Gen Z Isn’t the Problem—They’re the Upgrade Leadership Needs

0:00 The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services, or products mentioned on air or on our web. No liability explicitor implies shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing W FOURCY Radio. What's working on Purpose? Anyway? Each week we ponder the answer to this question. People ache for meaning and purpose at work, to contribute their talents passionately and know their lives really matter. They crave being part of an organization that inspires them and helps them grow into realizing their highest potential. Business can be such a force for good in the world, elevating humanity. In our program, we provide guidance and inspiration to help usher in this world we all want working on Purpose. Now here's your host, doctor Elise Cortez.

1:05 Welcome back to the Working and Purpose Program, which has been brought to you with passionate and pride since February of twenty fifteen. Thanks for tuning in this week. Great to have you. I am your host, doctor Realis Cortes. If we've not met before and you don't know me, I'm a workforce advisor, organizational psychologist, management consultant, local therapists, speaker and author. My team and I Augusta now help companies to enliven and fortify their operations by building a dynamic, high performance culture, inspirational leadership, and nurturing managers activated by meaning and purpose. Many organizations are not aware of how critical it is to invest in developing their leaders and managers not just for their own effectiveness, but also to avoid burnout and keep them fulfilled, and so that they can measure and monitor the purpose experience in the organization to keep it working. As an operational imperative. All those things are available, And did you know that inspired employees outperform their satisfied peers by a factor of two point twenty five to one. In other words, inspiration is good for the bottom line. You can learn Morebrous on how we can work together at Gusto Dashnau dot com or my personal site, Atliscortes dot com. Getting in today's program we have with us doctor Tim Elmore. He's the founder of Growing Leaders in Atlanta based nonprofit organization Cruited to develop emerging leaders. His work were out of twenty years serving alongside doctor John Maxwell. He has written more than thirty eight books, which include Habitudes, Images that form leadership, habits and attitudes. Also a new kind of diversity, making the different generations on your team a competitive advantage, and

2:35 the one we're talking about today, The future begins with Z. Nine strategies to lead Generation Z as they disrupt the workplace. We'll be talking about who Gen Z is, what contributed to forming them, and how they contribute to the workplace, and finishing by discussing a few of Tim's strategies to lead them. He joined today from Atlanta, Doctor Elmore, A hearty welcome to working on Purpose. Thank you, Elise, It's an honor to be with you. Likewise, sir, I don't know how I'm where this is in the mix, if this is like thirty seven or six or whatever, but I really really really enjoyed this, my friend. I really learned a lot. You taught me so much about this generation that I did not know.

3:16 I'm excited to share this with our listeners and viewers. I have my own gen zer, my one daughter, she's twenty two, and even just learned about you know, kind of her and such and could really relate to what you taught me. So excited to dig in? Shall we? Yeah, let's do. Let's do. Okay, Well, first we've got to start by celebrating your amazing life and career. I mean, first, come on twenty years with John Maxwell, and then you know your own background of developing leaders, and you've been of course focused on helping to develop the understanding generations. So let's just hear a little bit about like a sort of a smattering tour of that amazing life and career. Sure. Yeah, well I did start working under John Maxwell out of college, so I'm a very very lucky Smorry.

4:03 I mean, how wanted to tear out who was fortune? Yeah? Well, I always tell people if I don't do a good job today, it's my own fault because I had the great serious So worked for John for twenty years. But all the while John was teaching business leaders, faith based leaders, nonprofit leaders, I kept thinking, we got to get this to the next generation. What if we could learn it at eighteen, not thirty eight before we messed up a company and a marriage and everything else, you know. So I was always focused even those years under John it how could we get this to a young person. And when I say young person, maybe not five years old, but somewhere between teenagers and twenty somethings where they're really making big decisions about their life and their career and their and their and their marriage. So that's what Growing Leaders was. I started in two thousand and three. It's a nonprofit organization that partners with schools and youth organizations around the world, and we have been working with them to alongside reading, writing, arithmetic, which they're already getting at school, really building life skills and leadership skills in that next gen.

5:10 So this book was really written to that leader, business leader, teacher, coach who may be getting a little frustrated with that young person that just showIn the team because they're so different. And I'm trying to build a bridge between the young and the old so that we can really do the handoff we need to do well. I really sorely needed Tim, and you know, I'm out to help champion you know, destination workplaces, create places cultures of gusto inspirational leaders. And to your point, I hear many leaders who are frustrated and don't know how to handle and manage and lead this incoming generation. Which is why I was thrilled to have you come on. And I was not super surprised to learn in your book that for the average gen Z employee are staying on the job for two years and three months, which is actually not a super you know, short time, but it's not very long time either.

6:01 Yeah, it isn't. In fact, everybody intuitively knows the younger generations have a short attention span board more quickly than perhaps older generations did, so yeah, they're kind of in and out. I heard a friend, a CEO of a company, say, the corporate ladder has become the corporate lily pad. So you're hopping around from job to job like a lily pad. So that's why I argue in this book, if we're going to keep the good ones like we want to keep, we may have to change the way we lead and the platforms we build for them to flourish and want to stay at the job. I have a couple of gen ziers working for me or with me, and they are rock stars. Good good, I mean just rock stars. And my daughter is twenty two, she's a rock star. Yeah. So you know what I want us to get out of this conversation and help our listeners and viewers with is learning how to tap into and unleash their genius, which I think you do so beautifully in your book. So one of the many things I appreciated is when you kind of compare and contrast different generations. And one of the things that you do is you compare more of the seasoned, longer term veterans that have been in the workplace for a while, and of course these incoming younger rookies. And I thought it would be helpful if we could talk a little bit about some of that compare and contrast with comparison.

7:15 If we could, Yeah, I w'd love to. First of all, you know this, You've already said it yourself. I really do believe in generation CE. I've had my own share of frustrations because they are different than I am, And of course I want people to be like me. You know it's easier, sure, Yeah, But I take a challenger voice in this book. I challenge the assumptions we have that ah, kids today, they're lazy slackers. They're on their phones all the time, they show up late, they're wearing flip flops, all those things. And sometimes those things do happen. But what I think I've seen happening is our view of authority is shifting right before very eyes. Yes, and some of the respect that perhaps a typical president or CEO might want may not always be shown. But I'm going to contend it's not always disrespect. For instance, here's one Older generations tend to believe that your position gives you the right to influence. If you're the executive VP, you have the right influence, they might say, if they were honest, gen Z, that is your connection gives you the right to influence. Connect with me, build a relationship with me. Now, I know some older people are going, well, I don't have time for that. Well, I don't know if we can afford not to do that. Yes, if we want to keep the good ones like you have a lease on me me as well, we need to do that connection. So in these two columns, I have seasoned veterans certainly bring perspective from the past. We may have thirty forty years in our career. But the gen zers come in with perspective on the future. I found

8:45 in my focus groups and my quantitative research they see what's coming quicker than people forty and Overdo we possess insights based on our past career. They possess intuition on what the future customer is going to look like. I am now tapping in to the gen zers on my team and saying, what do you think is coming? Well, here's what I do when I buy something, I'm thinking that's the future right there. So older folks or I should say seasoned veterans would say, well, older people have wisdom, and I believe that's true. Gen Z might say yeah, but older folks could be irrelevant, and that is true as well. One last thing I think far too often current leaders that may be over forty would treat leadership like a gatekeeper. You know, I'm a gatekeeper of the power, the budget, the people. And they would say, would you not act like a gatekeeper? Would you act like a guide?

9:44 Be my shirp, a guide who's walking me up the mountain, and together we're going to score the you know, reach these heights, these new heights. If we can shift the way we see it. It doesn't mean we're not good leaders. In fact, I think it will mean we're better lying relying on our position to lead or lying relying on our connection. Mm hm. You know I've been saying for quite some time now, tim as I've continued to keep my finger on the pulse of the generations, and they're emerging. Is I release from me believe, and I would imagine you might somewhat align with this, is I really do believe that every generation makes us better as a species. Yes, they do. They make a contribution. They pull us forward in a way, and that's why it's so uncomfortable, because growth is never that kind of growth is never comfortable. And one of the many things that I got from your book that I thought was so interesting along those lines that I feel it seems that you're saying as well, and I believe I witness too, is the gen Z population. Of course, that's the youngest population. Those of you listening and viewing now have what's called the fluid intelligence. And if you could speak a little bit to that, I thought that was quite a fascinating idea.

10:52 Yeah, well, you're absolutely right. If I can just echo what you just said, gen Z is going to make us better leaders if nothing else had happens, We're going to become better. I put early in the book generation Z is the sandpaper on my leadership I did not know I needed. I think that's such a powerful quote that came from your friend. Yeah, it is so. Doctor Raymond Kuttel way back in the nineteen seventies did some brain research well before we ever had the fMRI, and he said, in the first half of a long life, the first forty years, we experienced mostly fluid intelligence, which is what gen Z has. Later in life, we experienced crystallized intelligence. So fluid is about adaptation. Young people adapt very quickly. It's about creativity.

11:41 They're often very very creative, innovative, et cetera. When we're older, it's not that we're never creative again, but we're much better at clarifying what we know and summarizing what we know. I think it's why Harvard professors that are very old often get the best marks from the students because they're able to say, don't pay attention to pay attention to that's what you need to know. So we need to capitalize on that fluid intelligence that let's say a twenty something brings in that even though we're a bit frustrated, I think we need to become fascinated at what they're saying, and maybe we need to learn to use the words help me understand dot dot dot we don't understand. Rather go on kids today, what are they talking about? So I really urge the reader of this book be the leader you need to be, but be open. One of the phrases I love to use is I want to speak in a meeting as if I believe I'm right, but I want to listen is if I believe I'm wrong and a better listener.

12:37 Yeah. That's so powerful, Tim, so many, so many powerful things you said in the book. Well, one of the one of the many things that I learned from your book that I really didn't fully understand before when you were describing gen z And is what I wanted to focus on this first in this first segment, is you talk about how they're very advanced cognitively and biologically, but really quite behind socially and emotionally. Can you say a bit more about that? Yes, absolutely, So. Those are the four quadrants that educators use to measure maturation, So biological growth and gen z would be ahead. In fact, just think, listeners, they're reaching puberty at earlier ages. They're physically stronger each generation, better athletes, et cetera. And then cognitively they have put more in their brains at twelve years old than I had at eighteen years old. I think, sure, you do a sex talk with your child and they're teaching you something.

13:29 Yeah, actually it's like this, yeah exactly. So those two categories they're advanced, but the ones they're behind in would be the social and emotional. And by the way, the pandemic did us no favors. Where they were learning on a screen, that's great, but they weren't socializing. And so those inner personal skills that a boss might really want you might have to teach them. And you might be going, what were your parents not teaching? No, No, they weren't. So I talk about you tell me if you want to talk of this now. But one of the big ideas in one of the early chapters, I talk about the Peter Pan paradox. Would that be okay to go for it? About? Okay? So it talks about this behind an advanced thing. So listeners, you know the character of Peter Pan I'm sure you saw the movie or read the book or whatever. But Peter Pan was this winsome character, right that was able to fly into London and sprinkle pixie dust everywhere and magical things happened. Right.

14:25 The other side of the coin was Peter Pan never wanted to grow up. He wanted to live in neverland. It's just a metaphor, but I think we see this happening in the workplace today. The age of authority seems to be going down. We neither coming in without a title, but they had some authority. They know stuff that we don't know. But the age of maturity is going up, at least I say in the book, I've lost count of the number of employers that are saying twenty six is the new eighteen. That's scary. So cognitively, yeah, got it. But then you go, would you look me in the eyes sun you know what? Would you would you talk to me? And would you show up on time to the meeting? That would be nice. So some of those fundamental skills we're going to teach. So my takeaway on this, by the way, is simple, and it's twofold. We're gonna have to listen more than we ever used to listen, but we're going to have to coach more than we ever used to coach. If we're willing to do those two things, we're going to be able to win and keep those great Generation Z members that are coming to our office.

15:29 And I really appreciate that because I certainly have gotten myself in trouble tim in that I have been in front of executive leader groups and where somebody will pup them and say I just can't manage the gen Z, and I'm like, I kind of get this point sort of thing going on, and I'm like, well, I don't know what use you're going to be to the organization because they're going to be them, and the Milan Pons will be the majority in just a few years, and if you can't manage them, I don't know what contribution you are to the organization. And one of the things that you say in your book is that many CEOs of instruction their teams not to hire first time job seekers, but let them cycle for their through their first job and you know, somebody else teach them some of these rudimentary skills and then we'll pick them up the second job.

16:11 Yeah. Yeah, And I think that's what you're speaking to in your book is there's a real opportunity and within through your strategies we'll talk about in the last segment to really help them step up into that space where they can make that process of bringing them on board and getting them going and connected much more quick. Yeah. I don't blame anyone for either approach. So wait for it to be the second job. Sure. I know friends that are executives, they are going once they get past you know that first two years, they're going to have their sea legs. But then I love the leaders that are willing to say I'm willing to coach, I'm willing to get them ready. Yes. In the book, I talk about Orangely Frozen Yogurt as an example, their company that sells frozen yogurt, and they were noticing they were hiring seventeen, eighteen, nineteen year old kids and they were quitting after a year and a half because that's what happens in fast food restaurants. So they decided to pivot and they said, we want our goal for those young employees for this to be the best first job you could ever have. Yeah, you're probably going to go on to something else. But we want to build a platform for you to launch. Well that was so winsome to that interviewee who was in the teenage years, maybe twenty one and saying, really, you want to help me get started, and so orange Leaf said, well, tell me what you really want to grow in here.

17:33 And if a job candidate said well, I want to learn marketing, Oh you need to meet Nancy, she heads up our marketing. She's fabulous, You'll learn so much. Or I want to learn bookkeeping, Oh, how need me? How? He's going to help you there. But you can see how they're adding value to those employees as well as getting work from them. And you can guess what they found. Those employees stayed longer because they're getting mentored. Sure, just good behavioral science. But if we'll be willing to make the investment, I think we're going to see a return on that investment. I'm in Tim, let's do it. Let's grab our first break while the let our listeners and viewers too. And what we've talked about so far and what really distinguishes who gen Z is. I'm your host, doctor Release Cortes, who are on the ear with doctor Tim Elmore. He's the founder of Growing Leaders in Atlanta based nonprofit organization created to develop emerging leaders. After the break, we're going to talk more about how gen Z was formed and shaped and what they bring to the workplace that's different.

18:28 We'll be right back. Doctor Elise Cortez is a management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author. She helps companies visioneer for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, perform and commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to invite a lease to speak to your organization, please visit her at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get your employees working on purpose. This is working on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today or to open a conversation with Elise, send an email to a lease a LISEE at eliscortes dot com. Now back to working on Purpose.

19:36 Thanks for stating with us, and welcome back to working on Purpose. I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes, as I am dedicated to helping create a world where organizations thrive because they're people thrive and they're led by inspirational leaders that help them find and contribute to their greatness, and we find ways to do business that betters the world. I keep researching and writing my own books, So one of my latest came out called A Great Revitalization. How activating meaning and purpose can theoretically and ligen your business. And I am route to help leaders understand today's evolving, very diverse and discerning workforce, and then I offer you twenty two best practices to equip you to provide that in your leadership and your culture. You can find my books on Amazon or my website at least Cortes dot com if you are just joining us. My guest is Tim Elmore. He's the author of the Future Begins with Z.

20:19 Nine Strategies to lead Generation Z as they disrupt the workplace. So for this segment, Tim, I wanted to help our listeners and viewers understand how Gen Z became who they are, those critical inputs and inputs and influences that have really shaped them. And I love how you also do that in your book for all of the other generations too. And one of the things that I was surprised to learn I didn't I don't think I understood this was how important and central mental health is for gens. Yeah. Yeah, it's off putting to some older people, saying, what do you mean you got mental health problems? Come to work, leave your problems at home, you know. So Generation Z for the listener that I'm not exactly sure who that segment is. So social scientists have been naming these generations for many generations. So there was Gen X, who grew up in the sixties and seventies, and then Gen Y the millennials in the eighties and nineties. Gen Z would be those who really only have a memory of the twenty first century. They grew up in the twenty first century, so the early ones would be right about the turn of the century, and they have gone through even as children, three economic downturns. Mass shootings, Oh my gosh. The last few years there have been more mass shootings in America than we had days in the year. So I'm not saying everything's dark, but I'm just saying there's a cynicism that accompanies gen Z that wasn't a part of the millennials.

21:45 They're a little bit jaded because when they look around them, they go are there any leaders worth following. I love what you're up to. You're building better, more healthy leaders worth following, so am I. But they're looking around going we're looking for them anyway. That would be the demographic that makes up gen Z, young adults and teens. Yeah, yeah, you know, so I definitely also appreciate it. You know, we all understand that that this particular demographic grew up with you know, their devices in their hands, which yeah, of course is deep in their addictions and their connection to it. But the other thing that you just hinted out there that I think is so so important, excuse me, which speaks to part of the disconnect in today's workplaces, their distrust of authority because they they've seen, you know, the raw dirt on so many leaders that you haven't gotten it done right or well, and they're like, you know, why should I follow someone like that? You don't, I don't. You don't get way a little to just because you have a title or the position. And I think that's critical that that we showcase this for leaders, because they're they're saying that is disrespect. And on the other side, what these young people also want is respect.

22:53 Yeah, it's true, it's a mutual thing. So in the book, I talk about when there's a rub, when there's a little bit of a conflict, and I try to be really practical, so I give a lot of acronyms that will help you remember the steps. The acronym I give that leads to that respect piece. A lease is a leg. So for years and years we've used this little phrase, Well, this is the leg you got to stand on. Right, So al eg reminds me how I need to approach a gen zer. Perhaps if I'm just saying something I don't understand they've done something wrong. Maybe, So the letter A reminds me I need to start with asking, not telling them what they've done wrong, but asking. And like the phrase I just said, can you help me understand or tell me your thought process behind that decision you made?

23:38 When we ask, they feel valued. Isn't you when you get asked a question? Oh you really? You want to know? The letter L reminds me I got to listen. It does very little good to ask any questions if we're not willing to do the work of listening. And when we listen, they feel heard. I love what David Augsburger Wance said being heard is so close to being loved. For the average person, it's indistinguishable. So you love them appropriately just by listening to them. The letter E is empathized. That's a that's a piece of art that I'm learning right now. I hate to admit it, but just learning to communicate. I get it. I understand you now. I'm seeing what you're saying. And maybe I learned to say things like, oh my gosh, I had no idea that happened, or that you felt awful when that happened. So here it is ask they feel valued, listen, they feel heard, empathize, they finally feel understood by you. And maybe that ten to twelve minute piece of time, you've now earned your right to practice the letter G, which is to guide them, and that you wanted to do in the first place.

24:46 But you did it with a bridge you built, not a badge you wear. I just think that's the way to the future. Here me too, how beautiful and so much more civilized and elevator. And you know, it goes back to what I said, is this is how each generation makes us better. Yeah, it's true, you're right. Yeah. One of the things that you also did that I thought was helpful. Is you gave us some various terms that really summarize gen Z's world, you know? They of course, they include things like instant access and multicultural, immediate feedback, cancel culture. Can you talk a little bit more about some of those things that really distinguish and have helped mold gen Zose? Yes, at least these terms, thanks for bringing it up, are just simple two word terms that when I look at them, I get a brief glance at the typical and nobody's typical, but at the order gen Z or a world that they grew in that was instant access.

25:42 They have not had to wait for a television program on you know, if they're on, unless they're on a network TV show on demand. Everything is on demand, a quick click, immediate feedback. They do expect you to text them right back if you know that sort of thing. Cancel culture. Want to talk about that for just a minute. I understand that we needed a dose of cancel culture. Harvey Weinstein needed to be canceled, for sure. However, there's been a pattern where that's been weaponized and it's not been helpful for gen Z or for leaders that are out there. When we practice a consistent form of cancel culture.

26:22 It starts training our brain to go, oh, hardship. Best way to face hardship is just cancel it. Just get rid of it. And I'm going no, no, no. On the college campus, you might need to hear that speech that you don't agree with, but maybe you're going to be forced to think a little bit more critically. So anyway, I'll stop there instead of waxing eloquent here. But it really those terms helped me just wrap my arms around that younger generation that I want to understand to do well in the future. One of the other things that I thought was really interesting and let me share that I want to. I forget how it came up, but somewhere in I was prompted to ask my daughter who were her role models?

27:03 Who did she really admire? And I was surprised to learn that you. My daughter is a graduate, she's a psychology graduate, she's now adulting, she has her first job, but she also has been a bodybuilder and competed as a bodybuilder. All of her role models were fitness experts and who have a TikTok channel. Yes, all of them, of course, all of them. And so one thing that you've said in your book that was interesting is that, you know, one of the great ironies of gen Z is that they value authenticity, but they live in such an artificial world. And that's what she also I asked, you know, what are these people, ask chat is what do these people have in common? They're authentic, they're real, they raw, they share their real stories of their lives.

27:53 That's the authenticity piece that she seems to and I asked her afterwards. She said, that's yeah, that's part of the draw for them. Yeah, no doubt about it. And that's the oxymoron. Though they will long for authenticity. I think the last three generations all said we want authentic, leader, we want authenticity, and yet the same generation, not all, but many might take fifty selfies to get one good one and then filter it, doctorate up you know before post Am'm going, wait, that's not authentic, that's not raw and real. So there is both, and the Averageenzer would admit it. They go, I know, I know, we're such an oxymoronic, you know, but all of us are. We just need to admit it. So one of the terms I actually did a book on this a number of years ago. It sounds very derogatory, and I do not mean for it to sound derogatory, but it's a description of the culture we live in today.

28:46 The term is artificial maturity. And here's what artificial maturity is, the summation of I think kids today are over exposed to information far earlier than they're ready and ge we agree with that, yes, but they're under exposed to first hand experiences later than they're ready. So I was working a job at age twelve, and my grandpa before me, I think, started at age nine on the farm. Today parents might say focus on academics. Do'll get your first job until you're done with college. Well, if done with college is the first job I got, they are going to not know how to be a professional with the. Office at all. And it's not their fault. But just know, you might see something that looks real. He may at twelve year old not be able to download the latest software. He knows all of this math tables, But that same boy at sixteen might not be able to look an adult in the eye and have a conversation because we taught one skill set on a screen, but not some of those real life skills that again, you and I Elisa are on the same page. We got to build this into the next generation.

29:52 Yeah. I started working for my parents when I was thirteen in the restaurant business, and that really helped me handle and learn to your point. You know, you said that gen Z suffers a lot from self esteem and if we focus more on developing their capacities, their capabilities, then their self esteem will naturally grow. And so I got that by working. And I know many parents who don't want their kids to work during high school or even maybe college, which I do think is a disservice. And now it's playing out. And one of the things that I saw in your book that was really interesting. A couple of mega characteristics that used to describe them are a high sense of agency, being able to get things done and make things happen, and also a high sense of anxiety.

30:34 Yeah. Yeah, so I'll comment on that if that's okay, please. These two again they seem so mutually exclusive. But the high sense of agency is a sense of self sufficiency. When we talk about a free agent, we mean that player on the ball field, It gets to go where every he wants to now, right, So a sense of agency as ooh, they feel like they can do it on their own. They feel sufficient, they feel empowered. But the anxiety, which is the other side of the same coin, is they might struggle with mental health issues. They might want to call their supervisor before the day begins and say I'm not coming in today. I'm not my best self today. And I want to say I'm not my best self either, but I'm at the office right now.

31:18 So again, I like your grandpa. But both of these are oxymoronic, but they're coexisting. And here's my belief. Call me the master of the obvious. But both of these high agency, high anxiety were fostered by the smartphone. I feel sufficient because I know everything on this little device, but it's overwhelmed me with all of the notifications I'm getting every day. So yeah, I think we got ambushed by it. I think we got ambushed by smartphone. Yeah. I've had other guests on my show talking about just that. So I want to finish this segment here, just helping our listeners and viewers understand a little bit what you shared with us in your book, some specific things that we learned about gen Z and work, and including that they are the most diverse population at work. What forty eight percent of them are not white. You know, they all own a smartphone or most all them, ninety six percent.

32:12 You know, they're smart consumers. Salary is a high motivator. You know, lots of different things in here that are just really really interesting. Less than half identified as purely heterosexual, meaning that their attractions are fluid, fiscally conservative, their top concern is income, and so many really interesting things that I thought were fascinating about gen Z. Yeah, they really are an interesting generation. They're not just a continuation of the Millennials, which oftentimes if we're not learned or studied, we might it's another general just like the last one. But they're really their own people. Millennials were idealistic. Gen Z might be a little pessimistic, and you can't blame them. So we need to make sure we all allow these young people to come in as individuals.

33:03 I like to say, we need to play chess, not checkers with them. Checkers pieces all look alike, and they move alike chess pieces. You better know what they're, what they're all about, and what moves they make. So the best leaders I know play chess not checkers with their people. They get to know their personality, their strength, and their generation. Yeah, great stuff. Tim. Let's grab our last break here all our listeners and viewers too, and what we've been talking about, what has really gone into forming gen Z. I'm your host, doctor ELISEE. Cortes. We've been on the air with doctor Tim Elmore, the founder of Growing Leaders and Atlanta based nonprofit organization created to develop emergent leaders. After the break, we're going to talk a bit more about just some of the strategies that Tim puts forth on how to best lead this particular generation, as well as a few more things that gen Z brings to the workplace. We'll be right back.

34:10 Doctor Elise Cortes is a management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author, she helps companies visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance, and commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to invite a lease to speak to your organization, please visit her at Elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get your employees working on purpose. This is working on purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today or to open a conversation with Elise, send an email to Alise A.

34:50 L Se at. Elisecortes dot com. Now back to Working on Purpose. Interesting with us and welcome back to Working on Purpose. I am your host, doctor Relis Cortes. As you know by now, this program is dedicated to empowering and inspiring you along your journey to realize more of your potential and make you into a greater, more effective, inspiring leader. If you want to learn more about the Gusto Now Academy for leaders and individuals on various journeys alike, make your way to gustodashnow dot com and then go to the training tab and you can learn about the academy there if you are just now joining us. My guest is Tim Elmore. He's the author of the Future Begins with C nine Strategies to lead Generation C as they disrupt the workplace. So one of the other many things that I found interesting as you characterize gen Z and kind of what they bring some upsides, As you say to gen Z as this really high interest in entrepreneurship, I didn't realize that they have such a strong focus on social justice for the marginalized. I very much align with that. They have a higher sense of agency, as we've been talking about than past youth. They're natural hackers.

36:01 This is really interesting and dig into and discover how things work, and a keener leadership, keener interest in leadership than previous generations. These are really quite interesting. Yeah, they are. To speak to a few of those. Yeah, those are not only interesting, they are so they make me hopeful, yes, yes, and optimistic. Yes. So I know. Leaders listening, it's easy to see the downside how they're not like you. But I'm telling you they bring I think, what the workplace needs, and they are the sandpaper on our leadership that will polish us up as leaders. But Alise, if you remember, I tell some stories in the book, and one of the stories I tell early on is my friend Colin Colin. I've known Colin since he was in high school, and he graduated a very smart high school graduate, and so he went off to MIT. Not a bad gig. He did very well at MIT, and so he had a number of job offers when he got finished. Well, he decided to move to Detroit, Michigan to work for one of the Big three General Motors, so we went into automaking.

37:06 They put him in the smart car division, which was a smart move. But Colin, as a young twenty two year old, looked around and saw all kinds of things that they could do better. Now you could already think now that'd be off putting if you're twenty two. I'm fifty two. You know, what are you doing? Buddy? But Colin writes him down, and I might add he's very respectful. He would never do anything arrogant or haughty or anything like that. But Colin took this list of ideas to his supervisor and he didn't get a he didn't get a great review. His supervisor, Hey, buddy, we didn't bring you any give us any ideas. You keep your head down, keep your nose to the grindstone, just do your work well. Colin I'm sure, said yes, sir. But he went back to his desk and he decided this is an audacious gen Z type move to email the CEO of General Motors, Mary Bara, and he writes a note, Dear Mary, this is Colin. I cut some ideas that might make GM better, and he thought they could do professional development better, and they probably could. You know, do this system better, that process better. Well, she emails him back. She replies back and says, Colin, these are really good ideas. Let me take them to my executive team. So she takes them to her executive team. They agree, these are really good ideas.

38:24 But as you can imagine, when those ideas make their way down the organizational chart into that middle manager, that supervisor of Collins, they die on the vine again. Colin was told you need to be around here eight years before you get to lead anything. Well you might as well have told him to leave. Within a year, Colin quits. And he's not a quitter, but he quits. He has started three organ He's the entrepreneur. He has started three companies, just sold one of them, so he's doing quite well financially. He just started a new one called Avatar Robotics, where you can pick up something in Orlando and something moves in Sacramento. And I do not know how it works, but I'm thinking this is a great example of what I'm talking about. They bring some magic. Now, not everybody's calling for sure. In fact, sometimes you may find one you go. I'm still looking for that gold inside. Keep looking.

39:22 But I think they bring something like this, with that same spirit, let's do something new at work. And so I talk about Maggie in the book. I think you saw that Maggie story and saw the need for schools in Madagascar. And so she makes school buildings with three D printers. I would not know where to start. She's done it. And Makasinski. Anne had a Facebook pal when she was in high school. She's no longer in high school now, but she was interacting with this friend in the Philippines, and she asked her friend how she was doing one time, and her friend said, well, I'm flunking all my classes. Well, An said, how could you be flunking You're smarter than I am. And her friend explained that the village where she lived it was not Manila.

40:12 She said, we don't have any electricity, so when the sun goes down, I can't do my homework and I'm not finishing my projects. Well, that would have I probably would have said, I'll pray for you, you know, or something like that. But here's what Anne did and was a science nut. She creates This is not a joke, this is a real story. She creates a flashlight that the powers generated from the body heat from your hand. You hold it and the light goes on, and she creates it. She wins a science Fair award, as you can imagine, sends it over to a friend. Her friend starts passing classes. She then developed one that could be like a like a helmet and let you oh my gosh.

40:53 And then real quick, I need to tell you about Kent and Lee, who as a twenty two year old went to a country in Africa and a developing nation, and noticed that the kids there either didn't have shoes or they were wearing shoes that had the toes cut out because their feet were growing on the shoes. And he goes, what's up with this? Why don't you get new shoes? They go, we can't get new shoes. Can invented the shoe that grows. That's what it calls. And it's three different parts that can grow with your foot all the way from elementary school to high school. And I'm thinking this is so encouraging to me, ideas that I would not think so anyway. I listeners, just take heart if you can stick with them and somehow coach them up. But then listen up. I'm telling you, I think we have a bright future. I really do.

41:47 I do too, and it's dang off the charts inspiring. Tim. Yeah, and so that's part of why I wanted to have you on is I want. What I want is for these leaders to recognize, I know this is uncomfortable, I know this is hard, and this this idea of as you say, Adam Grant talks about this democratization of the workplace where there's a power shift between the organization and the employee. Now, and of course leaders don't like that. Who wants to give up power and control? But when you do, this is the kind of stuff that you get rewarding with. And so I'm really excited to I mean, my gen Zer, this is the kind of stuff they do with me. We haven't quite developed, you know, you know, schools through three D printing just yet. But give me until next week.

42:27 I think that's right. Yes, So let's just do this. You gave us nine strategies in your book on how to really lead effectively. Of course we don't have time to get to all of them, so I want to get just a couple of them, and I want to start if you could share I thought the idea of the strategy of the welcome wagon to make these new incoming gen Zers want to stay was really powerful. Can you bring that general strategy to life for absolutely? I'll try to do this in just a few minutes here, but this is crucial that we get it down. So many people are losing Generation Zers even if they stay, because they didn't begin well. I believe we need to make that first week unforgettable. I know that sounds like what are we of youth group here with balloons? And you don't have to be a youth group, but I'm telling you, if you can make that first day or first week unforgettable, you've got something. But at least I believe it actually begins before that. I think it begins at the interview process. I think the interview process, at least as far as gen Z goes, needs to be a two way street. Absolutely hiring managers not just asking a bunch of questions of them, but they are also questions are coming back. So I offer another acronym, and it's perks p E RKS. I believe, aside from can you do the job, Josh, we need to be asking letter P what are your preferences when you come to work?

43:48 What would you prefer and this is not strong. It's not expectations and demands. It's just what would you like to see? What would you wish for? And they might say I'd love a coke machine in the dining room. Oh that's we can do that, you know. But finding out their preferences tells you a lot about who they are, what they wish for, and it may inform how you connect with them. The letter is expectations. That's stronger than preferences. I assume this will be true, and you can learn a lot about a gen Z. On the upside, it may tell you right then and there, hey this is not going to work out. I'm sorry, that's never going to happen. I need to walk you to the door. I wish the best, but expectations. Here's my belief. Conflict expands based on the distance between expectations and reality. And unless we talk about them up front, we're going to see trouble in six months when they're gossiping in the break room, when we should have solved that problem early on the letter RS requirements. At least. This probably sounds crazy, but gen Z is so strong based on the input from social media. They have demands that we're going to march for this cause in March or whatever. I don't know.

44:59 And you again, you just need to get ready. They are social justice people, which is not a bad thing, but you need to make sure that those demands you either talk about it, I'm right up front, or say I'm so sorry that's not going to happen. The letter k is keys. I have found it so helpful to find out the keys to their heart. Now this is a five minute conversation, it's not fifty minutes. But what makes you tick? What are your hobbies, what do you love, what do you care about? Yeah, and minimally we got Hallway conversation. Now if we hire them, we hey, how about those cubs? You know? And then the letter s of course's salary, which you probably posted on the website. But I have found too many times you got to still talk about it because they're wanting something. And by the way, I didn't say this in the book, but more and more parents are joining their gen zer at the job interview. It's a little bit scary and a little bit crazy, but mama wants to negotiate the compensation package for junior. So anyway perks may be a great handle for you to add to your interview process.

46:01 Yeah, amazing, Tim. You know, there's so much more we can talk about. That's why Ridgess' lisions. You just got to pick up the book right because there's just so much for you to learn here. You have a chapter dedicated to critical conversations and offering tough feedback and really situate how feedback can be really hard for gen Z because that's not at all what they condition to receive, and so it's really difficult to give it to them. And I loved your whole velvet and brick sort of analogy. We don't really have time to talk about that, but I just wanted to sort of queue it up and tease their listeners and viewers. I think it's just brilliant, Tim. So I also do want to situate that, as we said, what gen Z wants from their leaders, who say is community, respect, curiosity.

46:41 Yeah, so you got Yeah, I'm a little bit to that. And then I'll ask you to close for us. Well, they are they register as the loneliest generation on the planet. Now, all generations are are a bit lonely right now. Depending on how old you are, you might get Yeah, I'm lonely too, but they have. The irony is they're well connected on the device, the board of a device, but they're always not well doing well with community in person. Why wouldn't the team out the job provide some of that community where we feel like we belong to this work and this mission, but also these people. So community is huge. And then you also brought up the whole idea of they want respect. Very often my generation would say, well, you need to earn my respect, junior, but they're saying, why don't we all respect each other from day one? And actually, that's a great question. It is I think we need to do. So I argue for the idea that we begin with belief. I'm not going to begin with suspicion that that twenty two year old doesn't know what he's doing. In fact, the last twenty two year old I hired, I said, listen, I'm going to begin with belief. I believe you're going to add some incredible value. In fact, I'm probably going to need to learn some things from you. But that's so help the reciprecation of that belief. So I am just really really an advocate of that, and so I'll stop there, but they really want that that respect, the community, the curiosity.

48:10 Those are the three things that if you can practice that leaders, you're going to win them at the heart level. So, Tim, I'm so grateful to have met you and I learned, as I said, a ton out of your book, and I'm so grateful to share my listeners viewers across the world saying about thirty seconds, what would you like to leave our listeners and viewers with? Oh gosh, well, I'm hoping what I've said makes sense, But a quick thirty second story I share in the book what happened to my generation when we were young. We all know that NASA landed a man on the moon in July of nineteen sixty nine, an incredible feat that no one had ever done. But do you know who actually did it? When JFK said let's put a man on the moon in nineteen sixty one, in nineteen sixty two, NASA didn't even have the technology to do such a thing, so they quickly had to acquire a bunch of technology. Well, the guys that were there that were forty five, fifty to fifty five years old didn't really understand it. Guests who understood it. The interns, the young employees in their twenties. So slowly but surely, the NASA leaders were turning authority over to these young people.

49:17 Get this, the average age of the operator at the control center twenty seven years old and the guy that actually said go not know to put Neil Armstrong on the moon, Jack Garman twenty three years old. The older generation served as simsups, simulator supervisors, they were coaching and mentory, but they turned those young people loose to put something, to do something. We did a moonshot and we did it. So here's what I would say, listeners, what's your moonshot? And could we empower these gen z ors to be those operators that actually pulled off for the organization. Oh wait, I bring it home tim Elmore. Listeners and viewers, you are going to want to learn more about Tim Elmore and the work that he and Seam are doing at Growing Leaders Plus is thirty eight other books, etc.

50:04 You can visit his website tim Elmore dot com. It's t I m l E l m o r E tim elmore dot com. Last week we missed the live show. You can always catch it be you recorded podcast. We were on air with Monica Pierre, who gave us a commanding performance on the power of learning to tell a story to share inspiring communications. She talked about putting change, fear and diminishment on trial. Next week, we'll be on air talking to Ryan Godfordson talking about his book The Elevated Leader. Level Up your leadership through Vertical Development. See you then, and together, let's lean in and learn how to create destination workplaces where people thrive while doing business in a way that betters the world. Let's work on Purpose.

50:47 We hope you've enjoyed this week's program. Be sure to tune into Working on Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes, each week on W four CY. Together, we'll create a world where business operates conscientiously, readership inspires and passion performance, and employees are fulfilled in work that provides the meaning and purpose they crave. See you there, Let's work on Purpose.