into inspiration to leaders

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to help create places where people actually
want to come to work and do their

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best. And it's also what I
used as the content for my leadership programs.

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So if you're just coming back to
the program, my guest today is

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Amy Herman. She's the president of
the Art of Perception and the author of

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Fixed, How to Perfect the Fine
Art of Problem Solving. I'm your host,

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doctor Elise Cortez. So if we
keep going here, I got to

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tell you this this next chapter,
just the way you open it, just

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I probably will never forget it,
Amy, I probably will never forget the

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change your Shoes chapter. No,
So you talk about the shoes on the

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Danube Bank memorial that showcases the shoes
left behind by the countless innocent individuals suspected

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of being Jews in Budapest. And
so the memorial is of shoes on the

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water bank. I think you said
they're made out of metal, but they're

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right at the river shore and so
the whole thing is about changing our perspective.

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But if you could for our listeners, could you describe more about that

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memorial, it's history, who did
it, et cetera, to get us

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into that moment, and then talk
more about this importance of change your shoes.

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Absolutely, one of the things that
I love about art is that can

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illustrate so many of the key concepts, not the other way around. I

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don't talk about the art, We
use the art to illustrate. And what

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you're referencing is a beautiful sculpture on
the banks of the Danube. It's called

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Shoes on the Banks of the Danube, and it's a sculpture from two thousand

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and five. And the memorial is
to recognize and memorialize all the people that

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were killed on the banks of the
Danube by the Arrows Militia, which was

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a Nazi aligned party put into power
by Hitler in nineteen forty four. And

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what the hour Across militia did is
they brought people, They rounded up people,

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mostly Jews, brought them to the
edges of the river and they made

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them take their shoes off, and
then they took those shoelaces. It was

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particularly brutal and a very ugly part
of history. They tied the victims together

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with their shoelaces and shot one and
they all fell into the river. And

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what the artist Kantogi and the sculptor
Julia Power wanted to do was to not

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only memorialize this horrific event of World
War two, but humanize it. And

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by using shoes. It's pears and
pears and pairs of shoes, all made

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of bronze and metal. And what's
so humanizing is we all wear shoes every

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single day, even during pandemic.
At home, we wear slippers, we

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wear sneakers. And the idea when
you come up on these shoes at the

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actual memorial, people look, well, isn't that strange? Whose shoes are

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they? Why were they left here? And then you realize they're made of

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metal, that they are in fact
a memorial. And what is so humanizing

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and devastating is because everybody can relate
to shoes. And so in this chapter

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I ask my readers to change their
shoes, because it's what an artist has

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to do to undertake creating a work
of art, and what we have to

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do to solve a problem choosing and
executing perspective, both literally as an artist

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and figuratively as a problem solver.
In business, we have to think about

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things symbolically and structurally and thematically and
logistically and tactically, and these are integral

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parts of problem solving. So I
chose that memorial because it is so horrific,

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It is so human, and it
literally asks us to change our shoes

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and think about the perspective of other
people as we approach the idea of problem

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solving. Oh my gosh, it's
just it's so powerful. Amy, It's

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just such a powerful way to illustrate
some thing. I mean, I just

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I'm never going to forget it now
while we're in that camp. Literally,

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I do want to just I want
to talk about this just briefly. You

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said something in your book that I
didn't know. I don't know a lot

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about the history of around Hitler,
for example, but she said something like

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I think he aspired to be an
artist or something you said, and that

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he was blatantly rejected. And I
think you even said something like, gosh,

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what would have happened? Maybe if
somebody had been a little kind to

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him along the way, maybe the
course of history would be entirely different.

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Yes, this is a point that
came up in the context of my book.

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And we were talking about looking at
things from a different perspective. And

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I was talking to a perspective college
student and the assignment for the college essay

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was, if you could change one
event in the twentieth century, what would

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it meet one event in history in
the twentieth century. And most people,

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you know, they point to World
War Two, they point to the Holocaust,

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some people talk about Vietnam, the
Titanic, all the major historical events.

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But this young man that I know, decided to take a different perspective,

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which is why I wrote about it
in the book. And he looked

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at Hitler. And people have said, well, if Hitler were never born,

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But this is what he discovered that, as you said, Hitler did

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in fact want to be an artist, but he was rejected from art school,

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not once but twice. And after
his rejection from art school, his

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feelings of insecurity and anger led him
to Germany and committed the atrocities that he

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did. And what this young man
wrote about was, if I could change

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one event, I would admit Hitler
to art school. And if he ever

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had in fact been admitted to art
school. How would the whole world have

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been different He wouldn't have had the
rejection and the anger and taken out in

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such a way, in such a
vengeful, destructive way, that had he

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actually become an artist, whether successful
or not, could have really changed the

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whole course of history. And what
I'd loved about that analysis is it's on

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the other side of an issue,
not just thinking about what an atrocious man

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Hitler was and what if he had
never been born, but how could we

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have changed the course of history in
a different way? And I want that

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to be directly applicable to how we
solve problems. How can we get to

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the other side of the issue and
not just jump on the obvious answer,

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but let's look for another one that
actually might be more sustainable. That's so

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powerful, Amy, this is just
this is so good. Yeah, so

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welcome, thank you. Okay,
So, now in your Defining the project

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chapter, you talk about in problem
solving, when we rushed to find a

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solution, so kind of getting what
you're talking about, when we rushed to

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find a solution, the result can
end up not fitting because we didn't first

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measure the problem accurately. So you're
talking about that already in the example you

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just gave. That's right, that's
right. But the idea of defining a

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project, and this is the example
that I use because it's really one of

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the simplest ones with which we can
all identify. Have we ever been called

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into a meeting everyone is sitting around
the conference room team and the person in

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charge, the head of the department, the CEO, says, Okay,

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we need to address this problem.
It's cutting into profits, it's cutting into

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morale, and this is what we're
going to do without taking the opportunity to

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go around the table and ask each
person what he or she perceives the problem

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to be. Because it goes back
to the original statement that we made that

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no two people see anything the same
way, and if each of us has

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an opportunity to articulate the problem,
the solution will be that much more tailored

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and that much more readily available than
if we all just dive in and try

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to solve something when we haven't defined
the problem in the first place. And

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yes, it takes time and it
takes effort and discussion, but just think,

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after coming to some kind of consensus
with ten people around the table about

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what the common problem is how much
better it's going to be to approach a

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solution when we're all on the same
page. And the other example I give

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have you over on to a meeting, a lease an hour long meeting,

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and you come out and people say, what was that about? Of course

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that happens to all of us,
no idea. Yeah, now, and

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someone goes to a keyboard and says, as we discussed it this morning's meeting.

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What did we discuss it this morning's
meeting. We need to lay the

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groundwork to find the problem and to
find the issues. And it sounds so

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basic, but it can pave the
way for effective communication and I believe much

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better problem solving. M I agree. Now, then you go on.

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It's just worked that when we start
really getting into your material in your world,

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you can just really see the value
of that. Then you go on

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and you say, really study a
situation, and so then you say,

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you say, look at it from
different perspectives, look behind it, around

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it, under it, right,
that is like if you think about that

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00:25:44.880 --> 00:25:48.319
for just a second, like just
a simple thing like you know, this

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house being built around the corner,
it looks incredibly different when I look at

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it from my front doorstep than I
do when I go still slightly around the

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bend in my neighborhood. It's amazing. The view is completely radically different.

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It's not the same house. So
you are absolutely right, and what you've

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set up is the perfect template.
Walk away from a problem, step in

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closer, ask people questions. And
I realize we are all challenged for time.

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But if we invest the time on
the front end to take that deeper

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00:26:17.920 --> 00:26:19.720
dive. Or I heard a phrase
that someone used, I'm not fond of

400
00:26:19.720 --> 00:26:23.039
it, but they said to double
click on certain issues, if you take

401
00:26:23.079 --> 00:26:27.680
the time to look from multiple perspectives. Again, art lends itself beautifully.

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00:26:27.720 --> 00:26:30.599
We can step in close to the
painting, we can step across the gallery,

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00:26:30.880 --> 00:26:34.119
we can look at a small piece
of it. It will help us

404
00:26:34.359 --> 00:26:38.160
to discuss not only the small details
and see the issues, but also see

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the big picture in a different light. And I really believe that. You

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00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:48.519
know, when I say how we
look at something is fundamental to what we

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00:26:48.640 --> 00:26:52.359
see, I really do believe that. And I think that when we look

408
00:26:52.400 --> 00:26:56.039
at things from multiple perspectives and we
discuss with other people what their perceptions and

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00:26:56.119 --> 00:27:02.480
perspectives are, we're on a course
to solve problems more effectively. The other

410
00:27:02.559 --> 00:27:06.440
thing that really strikes me, which
I got to believe is absolutely interwoven into

411
00:27:06.519 --> 00:27:10.559
what you do, is just the
process of making people talk about what they're

412
00:27:10.599 --> 00:27:14.319
observing, actually articulate what they're observing, which is a lot of work,

413
00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:18.759
is already going to improve their communication. It absolutely is. And you know,

414
00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:21.160
there can never be a response when
I say to someone, well,

415
00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:22.920
what do you see? There can
never be the response while I don't know,

416
00:27:23.079 --> 00:27:26.960
because everybody sees something and we're looking
at art it gives us ground zero.

417
00:27:27.039 --> 00:27:30.759
We're all in the same place.
But one of the points I want

418
00:27:30.759 --> 00:27:33.359
to bring in here at least,
that I think is so important, especially

419
00:27:33.400 --> 00:27:37.319
for those who are in positions of
leadership, is that when we are discussing

420
00:27:37.359 --> 00:27:41.319
things and we're talking about problem solving, we're talking about our observations. One

421
00:27:41.359 --> 00:27:44.640
of the greatest takeaways that I want
people to have from my course and the

422
00:27:44.680 --> 00:27:51.680
book is don't let perfection be the
enemy of good. Sometimes we can't be

423
00:27:51.880 --> 00:27:56.119
perfect, and good has to be
good enough. There are problems that we

424
00:27:56.200 --> 00:28:00.039
need to put a band aid on
them and staunch the bleeding and move on.

425
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:03.599
And if we can't solve the overarching
crisis. Well, sometimes that has

426
00:28:03.640 --> 00:28:07.680
to be okay, And it takes
a brave person and a visionary leader to

427
00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:11.319
say, you know what, we're
going to solve this problem today and we're

428
00:28:11.319 --> 00:28:15.240
going to move on to things that
really need our attention. So when we're

429
00:28:15.319 --> 00:28:19.759
looking at problems from multiple perspectives and
articulating what we see, try not to

430
00:28:19.880 --> 00:28:26.079
let perfection be the enemy of good. Amen. Absolutely, Amen, move

431
00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:29.519
things along. I couldn't agree more. I love quality, I really love

432
00:28:29.599 --> 00:28:33.720
quality. And at the same time, you know, ongoing effort and contribution

433
00:28:33.759 --> 00:28:36.359
impact really go a long way.
So I'm completely with you on that.

434
00:28:37.000 --> 00:28:38.519
Great. Great, it really does
go a long way. But sometimes we

435
00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:41.440
have to articulate it. We have
to say it out loud, yes,

436
00:28:41.519 --> 00:28:44.680
and make it safe for people.
Make it okay for people, Make it

437
00:28:44.680 --> 00:28:48.400
okay for people. Absolutely. And
not only do you make it okay for

438
00:28:48.480 --> 00:28:51.000
yourself to say, you know,
I'm going to move on, you also

439
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:52.920
give people permission to say, you
know what, I'm going to stop here.

440
00:28:53.200 --> 00:28:56.799
This is the best I can do
and I have to move on to

441
00:28:56.880 --> 00:28:59.240
something else. So well, and
I know that's how you got this one.

442
00:28:59.319 --> 00:29:00.319
At least one of your books that
you talk about that, You're like,

443
00:29:00.359 --> 00:29:03.240
you know, if if it were
up to me and I didn't have

444
00:29:03.279 --> 00:29:04.680
a deadline whage we're going to talk
about as well, you know, you

445
00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:08.119
would have had another, i don't
know, one hundred or two hundred pages

446
00:29:08.160 --> 00:29:11.599
in your book, right, And
who needs one hundred more pages in a

447
00:29:11.599 --> 00:29:14.799
book? Right? And I understand
that. My publisher she said the same

448
00:29:14.799 --> 00:29:17.319
thing, and she goes, you
know, at least people actually don't want

449
00:29:17.359 --> 00:29:19.880
to read all that stuff, you
know, come on stop. So anyway,

450
00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:23.400
I just appreciate that. But let's
cover this next piece here and the

451
00:29:23.400 --> 00:29:27.839
bite sized pieces chapter this is this
is fascinating as well for someone like me,

452
00:29:27.960 --> 00:29:30.720
and I think a lot of listeners
and viewers will really really relate to

453
00:29:30.759 --> 00:29:33.519
this. But you say that when
we're problem solving, it can seem like

454
00:29:33.559 --> 00:29:37.880
we're up against the impossible, staring
down a gigantic blank canvas or a field

455
00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:41.480
full of thousands of ruined fragments.
It's then that we realized that picking up

456
00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:45.319
the pieces after an explosion maybe wasn't
the hardest part. It's how to not

457
00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:52.000
sink beneath the waves of overwhelm.
The waves of overwhelm threatened to drown all

458
00:29:52.039 --> 00:29:55.799
of us. And at the risk
of giving two personal example, at least,

459
00:29:55.799 --> 00:30:00.160
I'm going to share this with you
and your listeners, because if they

460
00:30:00.160 --> 00:30:03.759
haven't walked that walk themselves, they
certainly walked that walk with other people.

461
00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:08.319
I am a very grateful cancer survivor. I am exceedingly grateful every single day.

462
00:30:08.559 --> 00:30:12.640
But I will tell you in all
candor, I was getting a diagnosis

463
00:30:12.680 --> 00:30:15.559
like I did was daunting, and
the doctor told me what it was going

464
00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:18.720
to entail, and my first response
was, well, I don't have time

465
00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:22.599
for that, and she looked at
me with a sly smile and she said,

466
00:30:22.880 --> 00:30:26.160
well, you're going to make the
time, because if you don't make

467
00:30:26.160 --> 00:30:27.400
the time, you're not going to
be here in six months to talk about

468
00:30:27.440 --> 00:30:32.559
it. So the reason I bring
that to the discussion is because when I

469
00:30:32.599 --> 00:30:34.920
got my diagnosis, she told me, very matter of factly that I was

470
00:30:34.960 --> 00:30:38.799
going to have sixteen sessions of chemotherapy, I was going to have a minimum

471
00:30:38.799 --> 00:30:41.559
of three surgeries, I was going
to lose all my hair, and the

472
00:30:41.640 --> 00:30:45.440
year was going to be terrible.
And then she said any questions, And

473
00:30:45.559 --> 00:30:51.200
I left there thinking that is just
looming in my future. And how does

474
00:30:51.200 --> 00:30:53.319
one begin to digest it and the
way I did it, and I dare

475
00:30:53.319 --> 00:30:56.839
say successfully, it had some you
know, everyone has bad days. But

476
00:30:56.880 --> 00:31:03.240
I broke that diagnosis, my prognosis, and the treatment into bite sized pieces.

477
00:31:03.319 --> 00:31:07.480
Instead of thinking, I have sixteen
sessions of chemotherapy over the next few

478
00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:11.599
months. How am I going to
deal with that? One week at a

479
00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:15.440
time, and every Friday it was
one session closer to the end. I

480
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:18.200
got through. I lived to tell
about it, you know what. To

481
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:22.200
celebrate those small milestones, woo who
we got through One more round of chemo

482
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:25.720
were one more closer to the end, and look where I am. And

483
00:31:25.799 --> 00:31:29.480
by breaking it into bite sized pieces
and not thinking about three months down the

484
00:31:29.519 --> 00:31:33.839
road, I knew I was going
to get there one week at a time,

485
00:31:33.160 --> 00:31:37.039
and I have used that as a
template instead of having a looming deadline.

486
00:31:37.039 --> 00:31:40.759
I spoke with someone today who was
working on her dissertation, and I

487
00:31:40.799 --> 00:31:44.519
said to her, instead of thinking
about your dissertation dissertation deadline at the end

488
00:31:44.519 --> 00:31:48.799
of May, one week right,
ten pages, the next week edited,

489
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:51.599
and the next week right, ten
more pages. And at the end of

490
00:31:51.640 --> 00:31:55.960
every portion, celebrate, look what
you've got done. And we all need

491
00:31:56.000 --> 00:31:59.880
to do that whether it is parenthood
or a work assignment, or a long

492
00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.839
term project or a short term project, break it into bite sized pieces,

493
00:32:04.200 --> 00:32:07.799
celebrate the milestone, and before you
know it, you will have met your

494
00:32:07.799 --> 00:32:09.799
deadline. Brilliant to Amy, Absolutely
brilliant. I was going to talk to

495
00:32:09.839 --> 00:32:12.680
you about your cancer, and I
do have another question about that. But

496
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:15.319
let's grab our last break here.
I'm your host, doctor Release Cortez.

497
00:32:15.359 --> 00:32:19.160
We've got on the air with Amy
Herman, the author of Fixed, How

498
00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:22.000
to Perfect the Fine Art of Problem
Solving. We've been talking about some of

499
00:32:22.039 --> 00:32:23.440
the chapters in her book. After
the break, I'm going to have her

500
00:32:23.480 --> 00:32:28.039
finish a couple more pieces about the
chapters, and I want to help just

501
00:32:28.039 --> 00:32:30.759
a little bit more into that cancer
experience. Stay with us, We'll be

502
00:32:30.839 --> 00:32:36.440
right back. Doctor Release Cortez is
a management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose

503
00:32:36.839 --> 00:32:42.759
and inspirational speaker and author. She
helps companies visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders

504
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:49.720
and develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning
infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,

505
00:32:49.920 --> 00:32:53.480
and commitment within the workforce. To
learn more or to invite a lease to

506
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:58.680
speak to your organization, please visit
her at a lease Cortez dot com.

507
00:32:59.000 --> 00:33:09.160
Let's talk about how to get your
employees working on purpose. This is working

508
00:33:09.200 --> 00:33:14.640
on Purpose with doctor Relise Cortez.
To reach our program today or open a

509
00:33:14.680 --> 00:33:21.400
conversation with Elise, send an email
to Elise ali se at Elise Cortez dot

510
00:33:21.440 --> 00:33:28.759
com. Now back to working on
Purpose. Thankteresting with us, and welcome

511
00:33:28.759 --> 00:33:30.960
back to working on purpose. One
of a bit of news I want to

512
00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:32.920
share it before we get back in
the program is the anthology that I've been

513
00:33:32.920 --> 00:33:36.960
working on for a couple of years
has been released, came out in August

514
00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:39.519
of twenty one. It's a collection
of twenty five stories from women across the

515
00:33:39.559 --> 00:33:44.279
globe who I recruited to share their
very intimate stories of how they've discovered their

516
00:33:44.279 --> 00:33:45.480
purpose and are now serving from it. And I'm so proud of this.

517
00:33:45.519 --> 00:33:49.960
I'm actually more proud of this particular
book than i am my first own book

518
00:33:50.599 --> 00:33:52.599
because it's all of us coming together. It's called Passionately Striving and Why,

519
00:33:52.880 --> 00:33:57.519
an anthology of women who purse of
your mindly to live their purpose. So

520
00:33:57.559 --> 00:34:00.559
that's out and we're celebrating, of
course this month of March. And also

521
00:34:00.640 --> 00:34:02.480
I am now scouting for men to
share their stories. If you know someone,

522
00:34:02.599 --> 00:34:06.559
send them my way. If you're
just joining us today, my guest

523
00:34:06.599 --> 00:34:09.360
is Amy Herman. She's the president
of Art of Perception and the author of

524
00:34:09.440 --> 00:34:13.280
Fixed, How to Perfect the Fine
Art of Problem Solving on your host,

525
00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:16.760
Doctor Elias Cortez. So that little
bit about cancer you were talking about before,

526
00:34:16.840 --> 00:34:20.239
I definitely wanted to hear more about
that. You talk about it in

527
00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:22.840
your book, and now I see
how you've woven it in in terms to

528
00:34:23.039 --> 00:34:28.440
the bite sized pieces framework. What
I want to understand, Amy, is

529
00:34:28.840 --> 00:34:31.599
what did you learn from the experience
of cancer. You know, at least

530
00:34:31.719 --> 00:34:36.280
I would never recommend to anyone to
have to go through a cancer journey,

531
00:34:36.599 --> 00:34:40.800
but it has forever changed my perspective
because we are a collective of our own

532
00:34:40.840 --> 00:34:46.360
experiences, assumptions, and biases.
And I started my program, as I

533
00:34:46.400 --> 00:34:50.719
mentioned to you earlier, it had
its roots in medicine, and I've been

534
00:34:50.760 --> 00:34:54.320
training people in the medical profession for
years and now I have the perspective of

535
00:34:54.360 --> 00:34:58.760
what it is to be a patient
with a very serious illness. And not

536
00:34:58.800 --> 00:35:02.400
only has it given me a new
perspective on the doctor patient and nurse patient

537
00:35:02.480 --> 00:35:07.159
relationship and enabled me to train them
or work with them in a very very

538
00:35:07.199 --> 00:35:12.119
different from a different place to help
them solve their problems. It's given me

539
00:35:12.199 --> 00:35:15.679
my own personal perspective. That my
son was in middle school when I was

540
00:35:15.719 --> 00:35:19.039
sick, and who used to come
home and he would say, Mom,

541
00:35:19.039 --> 00:35:22.639
we have a problem. And my
first question always is is anyone dying?

542
00:35:23.159 --> 00:35:27.360
And if he said no, then
I would say, then we can solve

543
00:35:27.400 --> 00:35:30.519
the problem. And one of the
greatest gifts that I've given myself and hopefully

544
00:35:30.639 --> 00:35:35.559
to my son and to my family
members is after going through a cancer journey,

545
00:35:35.960 --> 00:35:40.519
I just can't sweat the small stuff. I just can't because the world,

546
00:35:40.559 --> 00:35:45.440
as I said before, everything is
broken. And even in this beautiful

547
00:35:45.519 --> 00:35:51.000
book that I've put so much effort
and time and thought into, there are

548
00:35:51.079 --> 00:35:53.440
mistakes in it. There are printed
mistakes. I'm sure you saw some,

549
00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:58.639
because we all know there's no such
thing as a perfectly printed document. You

550
00:35:58.719 --> 00:36:01.519
know from authoring your own books,
there is no such thing. Can I

551
00:36:01.599 --> 00:36:05.679
lay awake at night worrying about the
mistakes in the book? I can't.

552
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:10.840
I can't because I'm an imperfect human
being and having cancer and overcome cancer made

553
00:36:10.880 --> 00:36:15.719
me see that there are bigger issues
in life to worry about and to celebrate,

554
00:36:16.039 --> 00:36:21.079
and I just can't sweat the small
stuff, whether it's professional or personal,

555
00:36:21.280 --> 00:36:24.119
and I try to keep that as
my north star as I move forward.

556
00:36:24.239 --> 00:36:30.639
Don't sweat the small stuff. M
beautiful. Wow, I'm going to

557
00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:32.280
learn from you because I really don't
want to go through your experience. So

558
00:36:32.280 --> 00:36:35.920
I'm just gonna go ahead and take
the vicarious learning experience. Please do.

559
00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:38.519
I hope you have to have that, but it has a way of bringing

560
00:36:38.559 --> 00:36:43.400
grace upon people. And I also
stand on the shoulders of so many people

561
00:36:43.400 --> 00:36:45.880
who didn't make it, and I
want to make that every day. I

562
00:36:45.920 --> 00:36:50.079
want to shout from their shoulders and
say that we all take lessons and we

563
00:36:50.119 --> 00:36:53.679
all have something to learn from this. No doubt you're teaching it so much

564
00:36:53.719 --> 00:36:58.079
in this indo session. And this
is so beautiful. Thank you. Yes,

565
00:36:58.159 --> 00:37:00.159
you're welcome. So going on,
Stale back to your book here.

566
00:37:00.519 --> 00:37:06.679
Another chapter is recognizing relationships and red
herrings, and you say, simply knowing

567
00:37:06.719 --> 00:37:08.960
we're capable of and likely to do
this, that is, seeing patterns in

568
00:37:09.000 --> 00:37:14.280
things and ourselves can help ensure our
pattern recognition doesn't evolve into a pattern of

569
00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:19.800
expectation. Oh that's so powerful,
Yes, the idea. You know,

570
00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:22.119
it's always great when we can see
patterns in our work life, in our

571
00:37:22.159 --> 00:37:24.880
personal life, in our heads,
we say, you know, been there,

572
00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:28.920
done that. I know I can
handle this. But the caveat that

573
00:37:28.960 --> 00:37:31.320
I want to give us is we
should always benefit from our experience, but

574
00:37:31.440 --> 00:37:37.599
to make sure that pattern recognition does
not evolve into patterns of expectation. Because

575
00:37:37.599 --> 00:37:42.159
there are people out there, and
I don't say this in a conspiratorial theorist

576
00:37:42.320 --> 00:37:45.119
kind of way, there are people
that want to throw us off course.

577
00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:49.719
And we do live in an age
of disinformation. As sad as that makes

578
00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:52.800
me, we do live in an
age of disinformation. And when I talk

579
00:37:52.840 --> 00:37:55.880
about red herrings, what a red
herring is is somebody who is trying to

580
00:37:55.960 --> 00:38:00.320
throw you off course, or a
piece of information that's trying to throw you

581
00:38:00.360 --> 00:38:04.280
off course. So the way that
I ask people to make sure that we're

582
00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:07.079
not thrown off course by a red
herring is to be aware of what I

583
00:38:07.159 --> 00:38:12.400
call the anchor bias. What is
the anchor bias? It's the human tendency

584
00:38:12.480 --> 00:38:15.679
to believe the first thing we see
or hear is true before you repeat something

585
00:38:15.760 --> 00:38:20.559
in one ear and out your mouth, ask yourself, do I have evidence

586
00:38:20.639 --> 00:38:22.960
to back this up? Am I
going to tell my team this if I

587
00:38:23.000 --> 00:38:28.239
don't know that it's true. So
just having the idea that there are red

588
00:38:28.280 --> 00:38:30.920
herrings out in the world, that
there are people that are trying to distract

589
00:38:31.000 --> 00:38:35.559
us, things that are trying to
throw off course, throw us off course,

590
00:38:35.880 --> 00:38:39.119
will help us meet be more attuned
to them. I'm all for pattern

591
00:38:39.199 --> 00:38:42.760
recognition. How do we see things? How are they similar? How are

592
00:38:42.760 --> 00:38:45.920
they different? But just be careful
to make sure just because you see a

593
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:50.559
pattern doesn't mean that you're going to
expect or expect a certain outcome from others,

594
00:38:51.960 --> 00:38:53.920
beautifully said, just beautifully said,
Amy, Yes, I think that's

595
00:38:53.960 --> 00:38:58.800
really powerful. And talk about boy
having creating a better or a different outcome,

596
00:38:59.079 --> 00:39:02.800
right there is that that's powerful?
All right? So then I want

597
00:39:02.840 --> 00:39:07.519
to go on and talk next.
You also then talk about navigating problems with

598
00:39:07.639 --> 00:39:12.440
relationships successfully. Oh, that's that's
we have to talk about that. So

599
00:39:12.639 --> 00:39:15.000
you say we must look at all
the information objectively rather than trying to fish

600
00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:19.360
for facts that suit our desired solution. We all are guilty of that need

601
00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:22.119
too. This takes time and clarity
of thought. You say, these are

602
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:24.639
not resources that are always readily available. That is time and thought. It

603
00:39:24.719 --> 00:39:29.920
is work, but the results is
in the form of grounded solutions are well

604
00:39:29.960 --> 00:39:31.960
worth the efforts. So that's kind
of what you were saying before. But

605
00:39:32.000 --> 00:39:36.519
I think it's especially you know,
as you say we do, we are

606
00:39:36.559 --> 00:39:40.840
in the time of disinformation, and
so you know, doing ourselves the service

607
00:39:42.000 --> 00:39:46.000
of of being able to fare at
that and and triangulate that if you will

608
00:39:46.039 --> 00:39:51.559
and really judge this, that that
that information and certainly what it means to

609
00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:57.599
our relationships seems to be extremely critical
to develop that capacity. Stat absolutely,

610
00:39:57.719 --> 00:40:00.440
and the number one thing to remember
about relations and ships says they are never

611
00:40:00.559 --> 00:40:07.760
static. Relationships are never static.
Our personal relationships, our professional relationships are

612
00:40:07.840 --> 00:40:13.000
constantly moving and changing for the mere
reason, very simple reason that we're all

613
00:40:13.079 --> 00:40:15.920
human. And when someone comes to
work, you know that before that person

614
00:40:16.199 --> 00:40:20.840
has come to the conference room to
meet with you, a child has thrown

615
00:40:20.920 --> 00:40:22.519
up, a mother in law has
been sick, a doctor has to go

616
00:40:22.559 --> 00:40:28.440
to the vet, and that all
has a profound impact on that person's ability

617
00:40:28.719 --> 00:40:30.440
to do their job, to do
his or her job. And so the

618
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:35.559
reason I bring that up is because
when we are managing our relationships, we

619
00:40:35.639 --> 00:40:38.719
have to broaden our view and not
say, well, Sarah works with me

620
00:40:38.840 --> 00:40:43.559
Gareth gathering data. We have to
broaden the view and say, Sarah's going

621
00:40:43.559 --> 00:40:47.000
through a painful divorce right now,
and I'm not going to demand voluminous amounts

622
00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:52.000
of data by yesterday. We have
to understand that we can manage our relationships

623
00:40:52.199 --> 00:40:57.480
by broadening our vision of what those
relationships really entail, and to know that

624
00:40:57.559 --> 00:41:01.639
Sarah is absolutely excellent to gather data, but being aware of what's happening in

625
00:41:01.679 --> 00:41:06.679
Sarah's personal life is not only going
to enhance our relationship. We're going to

626
00:41:06.719 --> 00:41:09.880
be very realistic about what we can
expect from her and shift some of those

627
00:41:09.920 --> 00:41:14.400
expectations and maybe ask someone else for
some of that data. So when I

628
00:41:14.440 --> 00:41:17.159
talk about managing relationships, like so
many of the concepts in the book,

629
00:41:17.159 --> 00:41:22.239
I'm asking to broaden our vision instead
of narrowing our vision, managing the relationships

630
00:41:22.239 --> 00:41:29.239
with a broader lens so we can
adjust our expectations accordingly. Beautiful, absolutely

631
00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:32.519
beautiful, so much in that.
Okay, so we talked about this before

632
00:41:32.559 --> 00:41:36.400
we came on air, but probably
I really I have to say, as

633
00:41:36.440 --> 00:41:39.239
I told you, that whole chapter
that where you talk about the shoes is

634
00:41:39.320 --> 00:41:43.800
inter change your shoes. That's so, so incredible, But the deadline chapter

635
00:41:44.079 --> 00:41:45.519
isn't really where it's at for me. Right, as we were speaking about

636
00:41:45.719 --> 00:41:50.440
before we got on air. So
you know, neither one of us would

637
00:41:50.440 --> 00:41:52.559
have a book out if we didn't
understand how to work with deadlines. Absolutely

638
00:41:52.920 --> 00:41:57.239
right. But you say, by
shifting our perspective on deadlines, we can

639
00:41:57.280 --> 00:42:00.480
harness their benefits. Not only can
they lead the discovery of the unexpected and

640
00:42:00.559 --> 00:42:06.280
possibly better, but deadlines can also
help alleviate the stress of not having too

641
00:42:06.360 --> 00:42:09.559
much time to second guess yourself.
Wow. They can also breed confidence since

642
00:42:09.599 --> 00:42:14.119
they give us goals that we can
meet and even exceed. Deadlines don't have

643
00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:16.360
to be a bear unless you planned
for them to be. That's exactly right.

644
00:42:16.920 --> 00:42:21.800
That's exactly right. When I was
talking before, and I was referencing

645
00:42:21.800 --> 00:42:24.880
before about breaking things into bite sized
pieces, I just wanted to throw one

646
00:42:24.920 --> 00:42:30.920
anecdote in there. Leonardo da Vinci. It's apparently in art history, it's

647
00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:35.599
sort of this folklore that Leonardo da
Vinci carried the Mona Lisa around with him

648
00:42:35.679 --> 00:42:40.239
everywhere, everywhere and was constantly revising, constantly revising, constantly revising, and

649
00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:45.480
then he died, so the painting
was then finished. If Leonardo da Vinci

650
00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:50.320
had had a deadline, what would
the Mona Lisa look like? You know,

651
00:42:50.360 --> 00:42:53.519
we have to think about deadlines as
fostering an opportunity to be creative.

652
00:42:53.599 --> 00:42:57.400
It's a problem that we have to
solve. This is what I have to

653
00:42:57.440 --> 00:42:59.920
get done, and this is the
date by which I have to do it.

654
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:02.800
Let's break it into those bite sized
pieces and let's try to be creative

655
00:43:02.800 --> 00:43:07.199
by getting to that deadline in the
best possible fashion. We all have deadlines

656
00:43:07.599 --> 00:43:10.480
every single day. We have to
meet them. We have to get there.

657
00:43:10.840 --> 00:43:15.760
But if we start to look at
them differently and again get on the

658
00:43:15.800 --> 00:43:19.599
other side of the issue and say, how can I look at this deadline

659
00:43:19.639 --> 00:43:22.679
differently to make it more accessible,
more fun, or more creative, We're

660
00:43:22.679 --> 00:43:27.400
going to get there, celebrate those
milestones, and then move on to the

661
00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:31.960
next deadline. We all have them, but instead of making a looming behemoth,

662
00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:37.920
let's make it into smaller, digestible
parts that we can talk about and

663
00:43:37.960 --> 00:43:40.840
that are much more realistic, And
let's not be Leonardo da Vinci. Really

664
00:43:40.880 --> 00:43:45.199
and when it comes to a deadline
again, don't let perfection be the enemy

665
00:43:45.199 --> 00:43:49.840
of good just don't you know.
I have to say I have changed my

666
00:43:49.920 --> 00:43:53.519
relationship to deadlines. And I would
say it happened maybe starting four years ago,

667
00:43:53.840 --> 00:43:59.920
and I produced a very different result. When I'm working under a dead

668
00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:02.880
lee that something happens. This creativity
gets unleashed, this does this, I

669
00:44:02.880 --> 00:44:07.840
don't know, this weird energy gets
released and I create something very very different.

670
00:44:08.719 --> 00:44:14.480
I couldn't agree more. And somehow
the I believe that the creation of

671
00:44:14.519 --> 00:44:20.360
a deadline stimulates adrenaline or stimulates A
big believer in neuroplasticity, A different part

672
00:44:20.360 --> 00:44:23.079
of your brain goes into action when
you know that you have a deadline.

673
00:44:23.320 --> 00:44:28.800
And so I really I rely on
my neuroplasticity all the time, saying Okay,

674
00:44:29.199 --> 00:44:30.960
I need to do this. So
I'm going to find a way,

675
00:44:31.280 --> 00:44:36.079
and whether it means being creative in
ways that I never thought about it,

676
00:44:36.119 --> 00:44:37.639
I'm going to find a way because
I'm going to get it done. So

677
00:44:37.679 --> 00:44:40.440
while I don't embrace them and love
them the way I you know, don't

678
00:44:40.480 --> 00:44:45.440
embrace the cancer journey, there are
great things that can come from deadlines.

679
00:44:45.960 --> 00:44:49.199
Oh, just quickly. I mean
one Saturday morning, I was I was

680
00:44:49.280 --> 00:44:53.599
scheduled I delivered the keynote session for
a Toastmaster's conference on Friday night. Saturday

681
00:44:53.599 --> 00:44:57.880
morning, I was up just reviewing
my slides for the workshop I was due

682
00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:00.159
to do that afternoon and looked at
my slides and I went, oh,

683
00:45:00.320 --> 00:45:04.440
no, this will not do.
I can't do this. I'm way past

684
00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:07.880
this. Totally redid the whole session, I mean like right there, and

685
00:45:08.039 --> 00:45:13.239
you know we have done two and
a half hour period, came to the

686
00:45:13.679 --> 00:45:15.599
hotel, delivered and it was out
of the out of the ballpark. They

687
00:45:15.840 --> 00:45:20.480
loved it. Right past example,
a perfect example that I would have never

688
00:45:20.559 --> 00:45:23.639
done that. I would have never
created that under those conditions in that time

689
00:45:23.679 --> 00:45:28.280
period, under the wire like that. But you did. Is you forced

690
00:45:28.360 --> 00:45:30.400
clarity of thought. You said,
I have to get this done, I

691
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:32.960
need to make it better, I
have to redo this. And you forced

692
00:45:34.000 --> 00:45:37.199
your brain into this clarity to create
a presentation that you would have probably had

693
00:45:37.280 --> 00:45:40.519
days to do before. And in
the last minute, that deadline forced that

694
00:45:40.559 --> 00:45:45.559
creativity over the finish line. Yeah, thank you, it was. I

695
00:45:45.639 --> 00:45:47.480
was one of one of one of
my best moments. So anyway, so

696
00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:52.480
these these deadline things really can be
useful. So, Amy, we've managed

697
00:45:52.519 --> 00:45:53.519
to get all the way up to
the end of the hour. Here I

698
00:45:53.559 --> 00:45:57.639
wanted to talk about your just do
it chapter. That means listeners of yours

699
00:45:57.639 --> 00:46:00.800
are just gonna have to pick up
the book and get it yourself. So

700
00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:02.599
do you know the show is listened
to by people all over the world,

701
00:46:02.679 --> 00:46:06.519
Amy, and we really are out
to be able to create a place,

702
00:46:06.559 --> 00:46:09.079
a workplace where people actually want to
come to work through their best and become

703
00:46:09.119 --> 00:46:13.559
their best, and we create inspirational
leaders that actually lead them to their greatness,

704
00:46:13.719 --> 00:46:15.920
and we do business that betters the
world. What would you like to

705
00:46:15.960 --> 00:46:17.360
leave us with today? I would
like to leave you. I wish I

706
00:46:17.440 --> 00:46:21.199
could say it was an original quote
of mind, but it comes from the

707
00:46:21.239 --> 00:46:24.440
writer Henry James, and he said, try to be the person on who

708
00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:30.400
nothing is lost. And by augmenting
our vision and whatever that means, vision,

709
00:46:30.480 --> 00:46:34.599
listening, seeing, thinking, touching, whatever it is, try to

710
00:46:34.639 --> 00:46:37.440
be the person on who nothing is
lost. And if you aspire to that,

711
00:46:37.599 --> 00:46:42.639
I think it'll make you more engaged
with the world and a better problem

712
00:46:42.639 --> 00:46:45.840
solver. Oh, Amy, that's
a delightful way to finish. Try to

713
00:46:45.840 --> 00:46:50.960
be the person on whom nothing is
lost is lost. Oh. I think

714
00:46:50.960 --> 00:46:53.400
that's delightful, you know, literally
in other words, not letting a single

715
00:46:53.480 --> 00:46:58.480
morsel of life and a person get
past you. That's exactly it. And

716
00:46:58.519 --> 00:47:01.719
everyone's going to take a different But
the more we can get engaged with our

717
00:47:01.760 --> 00:47:07.679
world, the more we can give
back. So that is delightful. Amy,

718
00:47:07.719 --> 00:47:09.519
thank you. I am so grateful
that you have crossed my path,

719
00:47:09.920 --> 00:47:13.559
that we've been introduced. And I
said, as I said before, you

720
00:47:13.599 --> 00:47:15.360
can rhy, but you can't hide. I know how to find you,

721
00:47:16.239 --> 00:47:20.320
not hide. I would be overjoyed
to reconnect. I want to thank you

722
00:47:20.360 --> 00:47:23.440
so much with gratitude to thank you
so much for having me on the podcast

723
00:47:23.480 --> 00:47:28.039
today. You're so welcome, an
absolute delight, and I one of the

724
00:47:28.039 --> 00:47:30.199
great things is getting to be able
to help you share your book and what's

725
00:47:30.199 --> 00:47:32.880
your what's your message? Is so
happy to do that. Thank you very

726
00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:36.679
very much. You're welcome. And
on that note, listeners and viewers,

727
00:47:36.679 --> 00:47:38.280
if you want to learn more about
Amy Herman, her work, or her

728
00:47:38.320 --> 00:47:44.039
books, you can start by visiting
her website, artful perception dot com.

729
00:47:44.079 --> 00:47:50.400
That's a Artful Perception Artful perception dot
com. Last week, if you missed

730
00:47:50.400 --> 00:47:52.320
the live show you Can Always Can't
be a recorded podcast, we were on

731
00:47:52.320 --> 00:47:55.400
the Arrow with Chris King, who
was focused on helping people to discover their

732
00:47:55.400 --> 00:48:00.239
own unique truth. We talked about
how mindset and attitude play a key role

733
00:48:00.280 --> 00:48:02.639
in limiting or expanding our lives.
Next week, we'll be on there with

734
00:48:02.719 --> 00:48:07.320
Kelly McDonald talking about her book.
It's time to talk about race at work,

735
00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:09.320
which to help us better understand how
to menially engage in the d e

736
00:48:09.559 --> 00:48:14.000
I n B world. Now B
is for belonging for those of you who

737
00:48:14.000 --> 00:48:15.440
don't know that. See you there. Remember that work is at least a

738
00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:21.559
third of our lives. So let's
work on purpose. We hope you've enjoyed

739
00:48:21.599 --> 00:48:25.320
this week's program. Be sure to
tune into Working on Purpose featuring your host,

740
00:48:25.360 --> 00:48:30.719
doctor Elise Cortez, each week on
the Voice America Empowerment Channel. Together,

741
00:48:31.039 --> 00:48:37.440
we'll create a world where business operates
conscientiously, leadership inspires impassioned performance,

742
00:48:37.880 --> 00:48:43.320
and employees are fulfilled in work that
provides the meaning and purpose they crave.

743
00:48:44.039 --> 00:49:00.679
See you there, Let's work on
Purpose. The