March 17, 2026

The Curse and Gift of Being “Driven”

The Curse and Gift of Being “Driven”
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Only about 10% of the population are what psychologist Douglas Brackmann calls “The Driven.” They are the entrepreneurs, inventors, and elite performers who build companies, create new industries, and generate much of the world’s wealth. But their superpower comes with a shadow. Driven individuals are often chronically dissatisfied—always pushing for more, even after achieving what others would consider extraordinary success.

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The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are

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What's working on Purpose?

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Anyway?

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Each week we ponder the answer to this question. People

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ache for meaning and purpose at work, to contribute their

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talents passionately and know their lives really matter. They crave

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being part of an organization that inspires them and helps

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them grow into realizing their highest potential. Business can be

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such a force for good in the world, elevating humanity.

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In our program, we provide guidance and inspiration to help

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usher in this world we all want working on purpose.

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Now here's your host, doctor Elise Cortez.

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Welcome back to Working in a Purpose program, which has

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been brought to you with passionate price since February twenty fifteen.

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Thanks for tuning in this week. Great to have you.

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I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes. If wed before and

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you don't know me, I'm an organizational psychologist, workforce advisor

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and management consultant, speaker and author. My team and I

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at gusta Now help companies to enlive, and and fortify

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their operations by building a dynamic, high performance culture, inspirational leadership,

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and nurturing managers activated by meaning and purpose. You can

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learn about what we do and how we can help

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you by visiting gustodeshnow dot com. I'm or my personal

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site at least Cortes dot com. With us today is

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doctor Doug Breckman. He is a psychologist at I Am Driven.

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He works with highly driven leaders and other highly driven

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people who often who often add and ADHD spectrum to

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help them stop their cycle of shame and self sabotage

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so that they can achieve the success and happiness they

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were designed for. He's the co author of Driven Understanding

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and Hard Seeing the Genetic Gifts of Entrepreneurs, Navy Seals

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and professional athletes and Maybe You, and a new book

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just coming out called Sheep and Wolves why a small

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percentage of the neurodivergent population may be responsible for all

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the problems in the world, and the solution. We'll be

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talking about the characteristics of this what ten percent of

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the population that are highly driven and how they can

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learn to be effective in life through the right structured

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support systems. These ersure today from Nashville, Tennessee, Doctor Doug A. Hardy,

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Welcome to Working on Purpose.

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Thank you, Elise.

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It's really great to know you. You probably changed my life, sir,

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So thanks a lot for that. I have so much

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insight reading your book and went, oh my gosh, wow.

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That's my favorite Amazon review. It says a very uncomfortable autobiography.

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So it's a yeah, it's kind of a little crey

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close for home for a lot of people.

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Yeah, we'll talk more about that offline. But wow, so big,

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thank you. So it's really amazing to me that you know,

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you focus on only ten percent of the population, talk

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about a niche group. So let's talk a little bit

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about this specific group year ten percent that you're talking about.

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This is the driven population. So how would you describe

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them and why do you want to work with them?

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Well, it's it's I am a license psychologist and both

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iopsyche and clinical psyche, and so it's a clinically speaking

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it it's called a whole bunch of different things, and

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so categorization is not really a big fan of that.

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And so it's a collection of neuro divergent and genetic

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divergence that really encapsulates and I generously give it ten percent,

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but it's really probably three or four percent to be

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you know, kind of swear in the middle. Then you

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get the fringes. But it's if you got it, you

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know you got it, and if you know somebody who

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has it, it's really that were different. And so it was,

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you know, when I entered psychology and I went into

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grad school in nineteen ninety one, and it everybody gets

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into psychology to figure out their own crap. And I

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was headstrong into really understanding myself. I always knew I

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was different and tried to fit in and that led

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to a whole bunch of whole bunch of issues. But

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in nineteen ninety one, when they released this Time magazine

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article came out with we found the alcoholism gene, and

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that was the d r D two dash A one

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allele gene. Thirty five, thirty six years ago, forty years ago,

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they really didn't understand genetics, and so it was the

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nature versus nurture controversy still existed, and in the last

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ten years, particular the last five epigenetically, the argument is

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that nature versus nurture is gone, and so meaning that

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our genes interact with the environment and turn on and off,

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and so we being the drivens, are a collection of

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very different people, and we are primarily different in the

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way our brain works. And so the default model network

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is this operating system the brain. And so we have

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an operating system that literally is operating three times as fast,

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connecting four times as many brain parts simultaneously. So it's

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literally our brains are working differently. All the hardware is

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the saying, but the software is running a very quick, fast,

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different program. So literally we see the world in a

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different way.

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I appreciate how you'd also described this driven population that

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you talk about here, just so many different things about

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them that some of this, of course, being that you're

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chronically disconnected and discontented. I thought that was a really

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interesting I'm in this category to a certain extent too,

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I'm looking more on the periphery, not smack down the middle,

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but I could recognize it a chronic dopamine efficiency that

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creates persistent discontent. All kinds of interesting things, high sensory

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and emotional intensity, fast pattern recognition, as as you said,

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with poor impulse breaking. An interesting sort of collection of

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how to describe this group.

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And the easiest way, kind of the simplest way to

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describe it is really the science behind it. You put

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us in a functional MRI, and the functional MRI is

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just way of actually seeing in real time what's activated

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in the brain. Currently, most people ninety plus ninety five

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percent of people, when you put them in a functional MRI,

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they have a nice ball of activity in the left

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proof frontal lobe. It's the executive function. And what the

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executive function does for most people, it is a It

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tunes out information, and so it allows them to selectively

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tune into information, and interestingly, it puts into a series

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of sequential events. And so if you think about, you know,

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the hunter farmer theory, where most people over the last

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five six, seven thousand years adapted to the agricultural revolution,

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and if you think about what it takes to survive

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as a farmer's farming, and so they are wired. You

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put their finger in the ground, they put corn in it,

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and then they pat it, and then they water it,

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and then they patiently wait and all of those attributes

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then you know, lead to their survival. But there's five

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six percent of us that when you put us in

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a functional MRI, we don't have all of activity here.

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Really interestingly, the back of our heads lighted up, which

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is called the ziphital, and what that does is literally

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it's where eesight is, and so we use our eyesight

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to go through the world. Byproduct of that is we

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have something called hypofrontality and this big collection of symptoms

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around add or ADHD, two very different things, but the

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similarity is this frontal lobe that is hypoactive, meaning that

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it's underactive. In comparison to the people that have this

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big ball energy, we have little dots of activity all over.

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The farmer sees the world as a series of sequential steps.

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We see the world as a big ball of potential

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activity all at the same time. And we have a

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horrible sense of time. I mean, we are late to

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every day. We are constantly in this world where we then,

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with all this activity going on, we can draw lines

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unique combination of variables that other people can't see. So,

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you know, we tell our stories or we try to

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explain our vision for the company, and you know, people

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look at us like we're crazy because we, you know,

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are literally seeing connections between eighteen different things, where the

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normal brain, you know, is only seeing connections between two

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or three. So you know, it is a truly a

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different world that we live in.

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But it wasn't made for us. So I'll tell you,

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you know, candidly. I took your assessment and I came

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out there's ten attributes that, of course are measured, and

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I'm eight of them. I'm I'm shown on the assessment

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is above average, And I thought, okay, that's you know,

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there's it's probably you know, maybe it's not. Who knows.

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Maybe I was in a weird mooder when edw with

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the assessment. But then I read your book, tug I did.

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Somebody worked with me years ago, and I told her

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how I like to finish my Saturday afternoon is my

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time to read my books for the for the podcast,

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and she goes, oh my gosh, you read books like

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I eat cookie. So your book, your first book, Driven

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is three hundred and fifty pages. I easily just sat

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down and just about it in four hours, and you know,

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you know, wrote the notes and highlighted what I wanted

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to have for my notes, and I mean, I just

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couldn't put it down. I was like, oh my gosh.

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I was like, every other page, I'm like that that's me.

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That explains me. And I can't tell you how.

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I don't know.

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If I'm sobered by it or if I am scared,

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I don't know, but I just am. I'm amazed the

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work that you're doing.

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I appreciate that, and it's for me. And why I

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wrote Driven is I prior to writing and so I

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wrote it published in seventeen or eighteen there about seventeen, yeah, seventeen.

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Prior to that, you know, I was calling it the

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entrepreneurial mind. I was calling it all these different things.

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And I happened to actually be working in maybe special warfare,

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working in the PTSD world, and they're all driven too,

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and so it was this, you know, and it is

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we're drawn into this high risk, hyper you know, chaotic

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world and that's where we thrive. And one of the

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early authors on this, Tom Hartman, was talking about how

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you know, in you look at a pool of bacteria,

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thousand of the same bacteria, there's about three four five

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percent of that bacteria that's waiting for rapidly changing environments.

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And you know, the ice age hits, they're going to survive.

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And so that's us. When you know, the meteorite hits

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or the next ice age, or you know, AI comes

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onto the scene, when chaos and all of that new activity,

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we just thrive in it. So it makes sense, you know,

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we're a bunch of animals. Why we would be so

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resist in the population. You know why it hasn't this

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been baited out? Because things change and you know, and

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so it's a it's a very relieving thing for a

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lot of people because we structure our sense of self

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or our identity very differently. That's right, when we go

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into a normal you know, a farmer's or a typical

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neurotypical psychologist's office, we can run circles around them and

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we literally we can finish their sentences and they think

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we're crazy or sociopathic, or they don't like they don't

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know what they're looking at. And so large the biggest difference,

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this left prefrontal is an identity machine. And if you

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think about you know, ten thousand years ago, there's mostly

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drivens running around on the planet, you know, after this

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massive meteorite hit fourteen thousand years ago and we're figuring

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out survival. But as the agricultural revolution and population grew

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and most people you know, as I always say, turned

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into butchers and bakers and candlestick makers, they had this

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nice channel of this is how I survived, This is

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what I do. You want to take a driven person

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and make them crazy, is ask them to tell us

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who you are and what do you mean? Who like that?

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You know, because we don't have that consistent you know,

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experience through life with our thoughts. We're thinking all over

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the place, and you know we tend to and all

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of us need a sense of self. Most drivens tend

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to use their emotion as identity. And the genetics behind it,

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you know, the dopamine receptors number two, which is boredom,

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the boredom gene. And you know, if you're a farmer,

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you need to tolerate boredom. You literally are wired to watch

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stuff grow. Yeah, as I always joked with all my drivens,

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you know, I'm unemployable. I truly am and most of

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my guys are our employed, so they have to start

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their own thing. But what boredom is is very simply,

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it's a feeling that there's something missing or wrong.

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I understand it well, and.

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You know that when that gets folded into identity, there's

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something missing or wrong with me. And these are the

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addictive genetics and anything that takes you out of that

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feeling that there's something missing or wrong with me, oh

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potentially become addicted. It also explains why we're so defensive.

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You want to drive a driven person crazy. It's accuse

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them of being you know, something wrong with you, and

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no opportunity to explain themselves. We lose our minds. It's like,

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what do you mean? And you don't understand, you don't understand,

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and that it's coming from this well of feeling like

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we don't fit in and you know, the dopamine receptor

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number four a little bit more interesting, and that's the

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primary difference between a d D, which is you know,

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an ADHD and the AH is the hyperactivity or impulsivity,

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which I don't have a lot, and so I really

249
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missed the add ADHD diagnosis, but it is the grass

250
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is greener Jean or the Foamo gene. If you're a

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missing out gene as a as a hunter. You know,

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I feel in I sense that there's more Willie, ma'am.

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It's more opportunity over the next till right. I'm always

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choosing the siny things in front of me, and it

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is you know, well, isn't that just add Yes? But

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it is so much more than that, And if you

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get into driven, it really explains, you know, why we're different,

258
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how we're different. And as I often say, you know,

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it is a farmer's world. It is not our world.

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We have to learn it.

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There's a reason I was telling you im talking about

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my daughter about your work, and she's always told me

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how silly I have been over the years. I'm just

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simply am not able to do a nine to five job.

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I'm not able to go work for somebody and be

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stapled into the chair. I mean, I'll work twelve hours,

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sixteen hours a day, but just don't make me do it,

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you know, under terms with you know, my daarriers table

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to the chair, you know, in these hours kind of thing.

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Yeah, we work well, we can work well with others.

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We do not work for others. Very work, very well. Yeah,

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it really is bring out the faster, easier, softer, better

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way to do it. And why are you telling me

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to do your way when I can? And so the world,

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you know, the world is. The world can be really

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tough for us though, because we don't fit in and

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we often scare the crap out of people that aren't

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like us.

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Yes, I understand, guilty is charged. On that note, since

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we're scaring the crap out of people, let's let let's

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let them at least have a break while that's happening

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to them. I'm your host, doctor really score tes run

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here with doctor Doug Brackman, a psychologist that I am driven.

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He works with highly driven leaders and other highly driven

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people off an a D d ADHD spectrum to help

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them stop their cycle of shame and self sabotage so

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they're can to achieve the success and happiness they were

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designed for. We've been getting in to what is driven.

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After the break, we're going to talk about the dark

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side of driven. We'll be right back.

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Doctor Elise Cortes is a management consultant specializing in meaning

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and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author, she helps companies

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visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired

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leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance, and

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commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to invite

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a lease to speak to your organization, please visit her

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at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get

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your employees working on purpose. This is working on Purpose

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with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today or

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to open a conversation with at least send an email

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to Elise A. L i Se at eliscortes dot com.

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Now back to working on purpose.

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Fifting with us, and welcome back to working on Purpose.

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I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes. If you are just

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joining us, my guest is doctor Doug Brockman, the author

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of Driven Understanding and Harnessing the Genet Gifts Shared by entrepreneurs,

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Navy Seals, pro athletes, and maybe you, and also a

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forthcoming book coming out shortly called Sheep and Wolves. Why

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a small percentage of the neurodivergent population may be responsible

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for all the problems in the world and the solution.

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So I do want to situate a little bit about

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just you know, before we get into the dark side

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of the driven. If you can speak a little bit

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to the possibility of being driven, what can we do

315
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being driven?

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I do that in my book. I mean Da Vinci

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and all of your received jobs and Gates and all

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of the you know, the list of people that have

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been diagnosed with add or fit into the driven criteria.

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We are basically the ones that have shaped.

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And moved the world.

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We really are. And you know it's and you know

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in my next work that I'm really it is coming

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out literally this week, is we are also responsible for

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a lot of the problems in the world. And so

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we you know, and I've worked with a lot of

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entrepreneurs over the last thirty years, and you know, the

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justification rationalization of how we how our minds can justify

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just about anything, you know, and typically, you know, we

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are not very We're really not risk averse. We like

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taking risk and often that's means breaking the rules and

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so writing the edge of the rules. And we always

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get accused of being sociopathic, which very simply is you know,

334
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the the social norms and the rules don't necessarily apply

335
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to me. Drivens we tend to live by this spirit

336
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of the law rather than the letter of the law.

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And you know, we don't have that part of the

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brain that you know, will just follow the rules, and

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you know, you don't make it very far in life

340
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following the rules. And the particular is an entrepreneur creating companies.

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I mean you have to you have to see around

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the rules to really what is the bigger objective. But

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if that objective is to make money on a quarterly basis,

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we can we can create a pretty horrible system for

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a lot of people. I think that's coming to a

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head right now. So it's a you know, driven I

347
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think there's a lot of responsibility that hopefully comes with it.

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If you're hearing this and you're driven, and it's a

349
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gift first, but it is a curse.

350
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Yeah, I appreciate that full perspective. So that's the dark side, yes,

351
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but also too it can be very destructive, self destructive,

352
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self sabotaging you mentioned in your books.

353
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Yeah, and that's what gets people into my office. And

354
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it there's car a Young, big fan of young. He

355
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was driven, big fan, and what he always said was

356
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it six You know, men are either sixteen or forty

357
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five when they enter his office. At sixteen, you're out

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to conquer the world. At forty five, if you've conquered

359
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the world, you realize it isn't the world you needed

360
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to conquer its yourself, and that you know, sabotage was

361
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my doctoral dissertation and I looked at you know, why

362
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January sucks at the gym and why is you know,

363
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who's really in charge of me? You know, the difference

364
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between you know, the neocortex and actually the biology of

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the body. So I get into that and driven. I

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won't go and do it here too deep, but it

367
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it's it's a very interesting exploration that I believe drivens

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eventually have to go on because if you don't go

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into this inner world of the driven, if you stay

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in the outer world, it's pretty quickly deduced that you know,

371
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survival in this world is pretty damn easy. It really is.

372
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And so once you've reached that point of you know,

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my outer my outer world looks great, but my inner world,

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this feeling that I'm not enough, this feeling of imposter

375
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syndrome legs driven. You know, that is what we are is,

376
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you know, this feeling that I'm not enough, and that

377
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needs to be explored if you want to, if you

378
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don't want that to steer your world.

379
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:50.079
Yeah, I was really intrigued. You talked about the identity

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issue in the last segment, but I was really intrigued

381
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that that you talk about how you know, you know,

382
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ignoring the shadow doesn't make it disappear, and he says

383
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it gives it the steering the steering wheel, which is fascinating,

384
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and so talking about how pain gets that that isn't felt,

385
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gets passed on families, do these cultures do this, et cetera.

386
00:23:08.200 --> 00:23:10.119
But you also say that we are the ones who

387
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carry generational pain until it becomes unbearable. Yeah, and that

388
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notion of doing this work is so important.

389
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Yeah, that's really getting into the work of My true

390
00:23:21.240 --> 00:23:26.240
passion is trauma healing, and that happened my doctoral chairperson,

391
00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:29.480
Jim Spira, and we made at Berkeley was a guy

392
00:23:29.559 --> 00:23:33.559
named Peter Levine, right levin the world back in the nineties,

393
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and it has shaped everything I do. He being driven

394
00:23:38.920 --> 00:23:44.079
to ish. But the influence of actually who's in charge

395
00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:46.519
of me? Is it? You know, the monkey mind, is

396
00:23:46.559 --> 00:23:49.960
that this problem solving the slip in my head always

397
00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:54.799
in my base biology, that's that's in the body, you know,

398
00:23:55.559 --> 00:23:59.000
very simply this is the brain, this whole thing that

399
00:23:59.039 --> 00:24:02.759
we're living in this line. M yeah, and you know,

400
00:24:03.039 --> 00:24:07.759
the felt sense that I'm not enough drives us to

401
00:24:07.880 --> 00:24:12.559
great success. But when the outer world is, you know,

402
00:24:13.720 --> 00:24:17.079
going really well and there's not a lot of chaos,

403
00:24:17.119 --> 00:24:19.559
we tend to come up with great ideas to bring

404
00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:23.160
chaos back into our world. And the sabotage stories that

405
00:24:23.200 --> 00:24:26.599
I have are just phenomenal guys that blow up their worlds,

406
00:24:27.880 --> 00:24:30.160
you know, with the next great idea, or they have

407
00:24:30.319 --> 00:24:33.039
the typical big exit. You know, they have a seven,

408
00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:38.440
eight figure, nine figure exit, and you know, everything is

409
00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:40.400
great and then all of a sudden, you know, three

410
00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:43.880
years later, just like lottery winners, you blow up your world.

411
00:24:44.880 --> 00:24:47.480
So I dive deep into that with my guys about

412
00:24:47.799 --> 00:24:50.680
you know, how to actually stop the sabotage and cycle,

413
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which is trauma healing.

414
00:24:54.319 --> 00:24:56.680
Fascinating stuff. You. By the way, now you can't get

415
00:24:56.680 --> 00:24:59.160
away from me, Doug, because you're just this is fascinating work.

416
00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:03.960
I'm really really, I'm in. I'm in. So let's let's

417
00:25:04.039 --> 00:25:06.240
dive into your your new book coming out here, Sheep

418
00:25:06.279 --> 00:25:10.000
and Wolves. Let's first start by what an intriguing title

419
00:25:10.119 --> 00:25:12.640
title right there, Doug. But let's for our listeners and

420
00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:14.359
years who haven't read the book yet, Like I have

421
00:25:14.920 --> 00:25:16.839
distinguished sheep and wolves first.

422
00:25:17.839 --> 00:25:23.599
Yeah, and you know the just calling most people's sheep

423
00:25:24.200 --> 00:25:27.599
and it's you know, I struggled with that forever. You know,

424
00:25:28.160 --> 00:25:30.720
it is not meant to be a put down sheeaper compliance.

425
00:25:30.759 --> 00:25:35.440
Sheep are not a problem to society. Sheep follow the rules,

426
00:25:37.279 --> 00:25:40.559
you know, they're not They're not stirring the pot. And

427
00:25:40.720 --> 00:25:44.359
you know, the wolves and typically you know, big farm

428
00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:47.839
and big food, all of these things that are being

429
00:25:47.880 --> 00:25:52.559
discovered now through both the Internet, which is a phenomenal

430
00:25:54.400 --> 00:25:57.400
Gutenberg's printing press, on steroids. I think I call it.

431
00:25:57.440 --> 00:26:00.519
You know, it's a way of disseminating information that you

432
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:05.799
can't any you can't hide from your past anymore. And

433
00:26:05.920 --> 00:26:09.079
that is a you know, with Epstein files and everything

434
00:26:09.079 --> 00:26:14.079
else we're facing now, none of that is new. I mean,

435
00:26:14.240 --> 00:26:16.640
you know, well, the world's terrible. None of the world's

436
00:26:16.640 --> 00:26:21.160
actually never been safer ever, you know ever in the

437
00:26:21.279 --> 00:26:24.519
history that we can you know, recorded history. Well, how

438
00:26:24.519 --> 00:26:27.799
can you say that safe? Well, you look at our health,

439
00:26:27.920 --> 00:26:29.400
you look at the wars, you look at you know,

440
00:26:29.440 --> 00:26:31.519
the chances of me, or you are dying in a

441
00:26:31.799 --> 00:26:35.200
starvation or you know, God forbid it, you get in

442
00:26:35.240 --> 00:26:38.240
an infection. One hundred and fifty years ago, you were dead.

443
00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:43.599
And so as the world has become this beautiful safe place,

444
00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:49.119
the collective is freaking out. And you know, trauma comes

445
00:26:49.160 --> 00:26:54.759
up when the world becomes safe. So when the guys

446
00:26:54.799 --> 00:26:58.519
come back from Afghanistans, when they freak out, it's not

447
00:26:58.720 --> 00:27:01.839
when they're in combat. And all my team guys and

448
00:27:01.880 --> 00:27:04.279
all the guys I've worked with that go back, you know,

449
00:27:04.319 --> 00:27:07.039
they want to go back into the familiar world of chaos,

450
00:27:08.319 --> 00:27:11.680
and we're seeing it. We're literally witnessing it now. It's

451
00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:14.160
chaos is coming back into the world and it's just

452
00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:18.960
you know, as a collective, I think we're But you

453
00:27:19.039 --> 00:27:22.119
try to explain that to someone who has this very

454
00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:25.839
dominant left prefrontel that's seeing linear, that doesn't see the

455
00:27:25.880 --> 00:27:28.720
big picture. You know, they think you're crazy, they think

456
00:27:28.720 --> 00:27:31.519
you're a conspiracy theorist or whatever. But it's like, no,

457
00:27:31.720 --> 00:27:35.279
don't you see it? And that's what you know? Second grade,

458
00:27:35.359 --> 00:27:37.720
third grade, fourth grade, in my own experience, and why

459
00:27:37.920 --> 00:27:40.279
why doesn't the rest of the class see how stupid

460
00:27:40.279 --> 00:27:43.359
this is? Like this is you know, they're they're training

461
00:27:43.440 --> 00:27:45.880
us to be assembly line workers. This is not going

462
00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:49.839
to apply to me. But you know, if if you

463
00:27:49.920 --> 00:27:54.359
are in the category of you know, normal, you know,

464
00:27:54.480 --> 00:27:58.839
this just looks like, you know, what is happening for drivens?

465
00:27:59.279 --> 00:28:02.240
You know, for all uh, the ones like me and

466
00:28:02.279 --> 00:28:05.920
the ones like us. Don't you see how this and

467
00:28:05.960 --> 00:28:09.720
this and this can actually go together. This is like,

468
00:28:10.079 --> 00:28:15.240
this is catastrophe happening. And now with AI and the internet,

469
00:28:15.440 --> 00:28:18.200
you can see under the covers, you know what what

470
00:28:19.039 --> 00:28:21.640
other drivens you know, they're running big food and big

471
00:28:21.680 --> 00:28:25.920
farm and using quarterly report you know, quarterly justifications for

472
00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:28.279
profits and you've got to do it for the No,

473
00:28:28.359 --> 00:28:32.960
you're you're hurting a lot of people and you know,

474
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:36.680
as me compassionate mostly on the trauma healing path person,

475
00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:40.000
it's like, what are we going to do? You know?

476
00:28:40.039 --> 00:28:43.000
So it's it's really the drivens that are you know,

477
00:28:43.720 --> 00:28:46.079
both destroying the world, and I think we are the

478
00:28:46.079 --> 00:28:49.119
ones that can see it and make some changes. And

479
00:28:49.160 --> 00:28:52.680
so it's it's a it's important time for drivens to

480
00:28:53.160 --> 00:28:56.400
to get this message out and really start talking about

481
00:28:56.400 --> 00:28:57.400
what are we going to do?

482
00:28:58.200 --> 00:29:00.599
Mm hmm, Well, I think, you know, just starting to

483
00:29:00.640 --> 00:29:03.079
recognize that you are a driven I mean, so that

484
00:29:03.240 --> 00:29:06.319
was incredibly Just recognizing for me that I'm somewhere on

485
00:29:06.359 --> 00:29:11.720
that spectrum really was It's very It helped me understand

486
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:14.880
my life, my world, my choice is so much better

487
00:29:14.920 --> 00:29:18.319
and so that already is equipping me to create some

488
00:29:18.400 --> 00:29:22.880
of that necessary structure that we rebel against. So it's

489
00:29:23.519 --> 00:29:24.920
that's part of it. So I think your work is

490
00:29:24.960 --> 00:29:27.599
really important, just starting with the idea of helping aple

491
00:29:27.680 --> 00:29:29.799
to recognize if you're in this camp, if you're one

492
00:29:29.799 --> 00:29:32.720
of the if you're a wolf. So let's talk a

493
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:35.039
little bit about about, you know, this idea of burden

494
00:29:35.119 --> 00:29:38.000
and gifts. So first we've talked a lot about the burdens.

495
00:29:38.039 --> 00:29:41.680
I guess you know, we see, we care, we can,

496
00:29:41.759 --> 00:29:43.839
we can sense and take in an awful lot. That's

497
00:29:43.920 --> 00:29:47.039
part of the burden. Any other burdens you want a service,

498
00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:50.240
We're to talk about the gifts. Well, how long do

499
00:29:50.279 --> 00:29:50.519
we have?

500
00:29:50.599 --> 00:29:53.680
I very young? And then my interpretation of everything, so

501
00:29:54.160 --> 00:29:56.039
is it leed or is it gold? That the answer

502
00:29:56.119 --> 00:30:01.599
is yes, yeah, the alchemy model. But you know, hypersensitivity,

503
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:04.599
we are we are we are some really big hearted

504
00:30:04.640 --> 00:30:09.079
sensitive people. And you know the the r SKI or

505
00:30:09.119 --> 00:30:12.200
the you know, reactive abandonment stuff that we get into

506
00:30:12.319 --> 00:30:15.880
and this, you know, intense fear of rejection. This this,

507
00:30:16.960 --> 00:30:20.480
you know, one of the primary differences between sheep and

508
00:30:20.519 --> 00:30:24.880
wolves is really the cheaper herding animal h G r D.

509
00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:27.559
And you know what happens when a cheetah runs into

510
00:30:27.559 --> 00:30:31.400
a heard of gazelle's they scatter. Everybody's on your own,

511
00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:34.119
you know, And so you see that and everyone they're

512
00:30:34.119 --> 00:30:37.319
all scrambling into their own camps and everybody's splitting up.

513
00:30:38.319 --> 00:30:42.759
Where wolves are a pack animal, what happens when a

514
00:30:42.799 --> 00:30:45.079
bear attacks one of the wolves and a wolf pack

515
00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:48.319
is all of the other wolves coming come. And that's

516
00:30:48.319 --> 00:30:51.160
what drivens are really craving is somebody to have my back.

517
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:54.480
Of the hardest groups I've done is when you have

518
00:30:54.599 --> 00:30:58.519
six you have seven man you know, Navy seal teams

519
00:30:58.519 --> 00:31:00.920
and there's normally eight and ones miss saying man, those

520
00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:05.039
groups you know, where they've bless somebody. Just what drives

521
00:31:05.279 --> 00:31:09.759
Navy seals is love. And you know what drives a

522
00:31:09.960 --> 00:31:13.119
true and I work I get you know, I work

523
00:31:13.200 --> 00:31:16.119
with C suites primarily, and you know, when you get

524
00:31:16.160 --> 00:31:20.039
the C suite and most are drivens. Working as a

525
00:31:20.160 --> 00:31:25.240
true wolf pack, it is a cheat code. But if

526
00:31:25.279 --> 00:31:28.559
they're not working as atrual wolf pack, it is a

527
00:31:28.599 --> 00:31:31.440
match made in hell. So is it a gift or

528
00:31:31.559 --> 00:31:34.519
is it a curse? It is both. But you got

529
00:31:34.559 --> 00:31:37.359
to learn to really step out of that experience and

530
00:31:38.400 --> 00:31:42.920
you know, operationalize and create external to us what's missing

531
00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:48.039
internally and that that is structure and routine and you

532
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:50.079
know we have to create the executive feature out of

533
00:31:50.119 --> 00:31:50.920
our heads.

534
00:31:52.359 --> 00:31:54.640
Yeah, you know, this works. This has always worked best

535
00:31:54.640 --> 00:31:56.720
for me when I have you know, people on my

536
00:31:56.759 --> 00:31:58.680
team that can kind of help provide that and really

537
00:31:58.880 --> 00:32:02.880
like some tell me what to do. I mean, I

538
00:32:03.279 --> 00:32:05.640
need you to do these two things by nine o'clock. Okay,

539
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:08.839
I'll do that. It works, It really.

540
00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:14.799
Works, and it is it is a it is a

541
00:32:14.839 --> 00:32:18.480
farmer's world. It is their world. And you know, we

542
00:32:19.160 --> 00:32:23.240
by default are often put into positions of leadership because

543
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:26.200
we see the big picture. And you know, if we

544
00:32:26.279 --> 00:32:30.279
can train ourselves to actually let go of control. Most

545
00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:34.759
of us are pretty control freaky. It's just faster for

546
00:32:34.839 --> 00:32:38.640
me to do it myself. And that's not true. No,

547
00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:43.359
But clarification and teaching others how to really communicate with

548
00:32:43.480 --> 00:32:46.799
us and how to actually communicate with them in a

549
00:32:46.920 --> 00:32:49.559
way that is, you know, you don't need to explain

550
00:32:49.640 --> 00:32:51.839
the entire big picture. You just need to explain the

551
00:32:51.839 --> 00:32:55.319
little piece that they're responsible for. Task it to them,

552
00:32:55.680 --> 00:32:58.440
give them two weeks and then I'll come back. You know,

553
00:32:58.480 --> 00:33:01.000
an elon classic Drip and he's a little bit more

554
00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:05.119
on others. He's more on the spectrum some but he

555
00:33:05.240 --> 00:33:08.839
comes in once a month, you know, to each of

556
00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:12.240
his four primary platforms, looks at the big problem, gives it,

557
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:14.519
you know, the solution, and it gets out of the

558
00:33:14.599 --> 00:33:17.119
way and lets them work and comes back in three

559
00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:20.240
weeks and then and so that capacity to let go

560
00:33:20.400 --> 00:33:23.799
of control is something that drivens have to learn that

561
00:33:23.839 --> 00:33:28.599
doesn't come naturally to us. The meditation and all of

562
00:33:28.640 --> 00:33:34.160
the the deeper work comes in and so it's you know,

563
00:33:34.240 --> 00:33:37.839
and and religion is something that most of us have

564
00:33:37.960 --> 00:33:42.240
to struggle with as drivens because we really do have

565
00:33:42.319 --> 00:33:47.240
a strong distaste for hypocrisy. And so yes, they may

566
00:33:47.319 --> 00:33:50.200
be saying they're this and that and this, but we

567
00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:52.960
see right through them and it's like, yeah, but don't

568
00:33:53.000 --> 00:33:56.279
you see what a piece of crap, you really are, No,

569
00:33:56.480 --> 00:34:00.640
they don't where you know spirituality is something then you

570
00:34:00.680 --> 00:34:04.200
know the I always joke about that, it's not actually

571
00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:06.400
a joke, but you know, religion is for people that

572
00:34:06.440 --> 00:34:10.039
are scared of going to help. Spirituality for people that

573
00:34:10.079 --> 00:34:13.760
have been to hell. Most drivens have been to hell

574
00:34:14.159 --> 00:34:18.480
and so self created. And you know that the capacity

575
00:34:18.480 --> 00:34:21.199
to actually own your world and take responsibility as a

576
00:34:21.320 --> 00:34:24.519
driven for your own world and really embrace the spiritual

577
00:34:24.559 --> 00:34:29.159
path is that's where we turn into us potentially superheroes.

578
00:34:29.960 --> 00:34:31.840
Oh hang on to that thought. I want to die

579
00:34:31.840 --> 00:34:34.320
more into that. But let's grab our last break. I'm

580
00:34:34.320 --> 00:34:36.360
your host, doctor Realise Cortes, who are on there with

581
00:34:36.400 --> 00:34:39.199
doctor Doug Brackman. He's a psychologist that I am driven.

582
00:34:39.559 --> 00:34:42.079
He worked with highly driven leaders and other highly driven

583
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:45.280
people of an ADD and ADHD spectrum to help them

584
00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:48.159
stop their cycle of shame and self sabotage so they

585
00:34:48.159 --> 00:34:50.519
can achieve the success and happiness they were designed for.

586
00:34:51.159 --> 00:34:53.599
You've been noticing we've been talking a lot about both

587
00:34:53.719 --> 00:34:56.239
the gifts and the burdens of the driven. After the break,

588
00:34:56.239 --> 00:34:58.280
we are going to a little bit deeper into this world,

589
00:34:58.480 --> 00:35:01.519
talk about the responsibility of the driven and becoming carriers of

590
00:35:01.599 --> 00:35:02.800
healing and be right back.

591
00:35:18.840 --> 00:35:22.400
Doctor Elise Cortes is a management consultant specializing in meaning

592
00:35:22.440 --> 00:35:26.239
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author, she helps companies

593
00:35:26.320 --> 00:35:30.119
visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired

594
00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:34.159
leadership and meaning imfused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance, and

595
00:35:34.239 --> 00:35:37.480
commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to invite

596
00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:40.239
a lease to speak to your organization, please visit her

597
00:35:40.280 --> 00:35:43.519
at Elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get

598
00:35:43.559 --> 00:35:52.360
your employees working on purpose. This is working on Purpose

599
00:35:52.480 --> 00:35:55.719
with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today or

600
00:35:55.800 --> 00:35:58.519
to open a conversation with Elise, send an email to

601
00:35:58.599 --> 00:36:03.199
Alise al I se at a least Coortes dot com.

602
00:36:03.239 --> 00:36:05.360
Now back to working on Purpose.

603
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:11.480
Thanks for staying with us, and welcome back to working

604
00:36:11.519 --> 00:36:14.320
on Purpose. I'm your host, doctor Laice Cortes. If you

605
00:36:14.360 --> 00:36:16.360
are just now joining us, my guest is dog doctor

606
00:36:16.400 --> 00:36:20.280
Doug Brackman, the author of Driven, Understanding and Harnessing the

607
00:36:20.320 --> 00:36:23.760
Genetic Gifts shared by entrepreneurs, Navy Seals, pro athletes and

608
00:36:23.840 --> 00:36:26.280
maybe you, and also his latest one just coming out

609
00:36:26.280 --> 00:36:28.880
now sheep and wolves. Why is small percentage of the

610
00:36:28.920 --> 00:36:31.960
neurodiversent population. Maybe we're small for all the problems in

611
00:36:32.000 --> 00:36:35.360
the world and the solution. Okay, so that was really

612
00:36:35.360 --> 00:36:37.400
intriguing what you just teased us with on the just

613
00:36:37.440 --> 00:36:40.519
before the break, This idea of religion versus spirituality. It

614
00:36:40.559 --> 00:36:43.719
makes complete sense to me. I've never been drawn to religion.

615
00:36:44.440 --> 00:36:46.760
I've been exposed to several but never been drawn. None

616
00:36:46.760 --> 00:36:48.239
of them make any sense to me in terms of

617
00:36:48.599 --> 00:36:51.960
hanging on to that as the thing for me. But spirituality, yes,

618
00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:54.360
I think also the idea that we've gone through to

619
00:36:54.440 --> 00:36:56.840
hell and that makes a lot of sense to me

620
00:36:56.880 --> 00:37:00.440
as well. So very very interesting insights here that you're

621
00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:04.880
just dazzling me with. You mentioned also the responsibility of

622
00:37:04.920 --> 00:37:07.000
the driven, and I really thought this is important to

623
00:37:07.000 --> 00:37:09.440
talk about. You say in your the latest book that

624
00:37:09.840 --> 00:37:11.960
if you are driven, you will influence others. It's not

625
00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:14.920
a choice. So your intensity, perception, energy all shape the

626
00:37:14.920 --> 00:37:18.239
nervous systems around you. So let's talk a bit about

627
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:19.880
the responsibility of the driven.

628
00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:26.360
Well, it in my work with all the Navy seals,

629
00:37:26.559 --> 00:37:32.519
and we are good people and that that for the

630
00:37:32.559 --> 00:37:37.800
most part, And you know, the rationalization, justification. What gets

631
00:37:37.800 --> 00:37:41.760
in the way is the trauma, and trauma is uh,

632
00:37:42.119 --> 00:37:45.119
you know, well I don't have trauma. Everybody has trauma.

633
00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:48.400
That's you know semantically, I don't want to get into

634
00:37:48.760 --> 00:37:54.000
big trauma capital T versus low T whatever, but it

635
00:37:53.239 --> 00:37:56.840
it is what shapes the way we steer our ship.

636
00:37:57.360 --> 00:38:01.639
You know, it is this unconscious it's unconscious is not

637
00:38:01.719 --> 00:38:04.039
a mysteries right below your nose. It's all recorded in

638
00:38:04.079 --> 00:38:08.679
the body. And as you are, you know, you're not

639
00:38:08.840 --> 00:38:12.159
responsible for what happened to you, but you're responsible for

640
00:38:12.199 --> 00:38:16.880
the healing. You're responsible for you know, what happens. And

641
00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:21.280
I've worked with some pretty outrageous people that have you know,

642
00:38:22.239 --> 00:38:24.719
making lots of money. You know, back in the wild

643
00:38:24.800 --> 00:38:28.440
West of the early Internet, these guys were making money

644
00:38:28.440 --> 00:38:31.639
hand over fist, you know, selling all kinds of stuff

645
00:38:31.639 --> 00:38:34.360
to Grandma that gramma didn't need, and you know, getting

646
00:38:34.360 --> 00:38:37.480
their credit cards and you know they're not really hurting anybody,

647
00:38:39.440 --> 00:38:42.159
but they knew what was wrong, you know, and that

648
00:38:42.159 --> 00:38:49.280
that that justification, rationalization. And it's because largely, you know,

649
00:38:49.639 --> 00:38:52.320
the heart is is a trauma. It's an organ and

650
00:38:52.360 --> 00:38:55.840
it's it's a thinking machine. And lots of new research

651
00:38:55.920 --> 00:38:58.679
coming out about that gut and the heart. You're both thinking.

652
00:39:00.679 --> 00:39:03.599
But when you have a frozen heart or dorsally froze heart,

653
00:39:03.800 --> 00:39:08.440
you know, you're unaware of your impact on others, so

654
00:39:08.519 --> 00:39:12.239
to speak, but you know it on you, You know it,

655
00:39:12.320 --> 00:39:16.440
you knowwhere, and that fear of actually going on the

656
00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:22.119
inside and really taking responsibility for healing yourself. And I

657
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:24.960
say it in my new book very directly, it is

658
00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:28.400
not a choice. If you're driven, you know, it's just

659
00:39:28.440 --> 00:39:31.079
a matter of time before you get to a place

660
00:39:31.119 --> 00:39:35.480
where you know your world is falling apart and you

661
00:39:35.519 --> 00:39:38.719
can blame no one else. And one of the biggest

662
00:39:38.719 --> 00:39:43.360
differences between it makes me crazy about most of the world.

663
00:39:44.119 --> 00:39:49.440
Is this a thing called locus of control. And locus

664
00:39:49.440 --> 00:39:51.760
of control is the world happening to me or the

665
00:39:51.760 --> 00:39:54.760
world happening for me? And this is it my fault

666
00:39:55.280 --> 00:40:00.400
or is it your fault? And hurting animals or you know,

667
00:40:00.559 --> 00:40:06.960
farmers tend to actually have external locus of control. They really,

668
00:40:07.320 --> 00:40:09.960
you know, like to explain how the weather was bad

669
00:40:10.039 --> 00:40:12.079
and this with then and that's why the crops failed.

670
00:40:12.280 --> 00:40:15.199
We did everything what we did last year, just the same,

671
00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:18.599
and it just just happened. And so we're going to

672
00:40:18.760 --> 00:40:21.320
keep doing what we did again and again and again

673
00:40:21.719 --> 00:40:25.679
because it works, and that that model for the left

674
00:40:25.679 --> 00:40:30.719
pre funnel, that executive function tends to actually validate. You know,

675
00:40:30.760 --> 00:40:33.199
they it's not my fault. I get to blame them

676
00:40:33.360 --> 00:40:36.039
or blame them and blame them and blame them. But

677
00:40:36.119 --> 00:40:39.559
if you're a hunter like me and you're after a rabbit,

678
00:40:39.800 --> 00:40:43.360
there's no excuse why that rabbit got away except for me.

679
00:40:44.760 --> 00:40:49.119
And so drivens tend to have incredibly high locus of

680
00:40:49.239 --> 00:40:53.719
control and we actually think everything is our fault, and

681
00:40:53.800 --> 00:40:55.599
so we became this. You know, I could have called

682
00:40:55.599 --> 00:40:58.559
it the shame based identity, probably wouldn't have sold very many,

683
00:40:58.599 --> 00:41:03.599
but it is that, you know, feeling that, yeah, it's

684
00:41:03.639 --> 00:41:05.719
all my fault and I'm the biggest pizza crop in

685
00:41:05.719 --> 00:41:09.679
the world, and you know, and these are the addictive genetics.

686
00:41:10.320 --> 00:41:14.400
So it is the wonderful thing about locals of control

687
00:41:14.599 --> 00:41:19.880
is it's malleable, being that it's something that you can

688
00:41:20.039 --> 00:41:26.079
adjust appropriately because everything is both external and internal variables

689
00:41:27.079 --> 00:41:30.599
and there's a curiosity around that. That's the driven tree.

690
00:41:32.519 --> 00:41:35.760
It's much more difficult than I don't work with non drivens.

691
00:41:35.800 --> 00:41:41.079
I tend to struggle in that world because it's a

692
00:41:41.199 --> 00:41:43.719
I have a very dignals time with people that don't

693
00:41:43.760 --> 00:41:46.800
take high personal responsibility of.

694
00:41:46.840 --> 00:41:50.880
Their life, understand and speaking of that, part of what

695
00:41:50.920 --> 00:41:53.400
also drew me about what you're doing too is you

696
00:41:53.400 --> 00:41:55.719
have a whole section of becoming carriers of healing in

697
00:41:55.760 --> 00:41:58.719
this new book that you're putting out, and you talk

698
00:41:58.800 --> 00:42:01.039
about it. You say you don't heal others by teaching them.

699
00:42:01.079 --> 00:42:03.599
You heal them by being regulated in your own body,

700
00:42:03.679 --> 00:42:06.800
feeling your own pain instead of exporting it, slowing down

701
00:42:06.840 --> 00:42:09.400
instead of overriding. So all this is really it's really

702
00:42:09.480 --> 00:42:12.360
interesting to me, you know, at a time when you

703
00:42:12.360 --> 00:42:15.320
know technology and AI is surfacing so much in terms

704
00:42:15.360 --> 00:42:18.119
of who we are as humans, where we're distinct, et cetera.

705
00:42:18.199 --> 00:42:21.159
So I think this notion of becoming carriers of healing

706
00:42:21.320 --> 00:42:24.159
is really compelling and hard work.

707
00:42:25.280 --> 00:42:29.719
It really hard work, and it did. Classic example is

708
00:42:29.760 --> 00:42:32.719
the founder, you know, the founder's visionaries or whatever you

709
00:42:32.760 --> 00:42:35.320
want to call them, the startup guy who you know

710
00:42:35.480 --> 00:42:39.559
gets the gets the company going, and you were wired

711
00:42:39.639 --> 00:42:43.239
for that world because you're in survival mode. The company

712
00:42:43.320 --> 00:42:46.079
might go away, and but once you have a real

713
00:42:46.159 --> 00:42:49.320
company and it's running, and you're no longer in survival mode.

714
00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:54.800
They kick us out, you know they do, because that

715
00:42:55.039 --> 00:42:59.360
we're not we can't run at that speed anymore, and

716
00:42:59.400 --> 00:43:03.639
so that you know, fragility of what world we're in.

717
00:43:04.840 --> 00:43:08.360
But when I get my drivens to, you know, with

718
00:43:08.519 --> 00:43:13.239
work with trauma healing, breathwork, meditation and all of the

719
00:43:13.320 --> 00:43:16.599
amazing stuff that's happening in the trauma healing world, come

720
00:43:16.639 --> 00:43:22.280
out of survival mode. We come into companies and see

721
00:43:22.599 --> 00:43:26.599
things that we can create, environments that are absolutely magic

722
00:43:26.679 --> 00:43:31.719
to work in. Magic to work in. You've got to

723
00:43:31.760 --> 00:43:36.039
do the work first, otherwise otherwise it's you know, as

724
00:43:36.119 --> 00:43:39.760
Peter Levine always said, you know, trauma is like tuberculosis.

725
00:43:39.800 --> 00:43:43.039
It just wants to spread. You know, hurt people, hurt people,

726
00:43:44.239 --> 00:43:49.280
heal people also heal people. So healing is also just

727
00:43:49.360 --> 00:43:52.559
as infectious. And you know, the guys that I have

728
00:43:52.679 --> 00:43:56.360
worked with for years that are in these companies that

729
00:43:56.400 --> 00:43:59.440
they run, you know, people love them because it's a

730
00:43:59.480 --> 00:44:02.760
wolf pack. I got it.

731
00:44:03.320 --> 00:44:05.519
Well, we're coming closer to the end of the end.

732
00:44:05.519 --> 00:44:07.440
I've just show and I don't want to leave people

733
00:44:07.440 --> 00:44:11.519
without some hope here, some possibility here besides calling you

734
00:44:11.519 --> 00:44:14.320
and working with you. You say that the first step

735
00:44:14.320 --> 00:44:16.360
in taking charge of your genetics is building the right

736
00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:19.280
environment for your personality, giving you the structure that you need.

737
00:44:19.320 --> 00:44:21.400
And I really could relate to that point. I could

738
00:44:21.440 --> 00:44:23.360
relate to that. So if you could talk a bit

739
00:44:23.400 --> 00:44:26.800
more about helping what they help, giving them some reins

740
00:44:26.840 --> 00:44:30.280
to be able to take a good, healthy control over

741
00:44:30.320 --> 00:44:30.800
their lives.

742
00:44:32.119 --> 00:44:38.400
It is immediately what comes to mind is good enough

743
00:44:39.159 --> 00:44:43.880
is not a feeling. And for drivens, if you're hearing this,

744
00:44:44.039 --> 00:44:48.639
that that is like that kick be profound. Nothing will

745
00:44:48.679 --> 00:44:52.280
ever feel good enough to a driven And that's the

746
00:44:52.360 --> 00:44:56.440
joke about my doctoral dissertation. It never felt good enough.

747
00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:00.960
Iris shook my hand, grounding doctor, first guy would ever

748
00:45:01.000 --> 00:45:04.400
call me a doctor. My inner experience was in my

749
00:45:04.639 --> 00:45:07.719
monkey mind said haha, he bought it. You know, I

750
00:45:07.719 --> 00:45:11.920
got the joke is is it was? It was good enough.

751
00:45:12.199 --> 00:45:15.559
It's on the wall. It was a check mark, you know.

752
00:45:15.719 --> 00:45:20.079
And so learning how to actually not use our emotion

753
00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:22.880
to steer the world as the primary thing I got

754
00:45:22.880 --> 00:45:25.280
to hear. As you're a driven, then you got to create,

755
00:45:25.320 --> 00:45:30.599
you know, an external way of validating what is good enough.

756
00:45:31.199 --> 00:45:35.280
You know, finance, romance and health very simply. You know,

757
00:45:35.800 --> 00:45:39.719
it's my finances good enough, which means I'm not struggling

758
00:45:39.760 --> 00:45:42.039
with my paying my mortgage and my basic needs are met,

759
00:45:42.039 --> 00:45:46.679
and you know that's a actual external thing. How you

760
00:45:46.719 --> 00:45:51.280
feel about it can then be separate. And health. You know,

761
00:45:51.360 --> 00:45:53.519
I never felt like I was healthy enough and wound

762
00:45:53.599 --> 00:45:57.119
up doing eleven years of iron Man triathlons the crap

763
00:45:57.159 --> 00:46:01.039
out of my body. And it is you know, the

764
00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:04.079
magic two seconds when you cross the finish line of

765
00:46:04.079 --> 00:46:05.920
an iron Man and then you turn around and look

766
00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:09.119
at the time and then all of a sudden, ah good.

767
00:46:10.360 --> 00:46:13.400
And so that capacity to separate, that is the real

768
00:46:13.440 --> 00:46:16.840
message for if you want to start this driven healing

769
00:46:16.880 --> 00:46:21.199
process is create reality jets. You know, my exercise is

770
00:46:21.199 --> 00:46:24.199
good enough, my health is good enough and can always

771
00:46:24.199 --> 00:46:27.360
be better, and my finances are good enough and can

772
00:46:27.400 --> 00:46:30.519
be better. You know, I'm not trying to get rid

773
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:33.760
of this internal feeling that you know it's not enough,

774
00:46:34.679 --> 00:46:36.880
and I think you know, big food, big farmer need

775
00:46:36.960 --> 00:46:40.559
to actually create that as a model. Rather than more

776
00:46:40.679 --> 00:46:43.559
is better, it's not more money is not better.

777
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:49.599
Two more questions here, So briefly, how do you help

778
00:46:49.679 --> 00:46:52.599
support people? I know, I've looked at your linked profile

779
00:46:52.599 --> 00:46:55.159
on your website various ways you can work with people,

780
00:46:55.159 --> 00:46:57.000
But for listeners and viewers who don't know, how do

781
00:46:57.039 --> 00:47:00.079
you help support people on their journey?

782
00:47:01.000 --> 00:47:04.920
Yeah, I'm a clinician. I'm one on one is That's

783
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:09.440
where my magic is. Obviously you can't scale that, and

784
00:47:09.480 --> 00:47:12.639
I've had multiple attempts to scale, you know, and I

785
00:47:13.239 --> 00:47:16.159
call it scale porn. You know that everybody's got a scale. No,

786
00:47:16.280 --> 00:47:20.639
you don't. You know, you don't. My group Dynamics and

787
00:47:20.760 --> 00:47:24.679
we heal in groups and driven men run men's groups,

788
00:47:24.679 --> 00:47:28.360
and I love it. I absolutely love that. One of

789
00:47:28.440 --> 00:47:31.599
my favorite things to do is I'm meditation teacher, been

790
00:47:31.599 --> 00:47:35.079
teaching meditation for twenty years, and I teach meditation at gunpoint,

791
00:47:36.119 --> 00:47:39.840
and working with Randy Kelly, we came up with a

792
00:47:39.920 --> 00:47:43.800
way of actually, very simply to understand meditation at gunpoint

793
00:47:44.280 --> 00:47:46.599
is I integrated long range shooting. We shoot out to

794
00:47:46.639 --> 00:47:51.320
a mile seventeen and eighty yards, but very big guns,

795
00:47:52.239 --> 00:47:54.960
and there is no recoil in the present and so

796
00:47:55.000 --> 00:47:58.280
if you're anticipating recoil and you're scared, you're not present.

797
00:47:59.159 --> 00:48:02.440
So learning how who actually disinhibit the body and soften

798
00:48:02.639 --> 00:48:06.280
into One of my favorite names for God. There's forty

799
00:48:06.320 --> 00:48:08.280
three names for God in the Bible. One of them

800
00:48:08.400 --> 00:48:12.639
is presence, divine presence and being able to really harness

801
00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:16.920
that gift. Presence and disinhibiting the body is the core

802
00:48:17.119 --> 00:48:22.719
beginning place where trama healing is and then you know

803
00:48:22.800 --> 00:48:26.639
you can actually touch your potential. And that's the greatest

804
00:48:26.679 --> 00:48:31.159
fear of every driven is really really embracing what we

805
00:48:31.239 --> 00:48:35.480
can do with this way we're wired. It makes most

806
00:48:35.519 --> 00:48:40.519
of my guys cry. And as a driven woman to you,

807
00:48:41.199 --> 00:48:45.119
every single time I've done this, I've had brand new shooters,

808
00:48:45.159 --> 00:48:47.920
have brand new women who have never shot a gun,

809
00:48:48.199 --> 00:48:51.519
outshoot twenty five year baby sealed veteran snipers.

810
00:48:51.800 --> 00:48:53.199
So I read that in your book. I thought that

811
00:48:53.239 --> 00:48:53.760
was amazing.

812
00:48:54.559 --> 00:48:58.960
It's yeah, driven women are often joke. If I can

813
00:48:59.000 --> 00:49:01.199
get a thousand of you guys together, all healed up,

814
00:49:01.280 --> 00:49:04.679
you guys will run the world.

815
00:49:03.400 --> 00:49:09.079
I mean, sounds good to me. Please so we' we

816
00:49:09.239 --> 00:49:11.280
have gotten to the end. Who already, Doug, It is

817
00:49:11.320 --> 00:49:14.320
such an honor and just amazing to get to learn

818
00:49:14.360 --> 00:49:16.039
from you, to read your books, to have gone through

819
00:49:16.079 --> 00:49:18.400
your assessment and have you on the air and sharing

820
00:49:18.440 --> 00:49:20.599
with my listeners around the globe. Thank you so much

821
00:49:20.599 --> 00:49:21.840
for coming and working on a purpose.

822
00:49:22.360 --> 00:49:26.280
I had a blast. Yet. You're welcome, very welcome. Anytime.

823
00:49:26.440 --> 00:49:27.199
It's do it again.

824
00:49:27.559 --> 00:49:29.559
Absolutely you can rub which you can't I from me now,

825
00:49:30.440 --> 00:49:32.039
All right, listeners and viewers, you are going to want

826
00:49:32.079 --> 00:49:34.039
to learn more about doctor Doug Brackman, the work he

827
00:49:34.119 --> 00:49:37.079
does with highly Driven and his books Driven and Sheep

828
00:49:37.079 --> 00:49:39.239
and Wolves. You can start by visiting his website. It's

829
00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:42.760
very simple. It is I am Driven dot com. Last

830
00:49:42.800 --> 00:49:44.280
week and you missed the live show, you can always

831
00:49:44.320 --> 00:49:46.639
catch it be your recording podcast. We were on air

832
00:49:46.639 --> 00:49:49.960
with you Dira Carro, the author of Hardcore Soft Skills,

833
00:49:50.000 --> 00:49:52.440
A guy to work with humans. We talked about how

834
00:49:52.480 --> 00:49:55.039
and why learning what have been called soft skills makes

835
00:49:55.039 --> 00:49:58.000
such a difference in motivating and engaging teams and nobody

836
00:49:58.000 --> 00:50:00.440
is some of the several core soft skills sheet teachers.

837
00:50:01.360 --> 00:50:05.199
See you next week for another nourishing conversation to create

838
00:50:05.239 --> 00:50:07.719
destination workplaces where people actually want to come to work

839
00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:10.039
and give their best. Let's work on purpose.

840
00:50:13.519 --> 00:50:16.159
We hope you've enjoyed this week's program. Be sure to

841
00:50:16.199 --> 00:50:19.880
tune into Working on Purpose, featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes,

842
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:23.199
each week on W four C. Why Together, We'll create

843
00:50:23.239 --> 00:50:27.360
a world where business operates conscientiously. Leadership inspires and passion

844
00:50:27.400 --> 00:50:30.480
performance and employees are fulfilled in work that provides the

845
00:50:30.559 --> 00:50:33.880
meaning and purpose they crave. See you there, Let's work

846
00:50:33.960 --> 00:50:34.639
on Purpose.