Essence Mining Alise Cortez’s Path to Purpose

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What's working on purpose anyway? Each
week we ponder the answer to this question.

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People ache for meaning and purpose at
work, to contribute their talents passionately

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and know their lives really matter.
They crave being part of an organization that

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inspires them and helps them grow into
realizing their highest potential. Business can be

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such a force for good in the
world, elevating humanity. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration to help
usher in this world we all want

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Working on Purpose. Now Here is
your host, Doctor Elise Cortes. Welcome

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back to the Working on Purpose Program. Thanks for tuning again this week.

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I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortez. Doing you live from Dallas, Texas,

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which is home base for me.
I've been tuning in for a while.

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You know. This program is a
thought leadership series that enlightens and inspires

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listeners with insights from distinguished business leaders
and subject matter experts. Our conversations are

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designed to elevate your thinking and entice
you to take a conscious and inspirational approach

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toward leadership and business. Before we
get in today's conversation, I've got two

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announcements for you. First, we've
launched the gusto Now platform. It's a

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growth and transformation e learning platform dedicated
to awakening meaning, passion, inspiration and

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purpose in people, leadership, and
organizations. It features leadership development and other

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professional developments courses in English, Spanish, and Portuguese. You can learn more

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at gustodashnow dot com. Secondly,
my book Purpose Ignited, How Inspirational Leaders

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Ignite passion and Elevate Cause is due
out November seventeenth. It's on Amazon Now

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for pre order. I wrote the
book to turn readers on and ignite their

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passion, inspiration and purpose, to
make a contribution worthy of their one precious

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life and create leaders who radically improve
the workplace as we know it. It

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was so much fun and came from
the pandemic. So here we go now

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onto this week's program. Today we're
turning the tables on usual programming and I'll

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be on the other side of the
mic. Previous guests Danny getting Gutnek is

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on the other side, and this
idea was hashed after he was on the

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program a few months ago. Danny
is fascinated with people and organizations that intend

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to live life fully, expressing their
lives uniquely and by doing extraordinary work.

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He is the CEO of Pathways,
which helps clients transform people processes in every

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phase of the organization, from recruiting
and retention to leadership development and cultural transformation.

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He's the author of meaning at Work
and it's hidden language. In this

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conversation, you'll become acquainted with a
method Danny developed called essence mining, which

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he will use with me to depict
my own path to purpose and how I

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express it today. So here goes
Danny, Welcome back to working on Purpose

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on the other side of the mic. Happy to be on board. I

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guess I'll just dive right into it, lease and start with the interview.

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So just let's start off by actually
telling us where you were born. Where

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did you grow up? Well,
I was born actually in Calville, Washington,

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which is like northeastern Washington, just
under the Canadian border. People off

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asked me where my accent is from, and I think it's because I'm close

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to Canada. So that's where I
was raised, and so I spent most

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of my all of my earlier formative
years in the Northwest. Wow, did

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you what did your parents do when
you were growing up? They were very

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very successful, first farmers and then
restaurant tours. Though my mother was married

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five times by the time I was
twenty eight and I got husband. She

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got husband number five and my dad
when I was in second grade, and

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so I call him my dad.
Did you did they give you any sort

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of models for work or ideas about
work in general? Absolutely? Absolutely.

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I talked about this in my book. It was a way of life.

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They really taught that work was something
noble, This is something this is the

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way you spent your life. This
is what you did. This is how

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you went through life and were a
service to other people. So when you

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were young and you were kind of
getting that idea, what what ideas did

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you have about what you wanted to
be when you were growing up and going

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into the work world. Are you
ready? Are you sure you want to

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hear this? I was very,
very clear and firm, and I think

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by second or third grade that I
had one singular aspiration in life, and

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that was to become a horse.
So I had a horse of my own,

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Sugarfoot, and he was my best
friend, and I practiced being a

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horse. I went around on all
fours in the house and gave my siblings

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rides on my back. I winned
practicing my winning. My parents were horrified,

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but that was what I knew I
wanted to be when I grew up.

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Wow, So I got to say, I've never heard that one before.

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What came after that? I mean, did you have any thoughts about

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I mean, gosh, veterinarian school
or anything like that, or you know.

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After I got over that and that
whole vision left me, and I

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really was kind of perplexed for quite
a while, right until I got into

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high school and thought that maybe psych
cology could be a good place for me.

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But for the longest time, I
went I don't know. Wow,

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So you went to high school and
then when did When did psychology register on

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the radar? So it's interesting I
had I had when I was in high

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school. I was one of those
kind of old soul people and just kind

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of had a rare maturity at the
time, and people would just you know,

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come to me and ask for advice
and direction, and I just had

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my I had. I was just
really comfortable in my own skin. And

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I did study some psychology. So
in my latter years of high school,

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that's what I thought I probably should
study. I didn't have the time,

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which is part of the ongoing unfolding
story. But that's what I knew then

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and I ultimately came back to later. Were there any other topics in school

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that you were really interested in?
Yeah, it was funny back then.

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You know, I was graduating in
nineteen eighty three and you asked the counselor

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what to study, where to go, and they said, well, what

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what courses did you like? That's
what they ask you. And I liked

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my business courses, and specifically I
happened to be a great type. Wow,

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So I did study. I went
to I went to I went to

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Portland and studied eight months of business
college and accounting, et cetera. And

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that's kind of where I started professionally. So so when you went to college

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and studied business, you know,
take us through that experience and then up

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to your first job. My first
job is super important. So so,

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while I was still living in where
I grew up, in Hermiston, Oregon,

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where my parents had me working for
them in the restaurant business, which

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was an enormous, huge part of
my unfolding. It took me from a

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really shy, quiet kid to a
very confident, capable young person. Incredible

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experience. But while I was still
in high school and waiting tables. I

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also had a co op job and
I was working for that for this pumping

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company as like an admin person.
And I met the owner of the company,

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who happened to live in Portland,
Oregon, and he said these magical

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words to me one day, Danny. He said, if you ever find

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yourself in Portland, you've got a
job with me in Portland and growing go

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to town with forty eight hundred people. That was my ticket out. So

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my first job was after I got
through those eight months of business college,

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I went to work for Roland Hartele
in his real estate commercial development company again

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as his assistant. And that was
my first job. And it was an

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amazing start to my life. Wow, So what was what was interesting about

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it? Getting hired and then later
getting fired. So so you know,

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I just thought it was the greatest
thing is nineteen eighty three, eighty four.

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I'm making eight hundred bucks a month. I got a cute, little

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little apartment in downtown Portland. I
think I've got the you know the world

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by the tail. I don't know
any better. And he was so fun

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to work with. He gave me
a lot of stretch assignments, and he

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was just fun and jubilant, and
I learned so much. But then when

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about eighteen months in the other major
part of that import of the job was

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he literally one day, on the
way out to lunch, opened the door

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wide and on his way out,
over his shoulder he said, you have

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to get out of here. You
have to go see the world, get

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an education, do something with yourself. But before you go, hire your

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replacement. And the door shut.
Wow, that's not natistic. It was

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so fantastic, you know, because
I was never probably going to leave.

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I didn't know any better. So
here's the important part about that, Danny.

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I didn't know I could go to
college. My parents were entrepreneurs.

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We never talked about college, right, So a bachelor's, two masters,

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and a PhD. Letter, I
think I could check that box. That

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thing about living being you know,
in other parts of the world, I

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didn't know anything about that, right, And so lived lived in Spain and

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Brazil and speak those languages, have
been in many places for work and anyway,

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he totally saved my life. That's
amazing. So when you were there,

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you mentioned that that he gave you
stretch assignments and things like that were

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there certain things that you really resonated
with or things that you didn't resonate with

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when you were in that job.
You know, that's interesting that was.

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You know, this is a few
years ago. I don't remember so much

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about the job itself really resonating.
I guess what I do remember or is

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I love that he gave me such, you know, kind of a rope

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to hang myself. I remember once
he gave me this assignment to go and

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create this some kind of like computer
program for something in accounting, and I

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completely messed it up. But he
gave me all, you know, he

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just gave it to me and like, just go handle it, just take

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it. And I've always since realized
that one I like being in charge.

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I like doing things that you know, are that I don't know how to

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do that stretch me. So I
guess that would be the one thing I

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remember the most I loved. Well, the other thing was I loved interact

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with all of his clients and feeling
like I was his confidant. Ooh,

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that's another important thing. That was
just a big anew right there. And

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that's what I do today, right
to be I get to have very intimate

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relationships with my clients. I get
to hold their confidence and be a space

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for them really like I was for
him. Yeah, so you he kicks

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you out of the nest, what
do you go do next? Well,

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it took me a couple of years
of kind of bumbling around trying to figure

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out what to do from there,
because I understood that I I had to

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go, I had to go do
something. But ultimately, at age twenty

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four, I got myself into college
and that was like, all right,

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now this is the ding ding ding
ding ding. Okay, this is the

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right place to be and totally needing. I've really since I really understood Danny

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that I cannot live without the ongoing
intellectual feeding. And so that was the

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next the next stop along the journey. So what did you study when you

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went back to college. Well,
so the first eight months were really just

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kind of like business school, so
I wasn't really college, and that was

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accounting and when I was eighteen.
So when I got into college at twenty

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four, I studied really communication,
so I've got I got an associate communication

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and I also did I also learned
French, which was really important. I

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wanted to learn piano and French at
that time, and that's turned out to

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be a really really important decision because
of my future travel. But that's how

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it started communication. Wow, So
what was it about communication? And that

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kind of captured your interest? You
know, I'll tell you it's so interesting

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and this is such a great conversation
because you're helping me see things from a

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very different way than I have from
my own story so far. So thank

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you for this cool experience. You
know. I think what I really got

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present to is when I want to
go work for my parents in the restaurant

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business. I started off this really
quiet, introverted, bookish person. I

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think I was really destined to be
the town librarian because what I knew was

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books and study And when my parents
asked me to work, well not asked,

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but kind of command, and that
I come to work for them in

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the restaurant, I developed this tremendous
ability to relate to other people and really

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develop more of like a showmanship I
could perform in front of a group.

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So I could go to a group
of twenty five people, greet them all

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and be charismatic and fun, get
all of their orders, and memorize them

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in my head without writing anything down. And seamlessly deliver the experience. Right.

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So there was something about presenting that
out even today that I find that

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I'm I was gravitated to and about
conveying a message and developing what it is

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that you say. So, I'm
sure that that was part of the attraction.

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So you mentioned something interesting about delivering
and experience that jumps out as so

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what does that mean to you?
Yeah? So, you know, looking

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back again, that just the transformation
of the four years that I worked for

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my parents in high school in the
restaurant. Amazing journey and discovery. But

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that experience, you know, bringing
people in so and I still do it

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today, right, So, and
it's never left me as when people come

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into your space. This is really
interesting actually, because when people come into

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your space, I always felt like
it was so important. They're coming into

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our restaurant. I want them to
feel welcome, wanted and glad, they

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said, Yes, that's the first
thing. So I want them. I

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want them to feel seen and connected. I want to, I want to

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delight them. I want to and
whatever they wanted. There were times when

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I used to affect different kinds of
accents over the years as I waited tables

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to be whatever they wanted me to
be, and it was just something that

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was a way to engage them over
the moment of eating. That that was

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really important to me. And what's
distinguishing about that, Danny, is that

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that was about receiving people into my
world right, And I still do that

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want to entertain for personally. But
now today so much of my work is

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about going into somebody else's environment and
giving them an experience. So but there's

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something about giving the experience that's really
important. So you finish college with the

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with the communications degree. I finished
my associates two years in. Oh you

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associates, okay? And then and
then what happened? Oh well, then

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then another part of the journey continues, and that I was just finishing my

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associates when I started dating this man
named Arthur. He was an oil and

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gas executive guy. And about a
month into the relationship, he said,

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Hey, guess what. My company's
going to move you to Madrid, Spain.

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And I put my hand out to
shake it shake as I said,

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You're going to do great. It's
going to be fantastic for you. Oh,

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what a great opportunity. And he
pushed my hand in and he goes,

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I think you should come with me, and I thought, you know,

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I don't have any debt, I
don't have a career, I'm a

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college student. I'm gonna say yes
to this. And so four months of

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knowing this guy following him to Madrid, Spain. And now that's where the

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language comes in, because I did
use my French to get around some of

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Europe. So by the time I
got to Spain, I'd learned some Spanish.

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I could easily get around. And
then I learned about distance programming,

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and I continued my bachelor's degree with
the University of Iowa and just kept moving.

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Wow, so what did you get
your bachelor's in? So it's liberal

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studies and the fun part of the
story, the really fun part of the

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stories. I'd contracted with all my
professors at the University of Iowa for all

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my courses in advance on all my
books. And then when I was in

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Madrid, Spain, literally I didn't
have a work thesis. So there were

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times when I would get on the
urrail and I would get a pass and

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by myself while my mom my boyfriend
worked, I would go in gallivant over

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western Europe and I would do my
assignments while I was on the train.

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So I would literally I do my
assignments. I'd get off the train,

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go find a fax machine in nineteen
ninety one and fax my assignments anti University

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of Iowa. And what I didn't
know was at the other end of that

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fax machine they were like, who
is this Elase person. Here's something from

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Pinneling, here's something from Spain,
here's something from Denmark or something from Germany.

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Who is this person? Right?
So it was an incredible experience and

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it continued. Actually there's more to
that story, but we should probably grab

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our first break. You're ready?
Sounds good? Yeah, okay, So

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I'm your host, Doctor Release Cortes. We're on the air today with Danny

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Gutnak, who is fascinated with people
and organizations that intend to live fully expressed

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lives, uniquely and by doing extraordinary
work. He is the CEO of Pathways

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and the author of meaning at Work
and It's hidden language. He joined today

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from Phoenix, Arizona. Today we
are doing something unusual, and that's he

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He is essence minding my life and
my path purpose. Stay with us.

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We'll be right back. Doctor Release
Cortes is a management consultant specializing in meaning

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00:15:56.039 --> 00:16:02.399
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and
author, she helps companies visioneer for greater

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purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired
leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment,

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performance, and commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to invite

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Elise to speak to your organization,
please visit her at elisecortes dot com.

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Let's talk about how to get your
employees working on purpose. This is working

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on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes.
To reach our program today or open a

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00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:42.399
conversation with Alise, send an email
to Alise Alise at elisecortes dot com.

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Now back to working on purpose.
Thanks for staying with us, and welcome

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back to working on purpose. If
you're just joining us. My guest is

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Danny Gutnek. He's the CEO of
Pathways, which helps clients transform people processes

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in every phase of the organization,
from recruiting and retention to leadership development and

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cultural transformation. I'm your host,
doctor Realize Cortes. All right, Danny,

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so what's next? So you're traveling
across Europe, you're faxing in your

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homework. I'm guessing going to pay
person of Iowa. Yeah, yeah,

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why pursue that particular degree. Yeah, this was an important thing. So

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what I want to also presence that
you know, the people that you managed

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to recruit in your life are very
important. And my boyfriend Arthur was a

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really important person to me, ten
years older than me, and he was

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a Jewish guy from Chicago, and
when we got to to Spain, he

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said, you know, you've got
to keep going with your education. This

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is education is something no one can
ever take away from you. So think

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about that as a Jewish person,
no one can ever take that away from

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you. I really appreciate how supportive
and guiding he was to me. So

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together we found this big book of
universities that had a distance program, and

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it was important for me that I
chose one that had an actual brick and

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mortar it wasn't just you know,
ABC university kind of thing. So that

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was the first thing. And secondly, what I really realized I wanted to

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study was more like liberal studies,
liberal liberal arts, and that's what I

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did. So my bachelor's is in
liberal studies, and so was my master's.

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So that's what that's why it was
that why did you choose that I

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I guess I gravitated was again the
divining rod, as I like to say,

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working its way in my life,
and that I wanted to. I

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wanted more of like a classic in
you know, in education. So I

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wanted to I wanted to study,
you know, anthropology. I wanted to

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study philosophy. I wanted to study
history. I wanted to stay little something

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about the arts, religion, right, I kind of want to understand that

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those kinds of things, those elements
that really comprised the human condition. So

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you how long did you stay in
Europe and when did you decide to come

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back? So we were in Madrid
for six months, crazy, amazing,

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beautiful experience, literally went all over
Western Europe together and not you know,

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also my little jaunts as well.
And then six months into that he comes

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back to me, Arthur, and
he says, guess what next leg of

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the journey? They want to send
us to Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.

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And I said, you know,
I think I might get off the bus

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and go back to Portland, Oregon
and do my life again. He goes,

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I'll do anything to make you stay, Okay, So we moved to

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Rio Decenio in August of nineteen ninety
one and spend two years there. It

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was an amazing experience, and then
I got my Portuguese from that. And

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when did you finish your degree when
you were in Rio de Janeiro. Yeah,

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so I literally was. I was
a full time, dedicate, dedicated

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student I had. I had,
Danny. I had a life that ever

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most people would kill for. Frankly, I'm twenty six years old. I

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live in a beautiful house. My
boyfriend is an executive in a big,

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large company. We haven't made a
chauffeur and a gardener. I travel all

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the time with him for his business. I don't I'm not working because I'm

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a visa. So what I I
do is I pour myself into my studies.

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And so I was able to finish
my bachelor's degree. I think it

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was January of ninety three is when
I finished it, something like that,

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and then literally the next day started
my master's degree. So take us to

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the next step of your journey.
What happens after Rio de Janeiro. Yeah,

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I got so this is really important, really important for a conversation about

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essence, is that as wonderful as
that life was, Danny, I really

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really suffered in that time, and
that I just felt like I was a

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flag in someone else's wind and I
wanted to fly my own flag. It

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felt like I was just taking from
life. I wasn't giving anything back to

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it. I wasn't being of service, and it just killed me. There

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were so many times when Dalivar,
beautiful maid, would come and find me

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crying in the house, and I'm
sure she thought, what a crazy woman

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was. She's got everything, what
is she crying about? And so I

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left in August of ninety three and
came back to Portland and left the relationship

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and came back just to make my
own life. I needed to do that,

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and went through a series of sales
jobs and you know, found my

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way, bought my own house,
and you know, finally moved from Portland

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to Seattle. And that jump right, didn't right it as sales immediately right

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now, it's had I had a
better There's still a better story to that.

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So I when I came this is
so important, Oh my gosh,

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when I came back in August ninety
three, just think about that, I

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had become an very different human being
than I was when I left, And

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I did not know how to put
that new human being back into the place

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that I came from. And so
I just kind of thought, well,

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I need to finish my masters.
I'm halfway through my masters. What can

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I do that lets me be peaceful, lets me really have the time that

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I need to throw myself into my
studies and just you know, eat out

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a living while I figure out what
I'm going to do next. And the

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opportunity came when somebody, when this
woman offered to teach me and let me

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buy from her her very high end
residential cleaning business. And so I did

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that, and I learned how to
really clean you know, very high level

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homes, very very very well.
So I went from having a maid to

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being a maid. And it turned
out to be just what I needed to

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do because that all that time to
myself, it was my own business.

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I did it. I also did
the cleaning as well, and then I

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finished my master my master's and sorted
into my sales jobs about a year later.

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And I'm sure you found that cleaning
helps you alfully mentally compartmentalize things that

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you're thinking about and pondering. Yeah, and I can tell you for sure

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that I can trace it to I
loved walking into, you know, a

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really messy, dirty, disorganized home
and leaving it beautifully organized and with a

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statement. I love that. And
so today my work environment, if it's

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not clean and tidy, I am
not productive. I map it over to

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that for sure. That's awesome.
So what happened next? You're cleaning?

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You finish your degree while you're cleaning. Yep, I did. I finished

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my master's and then I moved.
So I started some sales jobs in Portland.

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I sold high end health club memberships. I was really good at that

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because I was in great shape.
Still that's important to me, let's see.

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And then I sold I'll get this. I sold Flower, the baking

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ingredient, Flower by the trainload.
And then I moved up to Seattle to

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fit to continue to do that in
a bigger capacity. And when I did

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that, that's where, actually it's
that's where what I would call my early

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onset midlife crisis began. Danny.
So, I was in my early thirties,

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thirty two, thirty three something like
that, and I had a good

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life. I'm like, look,
I got a beautiful, nice home,

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one in Portland, one in Seattle. I have a decent car. I

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get to travel. I had to
go on vacation. I got really nice

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friends. But the work that I
was doing, I'm selling Flower, which

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was great, but there was no
intellectual rigor there. And I just thought,

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oh, there can't. This cannot
be all there is to life.

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And so I started thinking what else
can I do? And so finally that's

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when I realized, I don't want
to have an affair. I don't want

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to I don't want to buy a
crazy new sports car. I don't want

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to go to an ashroom in India. I think I'll do a PhD.

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That was my answer to the midlife
crisis, and I think it was good

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for me. And that was that
was the end. That was the late

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nineteen nineties, and I would tell
you that definitely continued my path to purpose

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as I pursued those studies. No
question, So did you quit the job

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and pursue your PhD? Or did
you know us now not together? Yeah?

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So what I did was I left. It was kind of in tandem.

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I ended up leaving the Flower sales
job. And this is late nineteen

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ninety eight and back then it was
booming. I'm in Seattle, so I

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easily found a sales job selling information
technology staffing, and that is where I

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hit the jackpot. I went,
oh, my gosh, here it is

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My product is people. This is
where I'm supposed to be and it was,

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and we were focused on work.
I got to be able to learn

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about their lives and what did they
want to what they wanted to make happen

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in their lives through this process us, and then placed them in work that

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they found interesting. So then that's
where the judtaposition of people in work showed

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up for me. And I was
really good at that. I was really

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good. And so I sold those
staffing services and then I became a consultant

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as a recruiter, helping to build
out recruiting departments for other organizations and did

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that work while I worked on my
PhD. That's what I like about that.

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Yeah, what pulled you in?
What? No question? I loved.

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I loved the intimacy of it,
because you know, recruiting, as

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you know, right, recruiting people
for talking to people about their careers and

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what they want to do is really
an intimate conversation. And it's it's one

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that I always held very close in
honor to my heart that I was privileged

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to get to hear this about people's
lives. And so that's how I learned

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how to interview and understand life story
and understand meaning and work, which I

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later then researched for my PhD.
So I was pulled to that, and

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then the whole notion that it's centered
on the world of work, which I

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always found sacred. So people and
work perfect combination for me. So I

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did recruiting for five years while I
did my pH d. And your PhD

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was specifically what so it's with a
field and graduate university, and it's in

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it's in human development, and so
I had learned. That's where the divining

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00:26:18.039 --> 00:26:19.920
rod came back around. I said
that I learned about psychology when I when

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I was in high school. I
came fully back in circle. And the

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PhD is essentially it's a psychology and
sociology degree m so. And then and

395
00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:33.960
then what did you what did you
study for your PhD? What what did

396
00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:38.079
you kind of focus on your research? Yeah? I loved it. Oh

397
00:26:38.079 --> 00:26:41.920
it's so great, So I wanted
to I was here, I was placing

398
00:26:41.920 --> 00:26:45.799
all of these it people and these
really cool jobs, and they were in

399
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:48.920
my view, they were changing how
we communicate, how to practice healthcare,

400
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how we travel, how we how
planes moved through the sky. And I

401
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just thought it must be really amazing
to get to do this work. And

402
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so I thought to ask the people
IT people what did their work mean to

403
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them? And I wanted to know
was how was it related to their sense

404
00:27:02.200 --> 00:27:07.480
of identity? And so I interviewed
twenty five IT leaders and I discovered at

405
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the time these five modes of engagement, which were directional in nature. Either

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you were expressing yourself through your work. It was a resonant with you,

407
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a fit with you, It informed
you, it conflicted with you, etc.

408
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Like that. That's what I found
at the time, and people loved

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it when I talked about it,
and they would say, when are you

410
00:27:23.480 --> 00:27:26.119
going to write a book about that? And I'm like, Ah, it's

411
00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:27.920
just a research, it's just a
dissertation. I can't write a book about

412
00:27:27.920 --> 00:27:30.720
it. And it just laid follow
for a long time. But it kept

413
00:27:30.759 --> 00:27:33.640
working on me, that whole meaning
thing, the identity thing, kept working

414
00:27:33.680 --> 00:27:38.319
on me as I went along in
my career. From there, what was

415
00:27:38.359 --> 00:27:45.599
it about identity that why fixate on
that? Well, what I've really come

416
00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:49.319
to identity was really important Oh yeah, here we go. Now you're pulling

417
00:27:49.359 --> 00:27:53.319
back something for me here, I
got very present when I lived in Brazil,

418
00:27:53.400 --> 00:27:57.200
Danny, that identity was important because
I was in a different culture,

419
00:27:57.480 --> 00:28:02.160
and there's something about being im different
culture that helps you understand more and who

420
00:28:02.200 --> 00:28:07.720
you are because your different, your
differences stand out, and so I just

421
00:28:07.759 --> 00:28:10.920
really became aware of, you know, who I was, who I was

422
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.799
striving to become, and I knew
that I was always striving to become something

423
00:28:12.799 --> 00:28:18.160
more anyway, which is a part
of identity. But identity is a is

424
00:28:18.200 --> 00:28:22.400
a behavior driver. It's also it
also informs how we make our choices and

425
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:25.960
how it is that we how it
is that we talk to ourselves about ourselves

426
00:28:25.960 --> 00:28:30.359
and to others about ourselves. So
it's really this incredibly anchoring aspect that was

427
00:28:30.400 --> 00:28:33.599
really compelling for me and still is. And then you can look at it

428
00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:40.240
in relation to purpose, and then
it becomes really interesting. So I'm curious,

429
00:28:40.559 --> 00:28:44.799
take money out of the equation.
If you were you're pursuing your PhD,

430
00:28:45.279 --> 00:28:48.400
You've got a career and recruiting at
the same time. If you had

431
00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:52.240
to do one or the other and
give one up and just stick with it,

432
00:28:52.400 --> 00:28:57.079
you know for a while which one
would it have been. Oh,

433
00:28:57.680 --> 00:29:00.880
I would have to it would be
the peace, h you would be the

434
00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:03.880
research. I mean I am.
I am very much a person who needs

435
00:29:03.920 --> 00:29:07.960
to cogitate. I need to think, I need to learn, I need

436
00:29:07.000 --> 00:29:11.799
to delve. And that's gonna that's
going to be for everything. My mother

437
00:29:11.880 --> 00:29:15.240
used to say with you with horror, when are you going to be through

438
00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:21.880
with school? Like? I hope
never, mom. Yuh So, the

439
00:29:21.920 --> 00:29:26.519
continual learning piece in your threat,
your whole journey has been there absolutely and

440
00:29:26.519 --> 00:29:27.680
it will. I think it will
always be there today. Even today,

441
00:29:27.759 --> 00:29:32.920
I'm still working on a on a
diplomate program in log with therapy, which

442
00:29:32.960 --> 00:29:36.079
is kind of like doing another PhD
program. So yeah, it still continues.

443
00:29:37.119 --> 00:29:38.519
Yeah, what what is it that? What is it that that draws

444
00:29:38.559 --> 00:29:42.119
you in about that's just about the
study and the learning, I mean outside

445
00:29:42.160 --> 00:29:47.319
of just learning. What are the
topics that you've found that maybe you've come

446
00:29:47.359 --> 00:29:51.319
down this funnel. It's been wider
and now it's getting kind of more refined

447
00:29:51.319 --> 00:29:55.599
and more pinpointed. Yeah, well, let me let me just sort of

448
00:29:55.640 --> 00:29:57.400
say some of the things that it's
not. I'm not a person, you

449
00:29:57.440 --> 00:30:03.119
know, not as an astronomer.
Economics doesn't really interest me, Politics doesn't

450
00:30:03.119 --> 00:30:06.960
really interest me. But the kinds
of things that interest me and that I

451
00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:12.240
continue to study are a motivation,
meaning, identity, logo therapy, and

452
00:30:12.240 --> 00:30:15.880
that's another part, a big part
of what I'm doing, energy growth,

453
00:30:15.880 --> 00:30:19.599
and transformation. So those are the
kind of areas that I'm actually still studying

454
00:30:19.599 --> 00:30:26.680
today that I'm working to further extend
my own methodology and my own ongoing value

455
00:30:26.759 --> 00:30:30.920
contribution, if you will, so
to really refine how it is that I

456
00:30:30.960 --> 00:30:37.160
work with people. So those are
those are my sweet spots. What's so

457
00:30:37.319 --> 00:30:44.680
compelling about them to you? Just
personally they are They're the water I swim

458
00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:47.599
in. You know, I almost
can't distinguish myself from them. I'm so

459
00:30:48.400 --> 00:30:52.079
if I look at, like,
for example, logo therapy, logo therapy

460
00:30:52.119 --> 00:30:56.519
is a good way to kind of
start because logo therapy essentially teaches that meaning

461
00:30:56.640 --> 00:31:00.720
is our ultimate motivator in life.
It's it's the thing that we want to

462
00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:03.960
pursue, and therefore it's actually our
ultimate energy source. That's really interesting.

463
00:31:04.000 --> 00:31:07.960
So energy is really important to me. If you think about how fast do

464
00:31:07.039 --> 00:31:11.000
I talk, how fast do I
walk? There's all that's energy, right,

465
00:31:11.519 --> 00:31:15.240
and so I'm very great. I'm
very fixated on the notion of energy

466
00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:18.559
and becoming potential. And you and
I talked about potential in our conversation.

467
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:22.920
I'm aligned with you on that,
and so what does that take to always

468
00:31:22.960 --> 00:31:26.759
be pursuing your potential. It takes
energy, takes effort, it takes reach.

469
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:30.839
It doesn't happen when you're sitting calmly
on the couch and you know somebody

470
00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:33.160
you know taps on the shoulder says, hey, I'm here. You reach

471
00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:37.079
some new new level potential. You
know. It's takes something. And I

472
00:31:37.160 --> 00:31:41.039
love being that catalyzing force with people. I love doing that. It's good.

473
00:31:41.240 --> 00:31:44.839
Is it time for another break?
It is AT's grabber last break.

474
00:31:44.839 --> 00:31:47.359
You're you, You're better at this
than me, and this is good.

475
00:31:47.400 --> 00:31:49.319
I love it. I am at
least where attends. You're homes to be

476
00:31:49.400 --> 00:31:53.039
in there with Danny Gutnik, who
was fascinated with people and organizations that intend

477
00:31:53.119 --> 00:31:57.559
to live, to live fully expressed
life, uniquely and by doing extraordinary work.

478
00:31:57.759 --> 00:32:00.680
He's the CEO of Pathway and the
author of Meaning at Work and It's

479
00:32:00.720 --> 00:32:05.279
hidden language. You do it Today
From Phoenix Arizona. Stay with us after

480
00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:07.640
the rik, we're going to continue
the conversation with the path to Purpose.

481
00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:15.400
Doctor Release Cortes is a management consultant
specializing in meaning and purpose and inspirational speaker

482
00:32:15.400 --> 00:32:21.200
and author. She helps companies visioneer
for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose

483
00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:28.279
inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that
elevate fulfillment, performance, and commitment within

484
00:32:28.359 --> 00:32:31.960
the workforce. To learn more or
to invite Elise to speak to your organization,

485
00:32:32.319 --> 00:32:37.359
please visit her at Eleasecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get

486
00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:49.400
your employees working on purpose. This
is working on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes.

487
00:32:49.880 --> 00:32:52.799
To reach our program today or open
a conversation with Alise, send an

488
00:32:52.799 --> 00:33:00.880
email to Aleise Alise at Elisecortes dot
com. Now back to working on purpose.

489
00:33:07.119 --> 00:33:09.680
Thanks foresting with us, and welcome
back to working on purpose. If

490
00:33:09.680 --> 00:33:13.440
you're just tuning in, my guest
is Danny Gutnek, who's the CEO of

491
00:33:13.480 --> 00:33:16.519
Pathways, which helps clients transform people
processes in every phase of the organization,

492
00:33:16.839 --> 00:33:22.200
from recruiting and retention to leadership development
and cultural transformation. I'm your host,

493
00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:25.839
Doctor, Rely Scortes. Thanks next
Danny, Oh, okay, so Lee,

494
00:33:27.000 --> 00:33:29.799
So so I'm gonna I'm gonna give
you a little bit of kind of

495
00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:32.640
like reflect back and then and then
we'll go from there. It's interesting you

496
00:33:32.680 --> 00:33:37.559
started off, you know, thinking
about work when you were younger, you

497
00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:43.160
were you had a restaurant experience,
and in that experience, you were like,

498
00:33:44.000 --> 00:33:46.200
you realize that you were giving people
experiences. Hey, they're in your

499
00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:52.279
domain, and I really enjoy this
part of it. Obviously, next couple

500
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:54.759
of steps you take, you're you're
going through you know, experiences again,

501
00:33:54.880 --> 00:33:59.799
right, you you travel overseas,
you get this opportunity for a job.

502
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:02.880
What a great experience you had.
You go overseas, you have that experience,

503
00:34:02.920 --> 00:34:07.440
you end up coming back obviously with
the with the cleaning company. It's

504
00:34:07.480 --> 00:34:14.360
like you're you're you're also giving people
experiences, which is which is kind of

505
00:34:14.360 --> 00:34:17.199
cool. And then you get fascinated
with the experience of work when you stumble

506
00:34:17.239 --> 00:34:22.880
into recruiting. And so you get
into recruiting, you're doing your PhD at

507
00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:28.000
the same time, and it really
really kind of like starts to it starts

508
00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:30.840
to get a little bit more precise
for you and intentional for you in your

509
00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:36.719
in your life. And so that's
I'm just kind of summarizing a little bit.

510
00:34:36.840 --> 00:34:37.760
Maybe you can give me a little
bit of feedback on that. I've

511
00:34:37.800 --> 00:34:43.280
got some questions after this, kind
of steps after this, But what are

512
00:34:43.320 --> 00:34:45.880
your thoughts on that? Yeah,
that was a great summarization. And I

513
00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:49.760
the way I look at it,
Danny, is I in the rear view

514
00:34:49.800 --> 00:34:52.679
mirror. It looks like a constant
unfolding. It looks to me like,

515
00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:55.800
you know, the choices that I
made, the decisions that I made.

516
00:34:57.039 --> 00:35:00.239
You know, it was the divining
rod at work that just kept saying,

517
00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:04.519
you know, pulling me and calling
me, and all those decisions we were

518
00:35:05.039 --> 00:35:07.599
along the path, if you will. And I what I what? I

519
00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:12.159
know that I was always what I
was always reaching for, Danny, was

520
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:15.519
meaning I was working, I was
reaching for how do I become significant?

521
00:35:15.559 --> 00:35:19.320
How do I make a difference?
How do I matter? Right? That's

522
00:35:19.320 --> 00:35:24.000
what I wanted and that's what I
was pursuing. What did you have any

523
00:35:24.039 --> 00:35:29.960
idea what you wanted? What you
wanted to matter for? So if you

524
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:32.639
ask yourself what I want to matter? What doing? What? Well?

525
00:35:32.639 --> 00:35:36.880
When I when I got into the
PhD program in the staffing business in the

526
00:35:36.920 --> 00:35:40.079
recruiting space. I really loved that
whole notion of and I was really focused

527
00:35:40.079 --> 00:35:44.679
at that time. I was very
focused on, you know, the dissertation

528
00:35:44.920 --> 00:35:50.840
or the PhD studies and then the
dissertation. I quickly quickly realized that in

529
00:35:50.840 --> 00:35:53.239
this you'll see this as a theme
is I didn't want to stay with just

530
00:35:53.320 --> 00:35:57.519
recruiting because I didn't want to just
keep getting people jobs. I wanted to

531
00:35:57.760 --> 00:36:00.360
go and see, well, how
do we actually develop the person and once

532
00:36:00.360 --> 00:36:02.599
they're in the job, how do
we make them bigger, stronger, more

533
00:36:02.639 --> 00:36:07.679
impactful. So then I got into
learning and development, did that for a

534
00:36:07.679 --> 00:36:09.480
couple of years, and then you
know, it was easy. What was

535
00:36:09.519 --> 00:36:14.920
that like, that's interesting? Well, well, no surprise, right,

536
00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:16.920
that's my jam, right. I
love learning development, and so inciting or

537
00:36:17.039 --> 00:36:21.360
catalyzing that in others was really significant. Fro meracy. I would go and

538
00:36:21.719 --> 00:36:25.480
teach various kinds of professional development workshops
inside organizations, whether it was on crucial

539
00:36:25.480 --> 00:36:30.440
conversations or strengths finder. And I
love the whole thing of helping people gain

540
00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:34.920
new insights to themselves, learn something
about themselves that they didn't know. In

541
00:36:34.960 --> 00:36:38.800
fact, one of the circumstances through
which we find meaning is when we learned

542
00:36:38.840 --> 00:36:43.599
something different and new about ourselves that
we didn't know before. That's meaningful.

543
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:46.760
That's a circumstance where we can find
meaning. So to be the agent that

544
00:36:46.880 --> 00:36:52.400
helps cause that was incredibly interesting to
me, very very fulfilling, fascinating work

545
00:36:52.440 --> 00:36:57.320
for me to get to do.
So you hop out of recruiting, you

546
00:36:57.760 --> 00:37:01.119
get within learning and develop. Are
you working within a company? Are you

547
00:37:01.280 --> 00:37:05.239
or are you working with a lot
of companies? Through no, no good

548
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.880
question. So I had got I
started on my own path to work for

549
00:37:07.960 --> 00:37:14.280
myself in two thousand and three,
and I was those I was still recruiting

550
00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:17.119
for various clients back then while I
was finishing my PhD, which I finished

551
00:37:17.159 --> 00:37:21.840
at two thousand and five. So
I have been on my own path for

552
00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:25.840
most of my adult life after I
started my PhD. And then the reason

553
00:37:25.880 --> 00:37:30.360
that that happened in two thousand and
three Danny's because I had the wonderful,

554
00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:34.960
magical gift of becoming a mother and
my husband at the time was a full

555
00:37:35.000 --> 00:37:37.960
time consultant who traveled all the time, and I was like, you know,

556
00:37:37.039 --> 00:37:39.800
I don't want to I'm going to
continue working because work is really important

557
00:37:39.800 --> 00:37:44.079
to me, but I need to
do it on my terms. So let

558
00:37:44.119 --> 00:37:46.320
me work for myself, and that
way, I'm not putting her into daycare

559
00:37:46.360 --> 00:37:50.039
at seven am and picking her up
at you know, at seven pm.

560
00:37:50.039 --> 00:37:52.039
That for me, that was just
really important, and I had a nanny

561
00:37:52.079 --> 00:37:58.079
that helped me sometimes, and that
was really what started my my real path

562
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:04.639
to entrepreneurship. So you within the
R and B, you started to go

563
00:38:04.719 --> 00:38:10.000
out and teach different You mentioned crucial
conversations, you mentioned strengths finder, those

564
00:38:10.039 --> 00:38:16.320
types of things you've mentioned logo therapy. Tell me about that journey of you

565
00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:21.960
know, just working with companies and
what you've been doing with them. I

566
00:38:21.960 --> 00:38:24.519
think you might recognize a lot of
it in what you've been doing as well,

567
00:38:24.559 --> 00:38:28.119
and that for me it was like
a natural progression, right. So

568
00:38:28.679 --> 00:38:30.960
zech if you're in talent acquisition the
front end of the system, right,

569
00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:34.519
and then you go into learning and
involvement, that seems to be to be

570
00:38:34.559 --> 00:38:38.199
a natural progression. I then found
myself doing employee engagement work where I would

571
00:38:38.239 --> 00:38:43.199
go in and I would help organizations
assess the level of engagement of their employees

572
00:38:43.239 --> 00:38:45.440
and then help them consult to how
they can improve it. And I did

573
00:38:45.480 --> 00:38:49.039
that for a couple of years and
I loved that, and then I naturally

574
00:38:49.079 --> 00:38:52.519
found myself gravitated to help wanted to
develop leaders. How do we develop both

575
00:38:52.599 --> 00:38:57.199
managers and then also leaders? And
so I did that for several years,

576
00:38:57.639 --> 00:39:01.559
and then it naturally moved into organizational
development and then found the organizational transformation.

577
00:39:02.760 --> 00:39:08.360
And so I would say that's probably
where I was by the time it was

578
00:39:08.400 --> 00:39:15.719
about two thousand, well two thousand
and sixteen was organizational development. And then

579
00:39:15.760 --> 00:39:17.639
I went to work for another management
consulting firm for a couple of years,

580
00:39:17.639 --> 00:39:22.519
and that's where we got into the
transformation space. So that's you can I

581
00:39:22.559 --> 00:39:28.840
think it's a natural easy you can
see the progression just was a graduate journey.

582
00:39:28.920 --> 00:39:32.320
Yeah, so you went you went
from the one on one somebody looking

583
00:39:32.320 --> 00:39:37.559
for a job, to slowly going, okay, how does somebody how is

584
00:39:37.599 --> 00:39:42.119
somebody more fulfilled within the workplace?
To how are people fulfilled within the workplace?

585
00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:45.400
To how do you energize the whole
workplace? Yeah? Yeah, and

586
00:39:45.760 --> 00:39:49.239
so you know, I got to
tell you here's this is a really important

587
00:39:49.280 --> 00:39:52.639
to I would say a pivotal year
for me. Danny was twenty fourteen So

588
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:58.800
I had decided in twenty twelve to
go out and expand my dissertation research to

589
00:39:59.360 --> 00:40:02.800
now interview one hundred and fifteen men
and women from twenty different professions among the

590
00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:07.639
ages of eighteen and seventy to learn
about their experience of meaning and their work

591
00:40:07.639 --> 00:40:09.519
and their identity. And I then
found these fifteen modes of engagement. And

592
00:40:10.239 --> 00:40:13.960
I had the opportunity at the time
this was so cool, and this so

593
00:40:14.400 --> 00:40:19.679
synced with everything that's yummy and juicy
about the path is. I was called

594
00:40:19.679 --> 00:40:22.159
for that, Danny. I mean, this thing had me by the throat

595
00:40:22.159 --> 00:40:23.639
and it was not going to let
me go. And it was so much

596
00:40:23.679 --> 00:40:29.639
time and effort to produce this post
stock research, which I fully funded on

597
00:40:29.679 --> 00:40:31.559
my own. I did it on
my own. Later I had another callague

598
00:40:31.559 --> 00:40:36.079
who helped me on the back end
do some of the analysis. And that

599
00:40:36.239 --> 00:40:39.639
was truly a labor of love,
truly what it looks like to work with

600
00:40:39.760 --> 00:40:45.199
passion. So from there, because
I had done that research with my alma

601
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:47.800
mater, Fielding, they said,
hey, there's this business conference in India

602
00:40:47.800 --> 00:40:52.159
that if you apply for it and
they accept you, one you get to

603
00:40:52.159 --> 00:40:54.559
present your research and two you get
to be academically published, and I went,

604
00:40:55.239 --> 00:40:58.800
no, Rainer, India's on my
bucket list. I want to be

605
00:40:58.800 --> 00:41:02.239
academically plumaged public. I'll do it. So here it was is twenty fourteen.

606
00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:06.960
I've got these results, I've got
an academic article. I'm going to

607
00:41:07.039 --> 00:41:13.199
India in December. And in November
I get the opportunity to create a workshop

608
00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:16.400
from my new fresh research, and
I do this. It was around basically

609
00:41:16.519 --> 00:41:21.239
engagement, and I present it and
they love it, and I'm high as

610
00:41:21.239 --> 00:41:24.800
a kite. Danny's November of twenty
fourteen, coming back from this first time

611
00:41:24.840 --> 00:41:30.559
delivery, and my phone rings and
it's Voice America calling me saying, hey,

612
00:41:30.719 --> 00:41:32.519
we found you on LinkedIn. Went
to your website. We see that

613
00:41:32.599 --> 00:41:37.519
you are a speaker. You're a
consultant, usually mix for a good host.

614
00:41:37.559 --> 00:41:39.000
Would you like to host your own
show? And I went, I

615
00:41:39.000 --> 00:41:43.079
held a phone up from my like, this is all connected, This is

616
00:41:43.159 --> 00:41:46.519
all connected, right, And so
I went to I went to India in

617
00:41:46.559 --> 00:41:52.679
twenty fourteen and I presented and I
had this amazing, profound experience connecting with

618
00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:57.679
other cultures and learning some of their
language and spending three weeks there and I

619
00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:04.039
really realized that in that year I
had something really magical, had had shifted

620
00:42:04.039 --> 00:42:07.360
in me in a way that could
never go back, and that was that's

621
00:42:07.519 --> 00:42:10.440
really I would say the culmination for
me that I was forty nine years old

622
00:42:10.960 --> 00:42:15.719
and I man, I was,
I knew what I was supposed to be

623
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:21.760
doing. So you you've used a
couple of awesome metaphors. You know,

624
00:42:21.880 --> 00:42:28.400
had me by the throw. Did
you know you're just into it? What?

625
00:42:29.000 --> 00:42:32.800
Like? What did you describe that? Like? What was it about

626
00:42:32.800 --> 00:42:37.239
what you were doing or you felt
like you were doing that just captivated you

627
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:44.519
and got every ounce of your attention. I just I was tireless. I

628
00:42:44.559 --> 00:42:47.079
could not put it down. That
research. It was so all encompassing of

629
00:42:47.119 --> 00:42:51.840
me, and I hung on every
word of the interviews that I had,

630
00:42:51.880 --> 00:42:54.840
and I lovingly, you know,
deepbrief the research with all my participants,

631
00:42:54.880 --> 00:42:59.800
and I was back and fully in
that really intimate space in people's lives and

632
00:43:00.440 --> 00:43:04.679
bringing them to a new level of
understanding about themselves in the process. It's

633
00:43:04.719 --> 00:43:08.239
just incredibly rich exchange. And then
getting to present that and share that work

634
00:43:08.239 --> 00:43:12.239
and have it be so well received
people like I get it. I know

635
00:43:12.280 --> 00:43:15.039
what you're saying. I understand,
this makes so much sense. And then

636
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:16.480
getting to go to India, which
had been on my bucket list for so

637
00:43:16.599 --> 00:43:20.320
long, it felt like, you
know, it was just like it felt

638
00:43:20.400 --> 00:43:23.360
like it was effortless, like all
these things were happening and wasn't. I

639
00:43:23.440 --> 00:43:27.559
was just showing up, right,
I was just doing me and it all

640
00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:31.559
just went cerplunk. It all just
fit and it just was a it was

641
00:43:31.599 --> 00:43:37.480
a perfect mixture, the perfect ingredient
list, if you will, for me.

642
00:43:37.519 --> 00:43:42.039
When that was twenty fourteen, and
the other part of the story that's

643
00:43:42.119 --> 00:43:45.440
really important is so I got present
to that, Danny, and I got

644
00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:47.880
a hold of that, and then
in the other part of twenty fifteen,

645
00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:51.440
I didn't again didn't know. I
took a step back. I didn't know

646
00:43:51.480 --> 00:43:53.000
what to do with all that I
had become something else again, like when

647
00:43:53.039 --> 00:44:00.519
I came back from from Brazil,
and I didn't quite know how to operateize

648
00:44:00.599 --> 00:44:02.599
that. And so twenty fifteen a
lot of that was kind of floundering.

649
00:44:02.599 --> 00:44:06.239
I still had some clients I was
doing some great work with, but I

650
00:44:06.280 --> 00:44:12.159
definitely I realized, Danny that at
that time of my life I would have

651
00:44:12.159 --> 00:44:15.199
been fifty. I just there was
a part of me that was aware that

652
00:44:15.280 --> 00:44:19.960
I was not living to my potential. I knew I'd discovered and you know,

653
00:44:20.119 --> 00:44:22.559
come up to a new level of
my life, but I wasn't actualizing

654
00:44:22.599 --> 00:44:29.000
it and living it and making it
my professional expression. And I hated myself

655
00:44:29.000 --> 00:44:31.239
for it, and I didn't understand
why at the time or what to do.

656
00:44:31.760 --> 00:44:36.800
It was in the rearview mirror that
I got that and this awful,

657
00:44:37.039 --> 00:44:42.920
terrible feeling of just like, oh
my gosh, I'm wasting my life.

658
00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:45.840
This is not what I'm not living
to. What of my what my poetial

659
00:44:45.880 --> 00:44:47.679
could be was awful, and I
didn't I was married at the time.

660
00:44:47.679 --> 00:44:51.599
I didn't know what to do with
that. And but my release valve came

661
00:44:52.159 --> 00:44:53.880
when my ex husband, well husband
at the time, came to me in

662
00:44:53.880 --> 00:44:58.280
December of twenty fifteen and said,
I think I'm ready to be done now,

663
00:44:59.039 --> 00:45:01.719
and I went, oh, that's
an interesting idea. I hadn't thought

664
00:45:01.719 --> 00:45:06.920
about that, but okay. And
it was really that opening, Danny,

665
00:45:06.960 --> 00:45:09.360
that let me step into a new
clearing I then, you know, because

666
00:45:09.360 --> 00:45:13.440
I had put some self limiting restrictions
on myself about how I thought I could

667
00:45:13.440 --> 00:45:15.519
express my purpose. When I was
married and it just wasn't true. That

668
00:45:15.599 --> 00:45:20.320
was me And so when I got
divorced, it kind of forced me,

669
00:45:20.440 --> 00:45:22.960
like pushed me, like, you
are going to go do this right.

670
00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:25.719
You've now got no excuses. Get
out there, Cortes. And that's what

671
00:45:25.840 --> 00:45:30.719
happened. That's that was really the
major launch for me of stepping and I

672
00:45:30.760 --> 00:45:36.199
call it stepping into my shine and
started to really claim my purpose and you're

673
00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:39.480
and what are you doing now with
it? So now you know, I

674
00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:43.599
spent a couple of years in the
other company and really got clear that this

675
00:45:43.679 --> 00:45:47.039
is great to do transformation work,
but I really terribly absolutely don't want to

676
00:45:47.079 --> 00:45:52.480
sell somebody else's product or service.
I want to deliver my own message what

677
00:45:52.599 --> 00:45:55.760
I think is important to the world. So in July twenty eighteen, I

678
00:45:55.800 --> 00:46:01.599
literally separated from that organization, jumped
off the premieral Cliff to go work for

679
00:46:01.639 --> 00:46:05.400
myself again. I didn't have a
single client that said I want to work

680
00:46:05.400 --> 00:46:08.480
with you. I just knew there
was no way I could deny this force

681
00:46:08.519 --> 00:46:13.320
inside of me that said, Cortes, this is your life, one precious

682
00:46:13.360 --> 00:46:15.840
life. Don't make any excuses.
Get to it right. And that was

683
00:46:15.880 --> 00:46:19.800
one and so that year, Danny
was where I said, I'm going to

684
00:46:19.880 --> 00:46:22.559
do three things. I'm going to
draft my book, I'm going to start

685
00:46:22.559 --> 00:46:24.760
a nonprofit, and I am going
to create my own leadership program. And

686
00:46:24.800 --> 00:46:29.199
I did those things and they were
an expression of my purpose. And then

687
00:46:29.239 --> 00:46:36.199
twenty nineteen saw me developing those I
actually delivered. People entered the Fidely Inspired

688
00:46:36.239 --> 00:46:39.239
program and graduated in twenty nineteen.
So I continue to consult on that front.

689
00:46:40.039 --> 00:46:45.320
The nonprofit called Purpose on Fire was
started that helps people who have discovered

690
00:46:45.360 --> 00:46:50.320
their purpose unleash it. And then
here we Are twenty twenty was to be

691
00:46:50.400 --> 00:46:54.599
something else, but actually it helped
me tremendously because you know, a lot

692
00:46:54.639 --> 00:46:59.639
of the work that I was doing, which required eyeballs and physicality, stopped

693
00:47:00.280 --> 00:47:02.800
and so it gave me the space
to go inward and get that book finished.

694
00:47:02.840 --> 00:47:07.440
So Purpose ignited, how inspirational leader's
unleash passion in amic cause got done.

695
00:47:07.480 --> 00:47:12.719
Thank you pandemic COVID nineteen. It's
on Amazon now, it's coming out

696
00:47:12.800 --> 00:47:17.920
November seventeenth. And then the other
thing to other things happened. I also

697
00:47:19.000 --> 00:47:22.599
really got present to well, we
no longer need physicality to deliver our work

698
00:47:23.079 --> 00:47:29.199
and so I really wanted to find
a way to really put together in all

699
00:47:29.239 --> 00:47:31.360
one package everything that I had become
and express it. So, as you

700
00:47:31.440 --> 00:47:35.960
know, my language is important,
culture is important to me. Learning development

701
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:38.840
is still important. So as I
said at the beginning, we launched Gusto

702
00:47:39.000 --> 00:47:43.760
now, which is an e learning
platform, and that it has my courses

703
00:47:44.000 --> 00:47:46.199
on it in English, Spanish and
Portuguese, so I get to still work

704
00:47:46.199 --> 00:47:52.400
in those languages. Then there's also
the synthology that I'm curating, which is

705
00:47:52.440 --> 00:47:57.119
where I was asked to curate this
thing, and so I have and I

706
00:47:57.119 --> 00:48:00.559
have just a couple more people to
go, but I have created this anthology

707
00:48:00.599 --> 00:48:06.920
where twenty five women from around the
world are showcasing how they found their purpose

708
00:48:06.960 --> 00:48:08.679
and are persevering mindly to live it. And the whole idea is to help

709
00:48:08.679 --> 00:48:14.639
people recognize that purpose is available anywhere
to anyone, and it works and it

710
00:48:14.679 --> 00:48:16.440
makes a difference in the world.
We have more people actually doing it,

711
00:48:16.519 --> 00:48:24.679
so I get to I've chosen to
and am determined to my my highest potential

712
00:48:24.719 --> 00:48:29.679
to live my purpose to make a
difference that I hope makes an impact in

713
00:48:29.679 --> 00:48:35.800
the world. That's fantastic that I
think we're getting close to our time.

714
00:48:36.440 --> 00:48:39.199
That's an example of essence mining.
Obviously, with essence mining, you go

715
00:48:39.239 --> 00:48:43.440
through a couple of times and do
this, and each time you reflect back

716
00:48:43.480 --> 00:48:46.280
you uncover something a little bit more
pivotable. But I think people will get

717
00:48:46.280 --> 00:48:50.400
a good idea, and I think
you probably even got some insights into yourself

718
00:48:50.400 --> 00:48:57.480
on just even in a in the
brevity of this interview, Oops, there

719
00:48:58.039 --> 00:49:01.400
was the timer telling me that it
was time that worries. Even within the

720
00:49:01.400 --> 00:49:07.360
brevity of the interview, how we
were able to get into Elisa's meaning language

721
00:49:07.679 --> 00:49:12.960
and start to understand the patterns that
we're going on in Alisa's lives through that

722
00:49:13.039 --> 00:49:15.320
language, we sure did. It
was a great experience, and you help

723
00:49:15.360 --> 00:49:19.079
me really understand a lot of things, especially that thing about the importance of

724
00:49:19.119 --> 00:49:22.800
experience. That's a threat that I
hadn't was not aware of before, Danny.

725
00:49:22.880 --> 00:49:27.119
So I really appreciate your contribution to
me and to our listeners and our

726
00:49:27.199 --> 00:49:30.960
viewers. Thank you for sharing your
gift with us. Thank you you bet,

727
00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:35.840
thanks for having me on absolutely.
Listeners and viewers. If you want

728
00:49:35.880 --> 00:49:37.960
to learn more about Danny Gutenek,
his book Meaning at Work and It's Hidden

729
00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:43.239
language or the work they do at
Pathways. Visit them at Pathways dot io.

730
00:49:44.199 --> 00:49:45.119
Last week, if you missed the
live show, you can always catch

731
00:49:45.119 --> 00:49:49.079
it. We recorded podcast. We
were on the year with Norman Wolfe,

732
00:49:49.119 --> 00:49:52.960
the author of The Living Organization,
Transforming Business to create Extraordinary Results. We

733
00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:57.840
talked about how everything in life is
about energy, Everything is energy, and

734
00:49:57.880 --> 00:50:00.880
how results changed dramatically when an organization
is viewed by its leaders as a living

735
00:50:01.039 --> 00:50:06.280
organism which must constantly evolve. Next
week, we'll be on the air with

736
00:50:06.280 --> 00:50:10.039
Steve Brown, the author of The
Innovation Ultimatum, how six strategic technologies will

737
00:50:10.039 --> 00:50:14.639
reshape every business in the twenty twenties. See you there, Remember that works

738
00:50:14.679 --> 00:50:22.159
at least of their real life.
So let's work on Purpose. We hope

739
00:50:22.159 --> 00:50:25.719
you've enjoyed this week's program. Be
sure to tune in too. Working on

740
00:50:25.800 --> 00:50:31.400
Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise
Cortes each week on the Voice America Empowerment

741
00:50:31.480 --> 00:50:38.360
Channel. Together, we'll create a
world where business operates conscientiously, leadership inspires

742
00:50:38.360 --> 00:50:44.719
impassioned performance, and employees are fulfilled
in work that provides the meaning and purpose

743
00:50:44.840 --> 00:50:47.800
they crave. See you there,
Let's work on Purpose.