Building Your Extraordinary Life

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What's working on purpose anyway? Each
week we ponder the answer to this question.

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People ache for meaning and purpose at
work, to contribute their talents passionately

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and know their lives really matter.
They crave being part of an organization that

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inspires them and helps them grow into
realizing their highest potential. Business can be

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such a force for good in the
world, elevating humanity. In our program,

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we provide guidance and inspiration to help
usher in this world we all want

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Working on Purpose. Now Here is
your host, doctor Elise Cortez. Hi

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there, Welcome back to the Working
on Purpose Program. Thanks for tuning in

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again this week. I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes, joining you live

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from Dallas, Texas, which is
home base for me. By way of

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Internet action. I'm a management consultant
specializing in meaning and purpose, organizational logo

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therapists, inspirational speaker, social scientist, and author. You can learn more

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about me at Gusto dashnow dot com
or at least Cortes dot com. Before

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we get out of the program,
I have to thank my partner and my

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sponsor Work Proud. We are a
perfect collaboration. Everyone wants to know they

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matter and that the work they do
is meaningful and appreciated. Work Proud is

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a mobile platform built to encourage employees
to share stories and recognize each other's contribution.

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Work Proud empowers hr and business leaders
to help create company cultures where all

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employees are inspired to feel proud of
their work and proud of their company.

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You can check them out at work
proud dot com. Now under this week's

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program with us today is Robert White, who is a speaker, author,

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at leadership trainer, and executive coach
who specializes in integrating a heart centered,

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result oriented, and transformational leadership approach
to a being effective. We'll be talking

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about what he's learned by serving in
the personal growth and leadership transformation industry over

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a half a century and he joins
today from Wheatbridge, our Colorado. Robert,

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Welcome to Working on Purpose. Hello, Hello, it's great to be

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with you. Oh my goodness,
it's just wonderful to be literally talking with

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a living legend, Robert. Is
so great to have you on the show

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and share you with listeners across the
globe, many of whom you've touched with

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your programs, and so thank you
for being with us. It's a great

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pleasure and I'm looking forward to it. Well, we have to first get

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by start, get started by asking
the simple question of why. As far

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as I can tell by looking at
your background, you got into the personal

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growth and transformation industry. It looks
like nineteen seventy three, and so we

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got it. And you've been doing
this ever since, right, you got

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the bug and you never really really
left. And so first we have to

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know why this space. Well,
I got into the industry actually in nineteen

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seventy one, but in nineteen sixty
eight, I attended one of the early

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human potential movement trainings. And it's
a cliche all these years later, but

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it changed my life for the better, and that led to my enrolling a

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lot of people into that training.
They found out about me, I got

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hired as president of that company that
sponsored that original program to run the business

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of their business. So that's how
I got started. Okay, So now

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just now in this conversation, this
is one of the greatest things about hosting

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the show, Robert is every single
week I learned something new and amazing and

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I get amazing insights in myself.
So I just know mebe put something together

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and I'm wondering if you could speak
to this. I am a Meslow fan.

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I'm a positivist psychology kind of a
person, and I know his earlier

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realm would have been the sixties,
and I'm just wondering, you know this,

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there was clearly something in the water, if you will, at about

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that time when you got involved in
this personal growth and transformation sort of industry

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and space. What were all these
commingling factors in Was Maslow's work a part

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of that contribution? You know,
I didn't really know about anything except that

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original program, Mindynamics, But when
I joined the company and moved to California,

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the kind of the hotbed northern California
was the place where all the at

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that time fruits and nuts hang out. And you know, so I learned

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a lot about all of these other
programs that add and started around that time,

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about where they came from, about
the commonality, about the differences in

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the approach, and minded Namics was
probably the first one to do large group

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and successful worldwide kinds of programs.
It's really it's really phenomenal to me to

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really witness, bare witness, just
to really what you and your team have

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done over all these years it's just
phenomenal and and I want to This is

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really fun for me to showcase because
I am very rivetted on the role and

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function of the education space. And
of course you have something very cheeky on

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your LinkedIn profile and that you sort
of playfully declare that you are you to

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clear yourself a college dropout. So
at first I want to know why what

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did you study and why did you
drop out? What was that whole experience

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of being in college and dropping out
like for you, well, I mean

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good company as a dropout. Of
course, with those views and Steve Jobs

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and a bunch of others. Mine
was not directly by choice. I walked

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into a finals after my first semester
and walked down to the front road.

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I saw a seat in the front
row with this big amphitheater. So I

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walked down intending to get that front
seat, and in the meantime, quite

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attractive young lady walked in from the
side door and took the seat. I

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turned around, took one step up
and had a heart attack. It was

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the first of three. So I
got taken out of college, not because

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I didn't like it or you know, any of those normal reasons. I

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got taken out because I was pretty
ill. So that's how old were you?

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Nineteen? And I had another one
at twenty three, twenty one and

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twenty three, so it changed the
trajectory of my life quite a bit.

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Well, how so you can't just
dangle that and stomp there. How So

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what happened after having a heart attack
at nineteen and then another twenty one and

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twenty three. I have what's called
a right bundle branch block, a breakage

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in the nerve tissue on the surface
of my heart. And it's also one

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of the things that got into the
business because I had daily chest pain until

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I was twenty seven, and then
I went through this training. I learned

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how to relax and how to in
effect heal myself, and the chess pain

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stopped, and with the exception of
a divorce later in life, I haven't

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had any chess pain since then.
That's amazing. Wow, what a testament.

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Well, I guess because I have
been really profoundly curious to understand just

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how it is that you've been able
to stay riveted in this space for so

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long, so dedicated, and I
didn't know this part of your story at

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all, So thank you for sharing
that really important personal part of your past.

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And what doesn't that just speak to
the power of the work that you've

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been doing. You know, I
did not understand that training that I went

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through at twenty seven. I just
know that when I left it, things

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started to clear up in my life, just in the process of life itself.

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You know, when I went into
the training, I did have the

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daily chess pain. I had been
told I would die by thirty five,

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and there was nothing they could do
about it. I was failing. I

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had failed in marriage, an early
marriage, and I felt guilty about it.

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I had I was late in paying
payroll in my little company. My

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life was a mess. Of course, I walked in with the big image,

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you know, everything's okay, which
is kind of more of a male

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thing, I think than female,
but hiding all of my problems. A

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good friend knew of them, and
that's the end. He kind of leveraged

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me into that training. But you
know, the chetmain stopped. The income

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went up three times in one year
and ten times the following year. My

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relationships got better. So what's driven
me all of these years is I find

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a great pleasure in facilitating a space
for that to happen. For other people.

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You know, everybody comes into those
trainings in a different place, and

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some in more of a need,
and some of them just because it sounds

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like fun. But I don't care
why they're there. I know what's possible

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for them in a high impact experiential
learning event, and I get great,

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great, great pleasure when I know
I had something to do with that delivery

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result. I think it makes sense
for our listeners to hear a little bit

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about just your background. And you
do really quick, do a beautiful job

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in your book of sharing just how
it is that you got into that training,

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and I really did appreciate learning that
I don't think I read about They

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put the heart attack part in there. I did not catch that, But

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did you? Did you wait at
the arttack in a book? No.

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I really had been hiding it for
years, and people do ask me about

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my story, and I would just
tell them that I went to the training

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and I made more money and better
relationships. I think there's probably a very

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deep part in me that where there's
some shame or something or you know.

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I think for men, particularly,
our physical vitality is so important to us,

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and so to talk about a weakness
is difficult. Later in life,

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I had a couple of friends at
different times commit suicide, and I've learned

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a lot about the link between a
lack of physical vitality in men and suicide.

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I mean, I never got to
that point, but it's very important

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to us, so I've hidden it. And also I don't talk about healing

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when I talk about our training,
because then you know, you get all

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these psychologists and medical doctors come after
you. So but recently, in the

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last five years or so, I
don't have any secrets. I think it's

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so healthy, right. I had
Renee sermak On with me from PSI a

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couple of weeks ago, because I
had recently gone through the PSI training.

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Like you know, I probably like
you, I've spent a lot of my

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life going to these because I want
to become the most version of myself.

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And of course being able to tell
our secrets is very very important. I

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think it makes sense, Robert,
could you just quickly showcase for our listeners

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and reviewers just what you've done.
You've built several companies, and you've been

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in Japan and such. Can you
just showcase that force really quick to situate

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just really who you are I was
with mind and Emmings for four years.

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I learned a lot from the originator
of this kind of work, Alexander Everett.

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He was a mentor, he was
a friend. When he left the

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company when he has sold his shares, I ended up working for a probate

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judge that was not good, so
I left. I started a company called

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Lifespring, which and I later sold
it. It went on to reach over

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half a million people in seventeen US
cities. But when I sold it,

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I sold it for nothing down and
forever to pay to the team. And

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so now I've put all my money
in it. So I've got a wife

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and a child and a mortgage and
no money and no job. And years

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earlier I had been to Japan.
It was the only foreign country for mind

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and EMICs, where I said no, and they kept pursuing me through the

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about a three year period and they
changed offer. And it was literally the

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day after I left life Spring they
called and said, please come for ninety

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days to Tokyo and we'll pay you
for one year. And years later people

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say, well, did you go
to Japan because you had a vision of

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spreading this kind of work in Asia, And the answer really is. No.

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I needed a job and I wanted
that job to be in an area

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that I love doing, so that
part of the purpose thing was there.

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I went for ninety days. I
stayed twelve years the first time. And

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so our international was in seven cities
in Japan, two in Taiwan, one

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in Guangzho Mainland, China, one
in Sydney, one in Manila, a

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failure in Soul, Korea, so
we're all over Asia. We became Asia's

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largest training company. The two hundred
and forty professional staffs, seventy full time

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trainers and great fun. What an
imprint, right I always anybody's listened to

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me, even a couple of times, would recognize that. I always have

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this saying, and what will you
do with your one precious life? And

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you certainly have touched a lot of
other lives with your precious life, and

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I just really applaud that and making
that difference, as you say, you

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find a lot of fulfillment and knowing
you've been somewhere on the journey with them.

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Yes, And in the early days
I did the trainings because in a

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startup you do everything, but for
me leading trainings at that time was not

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personally fulfilling. What was fulfilling was
being in the back of the room,

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knowing that I trained that trainer,
knowing that I had something to do with

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putting those butts in seats, and
I just got tremendous pleasure from that.

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And only in the last six years
have I reconnected with the joy of actually

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doing the work in the room.
So uh, it's so, I've always

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received great personal rewards, great pleasure
from doing this work. I've been plenty

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of problems, you know. I
slept on a partner's sofa for eight months

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at the beginning of the company and
had no salary for the first two years,

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you know, I mean, we
had guest events where nobody came.

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You know, I've got all of
those failure stories also, and it happened.

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But overall it worked out well,
and you know, gave me a

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tremendous lifestyle in addition to doing work
that I felt was meaningful. What I

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appreciate about your sharing, Robert,
and listeners and viewers, please pay attention

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to this the real deal, right, there's no punches here. It wasn't

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all glamorous. It was hard.
I love the stories of sleeping on the

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couch and nobody's showing up kind of
thing. I mean, that's what it

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takes, right, if you're going
to go for something in life, that's

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what it takes. And there's no
way around it. So thank you for

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being real. You know that my
partnership was actually in our sales training business,

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and which was chewing up a lot
of cash and not bringing in very

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much at first. And my partner
had nine children, actually they had ten,

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and unfortunately lost one to leukemia.
But you know, there's something really

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special as a memory to waking up
on a sofa because you you sense the

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a a person standing next to the
sofa like four inches from your face when

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you wake up in the morning,
because he's eager to get on with life.

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You know what am I doing sleeping? So I have a lot of

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those kinds of stories. You know, my my wife and son had to

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return to the US and we had
to live separately for a year. That

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was hard, but at the same
time that provided a basis for everything that

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came after that, which was incredible. Now it's just a good memory.

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You're broke up there a little bit
here, but we think we've got most

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of the gifts that Robert Let's grab
our first break. I'm your host,

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Doctor Elise Cortez. Were on there
with Robert White. He is a speaker,

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author, leadership trainer, and executive
coach who specializes in integrating heart centered,

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result oriented and transformational leadership approach to
being effective. We've been talking a

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bit about how he got into the
personal transformation space. After the break,

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we're going to talk more about the
mechanics of it, why does it work

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so well, his particular approach.
Stay with us, We'll be right back.

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Doctor release Cortez is a management consultant
specializing in meaning and purpose and inspirational

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speaker and author. She helps companies
visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop

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purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures
that elevate fulfillment, performance, and commitment

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within the workforce. To learn more
or to invite a least to speak to

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your organization, please visit her at
Elise Cortez dot com. Let's talk about

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how to get your employees working on
purpose. This is working on purpose with

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doctor Relise Cortez. To reach our
program today or open a conversation with Elise,

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send an email to Elise ali Se
at Elise Cortez dot com. Now

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back to working on purpose. Thanks
for saying with us, and welcome back

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to working on Purpose. In response
to some inquiries that I've gotten from a

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few of you about helping companies care
for their employees. As the pediment continues

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and anxiety, stress, depression,
and feeling disconnectator on the rise in the

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workplace, we have launched a well
being webinar and learning series to nurture and

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build individuals from the inside out.
So if you're interested nor more about that,

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contact me at Elise Cortez or at
Elise Leise Corte dot com. I'll

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give you more details and give you
the chance to be able to learn how

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to customize that, etc. But
it's just it's just fresh into our program

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if you're just joining us. My
guest is Robert White. He is a

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speaker, author, leaders trainer,
and executive coach who specializes in integrating a

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heart centered, result oriented, and
transformational leadership approach to being effective. He

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joinses a day from wheat Ridge,
Colorado. I am your host to these

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cortes. So, Robert, one
of the things that's really terrific about about

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the work that you do, and
I know it too because I've been in

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enough trainings that I can distinguish this. But what you really specialize in is

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experiencial learning. So for listeners and
viewers that don't know what that means,

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if you could first distinguish, what
are other ways that learning is often taught,

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and how is experience your learning different? You know, a common metaphor

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that's used is writing a bicycle.
There's actually a book published by somebody here

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in Denver. I do not recommend
the book, but the title is great,

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which is you don't learn that from
a lecture. You've got to get

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on the bike, and there's probably
a coach there, there's probably you know,

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someone to help you. There's probably
some fear. You're taking a risk

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being on those two wheels instead of
two feet, and you might fall down,

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skin your knee and cry. But
you never forget how to ride a

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bicycle. If you don't ride a
bike for ten years, you can get

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on one and maybe you're a little
shaky at first, but you have had

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the experience. There is a muscle
memory, and you know, there's all

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kinds of brain science now about this
that that is something you know how to

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do. And so what we do
in our trendings are a series of very

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structured, safe but occasionally a feeling
of in your to desire in how you

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want to show up in the world. And there are a lot of examples

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that maybe take a little too long
to talk about. But the reason that

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a million and three hundred thousand people
have been through the two companies that i've

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and lead is because the experience is
so vivid and so long lasting in terms

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of shifting your perception on your life, what it's about, and where you

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want it to go. All of
our programs are structured around three things,

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pretty simple things but not easy,
and profoundly useful. The first is to

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complete your past. Many of us
have some negative energy on some aspect of

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our past. It might be blame, a shame and regret. It might

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be success that was appropriate five years
ago or ten years ago but no longer

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works for you. It might be
unfortunately abuse, It might be too much

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praise. I mean, all kinds
of things that we carry with us as

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a burden. So shifting that energy
from negative to positive has incredible freeing effect

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on a human being. So that's
one third of our program is learning how

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to better tell the truth about current
reality. Human beings, especially in the

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developed world, develop this unmatched ability
to pardon the term bullshit, ourselves,

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to not be able to describe what's
right in front of us, and that

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other people can see, but we
don't see it. The you know.

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The the two Buddhist statements in that
area are that, first of all,

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fish don't describe water very well.
Whatever, you know, whatever we're swimming

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in, we don't see it.
And you know, there's a video on

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YouTube. And actually I think if
you just if you google girl with nail

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in the forehead, I've seen that. Yeah, you know, she's got

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a nail in her forehead and she
didn't total denial about it, right,

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And the Buddhists also say that a
different way of languaging it is to develop

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up a selfless regard for reality.
Usually our image, our need to be

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right, our need to feel kind
of interimally good about ourselves, gets in

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the way of our ability to tell
the truth about ourselves, about other people,

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about the events in our life.
So if you get better at that,

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your life will clear up just in
the process of telling the truth.

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And then finally, if you've done
the first two steps, if you've cleared

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your past completed it somewhat. If
you've gotten better at receiving feedback about what's

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really going on in your life,
then you have created a space where you

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can actually choose your future. And
for many people, your future has not

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been chosen. It has been a
product of what your parents wanted for you,

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or what the culture says is a
good thing for you, a product

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of a limiting belief perhaps that you
have about not being enough. There's a

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lot of things that prevent us from
actually being at choice about our future.

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And yet if we if we just
go to the library and read a bunch

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of books on people that have accomplished
a lot, a commonality and many many

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of them is they were really,
really clear about their future. They chose

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it free of their past and paying
attention to rigorously, paying attention to telling

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the truth about current reality. So
those are the three kind of structural aspects

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that all of our programs and my
executive coaching. Okay, so I heard

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what you sort of cut out there
again. So what I heard you say

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is those three aspects are all in
all of your training programs and your executive

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coaching is a right correct? Okay, great, all right, So what

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I want to do next. And
this was, as you know, I

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read your book, I read my
guest book cover to cover, and one

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of the things that you say in
your book that I think really speaks to

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the visceral nature of what I think
you were starting to queue up there for

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us. I'm going to quote it
from your book, is you say,

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quote there can be no transformation,
no awakening, no personal growth without the

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here and now experience of life,
which involves every part of us our bodies,

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minds, feelings, and spirit,
not just our intellect. So you're

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already saying that this notion of experiential
But what I hear, though, that's

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much bigger. It's a bigger statement, that's more encompassing, saying more about

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why that's so powerful and so important
to really commingle all those pieces of us.

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You know, a four day or
two four day experiences are even you

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know, six months of executive coaching
are no substitute for simply noticing what's going

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on in your body, in your
mind, and your feelings in your spirit.

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That developing a greater awareness, a
greater sense of no sing, makes

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you the trainer, makes you the
educator for the unique person that you are.

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You know, there's not another person
like you out of seven billion plus,

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and so who's the best expert on
you? It is, in fact

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you. It's not me, it's
not a teacher, it's not a guru.

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So if you can start to really
notice, you know, let's start

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with body sensations. Generally the people
in the East are better and Asia are

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better at this than we in the
West are. But what is it that

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causes that little tightening around the eyes
or that slight feeling of nauseous nausea when

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you're in a certain situation, what's
the real message when you're doing a little

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five minute probably talk, what is
it that causes you to be nervous and

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a disabling way? You know,
all of those things are signals from our

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body that they're something out of alignment
within us, and that exploring that is

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where the growth is. So body, mind and spirit is not just some

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kind of a slogan or a bumper
sticker. It is in fact an area

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for greater awareness. One of the
things that I've learned doing this work is

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the value of anything that triggers you
emotionally. So what is it that causes

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you to just experience incredible joy there's
a message in that for you. What

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is it that creates sadness? You
know, I had an incredible growth experience

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of all places, on a seven
forty seven in first class, you know,

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they serve the class of Champagne and
the worm Nuts. And I had

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just bought a new CD player.
I put a friend had sent this CD

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to me from Mary Chapin Carpenter,
the great storyteller, incredible writer, author

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and songwriter and singer. And the
song's called Jubilee, And I'm listening to

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the song and suddenly I realized that
tears are running cheeks. What happened there

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is that that her poetry unlocked a
place in me that I had not been

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paying attention to and led to some
reading, some conversations with people. That

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was a big personal growth breakthrough for
me. You know, at that time,

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I'm supposed to be the big deal
that has it all together. But

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that big deal was sitting on the
airplane crying in front of a lot of

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people. Because but anything that triggers
you're a strong emotion, sadness, anger,

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fear, joy, kind of the
four big ones, and anything that

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triggers those kinds of feeling creates an
opening for you to discover something about you

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and what's next for you in terms
of learning and growth and development. I

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so appreciate your saying this the way
that you are, Robert, because one

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of the things that I do in
my work with inside companies and with leaders

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is to help them develop greater access
once again, to their emotional spectrum.

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Because what I find is that so
many people have so narrowed it down to

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just a small little window because they
shut themselves off from the world that they

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don't have access to their emotions anymore. So part of our work is to

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get them reacquainted with those beautiful sentient
beings of ourselves. So that was gorgeous.

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I want to grab this real grup
before we go into our next break

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here too. I really love what
you have in your book about the ARC

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siminar model, and I think that
would be very useful for our listeners,

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in our viewers. It's for awareness, responsibility, and communication. So I

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guess I really want to understand this. Those are three very specific things.

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Why do you think why have you
come to believe that those are so important

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for effectiveness? It's partially because it's
what's missing for many of us, which

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is that awareness. I've talked about
it, you know, the greater state

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of noticing that we were not like
the hamster on the wheel, that today

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is just like yesterday and tomorrow is
going to be the same, but that

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we wake up to our body,
to our feelings, to our thinking,

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to the people around us, to
the signals that we're getting all of the

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time. We get out of the
drift, out of the kind of numbness

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that this crazy life we've created tends
to create. So as a tool,

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greater awareness has been taught for thousands
of years, you know, Lautsu and

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Confucius and Jesus Christ, and the
list goes on and on. All the

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great teachers taught that slow down,
take a deep breath, notice, and

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then taking personal responsibility. We live
in an overwhelmingly victim culture, so having

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reasons, stories and excuses for that
which is not working in our life is

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an absolute barrier to accomplishment. And
then finally, everything in life shows up

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as communication. We are social creatures, and our ability to hear, our

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ability to speak, our ability to
write, our ability to engage others through

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communication is a crucial life tool.
So those three things are again foundational aspects

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of the work that I've done,
and as you notice, it's how the

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book is organized talking about our participants
and how they interact with those three qualities

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when they come into our training.
One of the most common complaints I have

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about my book is people come and
say that I thought it would be about

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you, about Robert, that's about
me, and for most people it's a

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secret. So well, that's why
they get they have to come and listen

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to this part of your world where
the book is really about teaching your techniques

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and your methodology and such. And
here in these kinds of conversations we get

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to be part of your very personal, private world. So thank you for

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that. I wasn't at all disappointed. I got exactly what I wanted from

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your book. So happy to share
that. Let's grab our last break.

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I'm a Least Cortez, your host. We're in the Heir with Robert White,

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who was a speaker, author,
leadership trainer, and executive coach who

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specializes in integrating a heart center and
result oriented and transformational leadership approach to being

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effective. We've been talking a bit
about really getting under the covers of why

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his training works so well after the
Wreaker and to talk more about why people

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resist this kind of training and what's
in it for them when they don't stay

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00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:44.799
with us. We'll be right back. Doctor Release Cortez is a management consultant

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00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:51.000
specializing in meaning and purpose and inspirational
speaker and author. She helps companies visioneer

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00:31:51.119 --> 00:31:56.839
for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop
purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that

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00:31:57.000 --> 00:32:02.880
elevate fulfillment, performance, and commitment
within the workforce. To learn more or

399
00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:07.519
to invite a lease to speak to
your organization, please visit her at a

400
00:32:07.599 --> 00:32:12.119
lease Cortez dot com. Let's talk
about how to get your employees working on

401
00:32:12.160 --> 00:32:22.599
purpose. This is working on Purpose
with doctor Elise Cortez. To reach our

402
00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:29.319
program today or open a conversation with
Elise, send an email to Elise ali

403
00:32:29.519 --> 00:32:40.920
Se at Elise Cortez dot com.
Now back to working on purpose. Thanks

404
00:32:40.960 --> 00:32:44.640
for staying with us, and welcome
back to working on purpose. I have

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00:32:44.720 --> 00:32:46.440
to tell you a fun sort of
Sharon story. If you don't know it's

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already, but during the pandemic yours
truly me. I had a baby.

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Yeah, it's not quite the traditional
kind. It's actually like a little four

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It's got pages in it. So
it's a book. It's called Purpose Ignited.

409
00:32:59.400 --> 00:33:01.960
It's I'm sorry, I couldn't resist, right. I know you're like,

410
00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:06.880
what are you sure? But what
was so great about it is the

411
00:33:06.880 --> 00:33:09.000
pandemic gave me that time. It
gave me the space to be able to

412
00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:12.640
have that stillness that we were talking
about in the last segment. And I

413
00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:15.880
really wrote it to awaken readers to
their passion and their purpose and help transform

414
00:33:15.960 --> 00:33:20.839
them into inspirational leaders who enlive in
the workplace and and elevate the contribution of

415
00:33:20.839 --> 00:33:22.559
the business to the stakeholders. That's
why I wrote it. It was an

416
00:33:22.559 --> 00:33:25.440
awakening book. So I loved it. And the next one that I'm working

417
00:33:25.480 --> 00:33:28.839
on is about activating. But anyway, so that was great. Gobs of

418
00:33:28.839 --> 00:33:31.720
fun with us today, of course
is Robert White. He is coming in

419
00:33:31.759 --> 00:33:37.920
from Colorado. His book is is
it called The Transformational The Extraordinary Life.

420
00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:40.680
I read it cover to cover in
preparation for this conversation. I recommend it.

421
00:33:40.799 --> 00:33:44.160
For this next segment. We want
to get into just what it is

422
00:33:44.200 --> 00:33:46.359
that makes people resist this kind of
thing. Why is this such hard work?

423
00:33:47.079 --> 00:33:50.839
So before we get into that,
Robert, what I want to see

424
00:33:50.880 --> 00:33:53.880
if we can presence at all on
some level is if you have any sense

425
00:33:53.920 --> 00:34:00.359
of what percentage of the global population
that's alive today that has taken any stal

426
00:34:00.400 --> 00:34:02.400
growth or transformation training, do you
have any idea what that looks like?

427
00:34:02.440 --> 00:34:07.759
What percentage of that is the population
is I know the goal. I know

428
00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:12.800
a little bit of the social science
for transforming the planet, so I know

429
00:34:12.880 --> 00:34:16.079
the goal. I don't know the
result. Frankly, I can you know,

430
00:34:16.159 --> 00:34:20.639
like those two companies that I found
it and lad to have a million,

431
00:34:20.679 --> 00:34:28.360
three hundred thousand graduates. The Landmark
s slash Landmark organization I understand is

432
00:34:28.400 --> 00:34:35.440
now more than seven million graduates around
the world. There are people like Tony

433
00:34:35.519 --> 00:34:42.199
Robbins that while he doesn't do deep
transformational work, he does very good reframing

434
00:34:42.239 --> 00:34:45.840
and very good motivational work. And
I don't know a number of participants,

435
00:34:45.840 --> 00:34:53.159
but it's huge. I mean,
he really does reach large numbers. And

436
00:34:53.280 --> 00:34:57.920
I think people have a company.
I think this kind of very rough,

437
00:34:58.599 --> 00:35:06.119
totally not provable piece of knowledge is
useful, and that is that for a

438
00:35:06.199 --> 00:35:08.360
system to shift, and you know
we did. I've done a lot of

439
00:35:08.360 --> 00:35:19.639
work on corporate culture change and the
number and it's twenty percent of the people

440
00:35:19.800 --> 00:35:22.039
shift, then the company will shift. You don't have to worry about the

441
00:35:22.079 --> 00:35:27.440
eighty percent. Twenty percent will get
them the people that were open to the

442
00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:30.920
change and really adopt it. If
that number reaches twenty percent of any population,

443
00:35:32.039 --> 00:35:37.280
you know, that would mean that
in the case of of the world,

444
00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:42.679
you know, you'd have to have
one point four billion people wake up

445
00:35:42.719 --> 00:35:47.639
and start really living from a one
world, one people perspective. We're a

446
00:35:47.639 --> 00:35:52.960
long way from that. I do
think you can look at certain companies.

447
00:35:53.199 --> 00:35:59.760
That's actually where it's showing up most
clearly for me is companies that really live

448
00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:08.679
an enlightened informed as with servant leaders
and a public spirited culture. Yes,

449
00:36:09.079 --> 00:36:15.480
I think we can find some examples. I wouldn't you know, there's is

450
00:36:15.519 --> 00:36:24.440
it? It's not Meamar. One
of the small Southeastern Asian companies has a

451
00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:30.480
They don't measure gross national product they
grow, they measure gross national happiness.

452
00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:35.239
It's Budton. Yeah, it's right. Yeah, I was supposed to do

453
00:36:35.280 --> 00:36:37.679
a race there last year. I
know it well, I looked into it,

454
00:36:37.920 --> 00:36:39.639
but of course the pandemic installed that
for us. But yes, and

455
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:43.800
that isn't that amazing? And Okay, so this is really exciting, Robert,

456
00:36:43.800 --> 00:36:45.239
twenty If we can get to twenty
percent, then we have a chance

457
00:36:45.280 --> 00:36:49.400
to really start to move the tide. And by the way, Robert,

458
00:36:49.480 --> 00:36:52.960
this is exactly why I work with
companies and not just individuals, because I

459
00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:57.920
am looking for that bigger mass too, to be able to raise that consciousness,

460
00:36:58.079 --> 00:37:00.519
raise that awareness, to be able
to start to really push that tide.

461
00:37:00.559 --> 00:37:04.320
So this is really exciting to me
to be and talking about this with

462
00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:08.360
you, and I do sense that
there is more people awakening, there's more

463
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:14.480
talk about purpose and meaning and consciousness. I just I feel at my bones

464
00:37:14.519 --> 00:37:16.239
that there's a like it. It's
like the rocket that's on you know,

465
00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:20.320
on the floor and a soil,
and it's rumbling and rumbling, it's trying

466
00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:22.119
to take off. It's trying to
take off, and it's it's there.

467
00:37:22.159 --> 00:37:25.800
It's so I'm determined that in my
lifetime that we're going to get to that

468
00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:35.079
twenty percent. You're freezing again,
So I'm going to take oh, go

469
00:37:35.119 --> 00:37:39.639
ahead, you prefer to think what
And I'm missing a lot and I'm missing

470
00:37:39.639 --> 00:37:45.159
a lot of your question. Also, so technology is not cooperating with us

471
00:37:45.199 --> 00:37:49.599
to that's okay. We're determined we're
going to carry on all right. So

472
00:37:49.719 --> 00:37:52.039
now we're carrying on absolutely right.
You know, this is how it goes

473
00:37:52.079 --> 00:37:54.800
in life, especially in the pandemic
has taught us all kinds of things.

474
00:37:55.599 --> 00:37:59.239
Okay, so now what we have
to get to And I would love your

475
00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:02.280
perspective on this, Robert, why
are people so resistant? Now? Before

476
00:38:02.280 --> 00:38:07.840
you answer that question, I'm very
I personally have gone through a lot of

477
00:38:07.880 --> 00:38:09.360
training, a lot of work,
and I'm constantly studying in my life.

478
00:38:09.360 --> 00:38:14.079
I wish you could see my beautiful
bookshelf from here. I'm very hungry for

479
00:38:14.119 --> 00:38:16.039
growth and development, but I also
know it's a lot of work. And

480
00:38:16.079 --> 00:38:19.639
so sometimes when I'm working with people
and I think, why wouldn't you want

481
00:38:19.679 --> 00:38:22.480
to do this? This is so
amazing. I also recognize this is a

482
00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:25.400
lot of work. But what's your
perspective, Robert? Why don't people embrace

483
00:38:25.519 --> 00:38:30.039
this idea of personal growth and transformation? Why do they resist? You know,

484
00:38:30.840 --> 00:38:37.440
there's a very long and involved answer
that really has to do with spirit,

485
00:38:38.199 --> 00:38:43.639
and it's more spiritual in terms of
the form. I'd like to use

486
00:38:44.280 --> 00:38:46.880
maybe more practical kind of approach to
your question, which is a really good

487
00:38:46.880 --> 00:38:52.159
one. One. I've grappled with
myself and with others for years, and

488
00:38:52.639 --> 00:38:58.760
so we teach in our work that
we are just an expression of a whole

489
00:38:58.760 --> 00:39:02.280
lot of beliefs. We have beliefs
about money, beliefs about family, beliefs

490
00:39:02.280 --> 00:39:06.840
about the way things should be,
the beliefs about politics. You know,

491
00:39:06.880 --> 00:39:13.119
we got a zillion beliefs, and
beliefs are useful in terms of our operating

492
00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:15.639
on a daily basis. We don't
have to think a lot about a lot

493
00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:20.239
of things. You know. An
exercise that I often do in trainings is

494
00:39:20.840 --> 00:39:27.000
to have people imagine being in a
supermarket. They see a harried mom with

495
00:39:27.079 --> 00:39:32.400
a three year old who's acting up, and he's grabbing things off the shelf

496
00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:36.880
and making a mess, and then
he throws himself on She tries to quiet

497
00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:39.159
him, he throws himself on the
floor and does this little rage attack,

498
00:39:39.440 --> 00:39:45.079
attack, and you witness it.
How do you react? You don't have

499
00:39:45.119 --> 00:39:50.000
to think about it your reaction.
And when you do this with three hundred

500
00:39:50.000 --> 00:39:54.000
people, it's incredible to hear the
variety of reaction to the same event.

501
00:39:54.760 --> 00:39:59.840
And that's because we all have a
different belief. Because the woman reaches down,

502
00:40:00.039 --> 00:40:02.280
she's had it. She reaches down, grabs them by the arm,

503
00:40:02.360 --> 00:40:07.320
picks him up and slaps them on
the butt. What's your reaction, Well,

504
00:40:07.480 --> 00:40:16.000
there's a cohort that says you never
hit it, you know, as

505
00:40:16.039 --> 00:40:19.800
a court that says, well,
I'll pick up the stuff on the floor

506
00:40:19.840 --> 00:40:22.440
for the mom. I won't say
anything. You know, all these reactions

507
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:30.480
to one event. So whatever our
belief is about ourselves is important in terms

508
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:34.119
of your question, because it will
either you're either the kind of person that

509
00:40:34.199 --> 00:40:37.960
tries new things and it's constantly searching
and looking, or you're somebody to said

510
00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:40.880
I've got it all together, and
I was like that at twenty seven,

511
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:47.440
I've got it together. I hadn't
met payroll. I'm feeling guilty. You

512
00:40:47.480 --> 00:40:52.119
know, I've got daily chest pain, but I've got it all together.

513
00:40:52.719 --> 00:41:02.800
So what stops us is being right
about some set of beliefs that stops are

514
00:41:02.880 --> 00:41:07.800
kind of clean up some language.
But it was called asshole theater. So

515
00:41:07.920 --> 00:41:15.400
we asked these executives to do this
little play where they would play there the

516
00:41:15.440 --> 00:41:25.639
opposite gender, you know, so
dynamite exercise Dynamite exercised, but we renamed

517
00:41:25.679 --> 00:41:31.880
it. But it was to get
people out of that shell. Of who

518
00:41:31.920 --> 00:41:37.199
they say that they are. And
I'm one of those people. You know.

519
00:41:37.360 --> 00:41:42.199
The joke in my family elsis that
Robert was born in a three piece

520
00:41:42.280 --> 00:41:47.199
suit. That's how they say it. My brothers and sister, you know,

521
00:41:47.719 --> 00:41:53.239
That's how they experienced me growing up
because I was always starting a business.

522
00:41:53.280 --> 00:42:00.760
I was always dressed formally, not
informally, and I was a prisoner

523
00:42:00.880 --> 00:42:07.199
of this need to always appear together, you know, so a prisoner of

524
00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:13.280
my own image. And that image
piece, in my experience, is what

525
00:42:13.480 --> 00:42:21.840
stops particularly executives from stepping into some
experience that would make them more human,

526
00:42:21.920 --> 00:42:27.360
more vulnerable. You know Brene Brown's
YouTube videos, a lot of them are

527
00:42:27.400 --> 00:42:34.039
about vulnerability and yet yet what and
they're brilliant. I think I wish I

528
00:42:34.119 --> 00:42:37.800
was that good on a video.
You know, she's I mean, she's

529
00:42:37.800 --> 00:42:43.480
so good at being very vulnerable herself. Yes, yes, And I'm also

530
00:42:43.559 --> 00:42:45.480
funny, you know, she's you
know, she's one of those people you

531
00:42:45.480 --> 00:42:50.239
don't roar and laughter, but you'd
find yourself chuckling through the whole thing.

532
00:42:50.400 --> 00:42:55.320
Right. But it's all about being
vulnerable, and yet most executives, I

533
00:42:55.320 --> 00:43:01.960
don't know if it's most, but
many executives have adapted adopted kind of an

534
00:43:02.039 --> 00:43:06.519
armor so that you don't know how
they feel, You don't know how they

535
00:43:06.559 --> 00:43:10.800
think, you don't know about their
life as human beings. A big bary

536
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:16.280
and of culture, one where people
are more real, where there's more truth

537
00:43:16.360 --> 00:43:23.039
told. So what stops us as
our image as a as a bumper sticker

538
00:43:23.199 --> 00:43:30.880
catchphrase. It's deeper than that,
but that's the which usually shows up.

539
00:43:31.599 --> 00:43:34.719
All right, there was a bit
of delay there, but we got the

540
00:43:34.760 --> 00:43:37.039
idea about the image really getting in
our way here. So we're getting very

541
00:43:37.039 --> 00:43:39.400
close to the end of this time
already here. And I wanted to be

542
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:44.519
sure and have you speak a little
bit Robert that I know that today in

543
00:43:44.559 --> 00:43:47.239
your executive coaching you're focused on the
years of purpose, vision and values.

544
00:43:49.159 --> 00:43:51.639
So just briefly, what does that
work look like? Why is that so

545
00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:58.760
important? Well, I think there's
no one really successful in any area of

546
00:43:58.800 --> 00:44:04.320
life that doesn't have a coach,
somebody to be an accountability partner, somebody

547
00:44:04.360 --> 00:44:09.760
to be to ask the right questions, somebody to Sometimes it's being a cheerleader.

548
00:44:09.800 --> 00:44:14.760
Sometimes it's being a mirror, holding
up that mirror to behavior that doesn't

549
00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:19.159
work. So, uh, you
know. I mean, I've spent most

550
00:44:19.159 --> 00:44:24.639
of my life either enrolling people into
a high impact experience or conducting one myself.

551
00:44:25.480 --> 00:44:29.840
Because of the virus, that's just
not possible right now. But I

552
00:44:29.880 --> 00:44:37.800
have discovered that using Zoom or stream
Yard or something technology is that I can

553
00:44:37.880 --> 00:44:42.159
be that accountability partner. I can
bring my life experience and what I've learned

554
00:44:42.159 --> 00:44:47.679
about transformational leadership to bear by getting
together with people on a regular basis,

555
00:44:49.079 --> 00:44:53.960
being the mirror, being the cheerleader, being showing them a structure that interrupts

556
00:44:54.679 --> 00:45:00.719
attitudes, habits, and behaviors.
I think anybody that that wants to say

557
00:45:00.800 --> 00:45:06.639
that they're working to support accomplishment,
it comes from and it's another one of

558
00:45:06.639 --> 00:45:10.760
those threes. You know, everything
is a three, But it's if I'm

559
00:45:10.800 --> 00:45:16.800
not helping people shift their attitude,
their habits, and their behaviors, then

560
00:45:16.840 --> 00:45:21.199
there aren't going to be a re
resultants. And if there aren't any results

561
00:45:21.480 --> 00:45:25.760
will fall back to the old way
of being, and they've spent some time

562
00:45:25.800 --> 00:45:31.880
and money with me, that is
it's not worth it. So that's my

563
00:45:31.960 --> 00:45:37.920
focus. What can I do to
be an accountability partner? What can I

564
00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:44.760
do to be a mirror? Can
I do to get you to look at

565
00:45:45.440 --> 00:45:47.880
areas of your life that perhaps you
have not been willing to look at,

566
00:45:47.960 --> 00:45:52.679
or just we're not aware that you
need to look at it. So that

567
00:45:52.159 --> 00:46:00.800
because what creates lasting change is results
whatever. Those results can be anything you

568
00:46:00.800 --> 00:46:06.480
identify. But if you don't get
results, you you'll slide back to the

569
00:46:06.480 --> 00:46:10.639
old you. That's my life experience
with myself and in working with other people.

570
00:46:13.079 --> 00:46:15.079
Well, and I wanted to ask
you that just quickly, if we

571
00:46:15.159 --> 00:46:19.039
can. How have you evolved in
doing this work for a half of a

572
00:46:19.119 --> 00:46:22.320
century, Robert, How would you
say that you involved doing this work?

573
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:27.280
When I first started, I led
the trainings because then a startup, that's

574
00:46:27.320 --> 00:46:31.800
what you do. But I never
enjoyed it. As quickly as possible,

575
00:46:32.079 --> 00:46:37.519
I started hiring and training trainers.
So at its zenith with my company we

576
00:46:37.559 --> 00:46:42.760
had seventy full time trainers. I
would say that one third of them were

577
00:46:43.079 --> 00:46:46.000
miles better than me. You know, they do it all the time,

578
00:46:46.039 --> 00:46:50.039
they're thrown to do it, they
love it. They really have worked on

579
00:46:50.119 --> 00:46:54.719
their skills and their consciousness. One
third are learning. We're doing you know,

580
00:46:55.400 --> 00:47:01.079
in terms of hierarchy, the bottom
third are learning and they're conducting the

581
00:47:01.119 --> 00:47:04.840
trainings, but they're still getting a
lot of feedback, a lot of growth

582
00:47:04.840 --> 00:47:09.440
themselves. At the middle third are
workman like and or work woman like.

583
00:47:09.760 --> 00:47:15.519
And I was in that one third
in the middle, but I understood enough

584
00:47:15.559 --> 00:47:19.400
about our work, so I was
pretty good at training trainers. And that's

585
00:47:19.400 --> 00:47:22.960
a setting I was familiar with,
and I was happy to do it.

586
00:47:23.920 --> 00:47:29.679
Seven years ago, I hadn't done
one of our trainings for over twenty years.

587
00:47:29.920 --> 00:47:32.199
I mean, other people did the
training. I ran the company,

588
00:47:32.360 --> 00:47:37.960
and one of our trainers got blacklisted
from going to of all places, Kazakhstan,

589
00:47:38.760 --> 00:47:44.239
and at the last minute I covered
for him. And what I learned

590
00:47:44.360 --> 00:47:50.400
in terms of your question, in
our business, everything for the trainer is

591
00:47:50.400 --> 00:47:54.639
measured in terms of upgrade. If
people go through this basic training, how

592
00:47:54.639 --> 00:48:00.719
many of them enroll in the advanced
training and how many go on and go

593
00:48:00.800 --> 00:48:06.360
deeper. And we had seventeen years
of numbers and that numbers fifty three percent.

594
00:48:07.039 --> 00:48:08.719
So about half of the people that
go to the first train and go

595
00:48:08.760 --> 00:48:15.599
to the second ver sorry, ten
seconds, we're running on a time ten

596
00:48:15.639 --> 00:48:21.000
seconds, Okay, I got ninety
percent. And what I realized is I

597
00:48:21.079 --> 00:48:28.360
had grown. I was being the
training not dooming it, and so that's

598
00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:32.599
some thing I tried sure and I
continue to work on. Oh my gosh,

599
00:48:32.679 --> 00:48:36.519
Robert, that is a smashing way
to finish our conversation. Thank you

600
00:48:36.559 --> 00:48:37.639
so much. I am so glad
I got the chance to meet you and

601
00:48:37.679 --> 00:48:39.480
be in your world, and I
am going to come visit you. So

602
00:48:39.639 --> 00:48:43.639
look out and I'm an excellent leader. So make sure that the portions are

603
00:48:43.719 --> 00:48:45.800
large. Listeners and viewers, we
want to learn more about Robert. The

604
00:48:45.840 --> 00:48:49.960
best way to go about that is
to go to his website. It's extraordinary

605
00:48:50.039 --> 00:48:52.079
people dot com. Robert, thank
you so much for being with us and

606
00:48:52.119 --> 00:48:55.239
being being a guest. I'm working
on Purpose. Listeners and viewers will see

607
00:48:55.239 --> 00:49:04.679
you next week. We hope you've
enjoyed this week's program. Be sure to

608
00:49:04.719 --> 00:49:08.400
tune into Working on Purpose, featuring
your host, doctor Elise Cortez, each

609
00:49:08.480 --> 00:49:14.599
week on the Voice America Empowerment Channel. Together, we'll create a world where

610
00:49:14.679 --> 00:49:22.159
business operates conscientiously, leadership inspires impassioned
performance, and employees are fulfilled in work

611
00:49:22.239 --> 00:49:27.199
that provides the meaning and purpose.
They crave see you there. Let's work

612
00:49:27.280 --> 00:49:27.920
on Purpose.