Saving Lives: Unveiling and Addressing the Silent Epidemic of Loneliness

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W FOURCY Radio. What's Working on
Purpose? Anyway? Each week we ponder

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the answer to this question. People
ache for meaning and purpose at work,

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to contribute their talents passionately and know
their lives really matter. They crave being

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part of an organization that inspires them
and helps them grow into realizing their highest

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potential. Business can be such a
force for good in the world, elevating

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humanity. In our program, we
provide guidance and inspiration to help usher in

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this world we all want Working on
Purpose. Now, here's your host,

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Doctor Relise Cortez. Welcome back to
the Working in Purpose Program. Thanks for

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tuning again this week. Great to
have you. This show has been on

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air since February of twenty fifteen and
is a pride and joy for me.

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I am your host doctor at least
Cortes. If we have not met before

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and you don't know me, I'm
an organizational psychologist and loco therapist, speaker

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and author. My team and I
at Gusto Now help companies to enliven and

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fortify their operations by articulating their purpose
and building inspirational leaders and cultures activated by

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meeting and purpose to turn those companies
from a flatline EKG to a vibrant destination

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workplace. There people are intrinsically motivated
to perform at their best, can grow

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into their fuller potential, and are
committed to stay and I'm deliver on the

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company's mission. You can learn more
about us and how we can work together

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at gustodashnow dot com or my personal
website at Leastcortes dot com. Now,

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let's get in today's program with us
Today. Is Jinyinshin, a mental wellness

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coach and entrepreneur and president and co
founder of Pensive, where they use perspective

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and reflection to strengthen mental health.
His calling in life is to help prevent

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suicides as a mental health entrepreneur,
he is one of many who are trying

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to help destigmatize mental health. As
a coach, he explores where loneliness has

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disconnected us from the communities we love
and provides language to reconnect. Joined today

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from Denver, Colorado, Ginion,
Welcome to Working on Purpose. Hi,

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thanks so much for having me.
I'm so excited to be here. I

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am thrilled to have you, my
friend, and I really applaud and embrace

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what you're doing with your one precious
life working on this. So thank you

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for that. Thank you for being
in service, being obedient to your purpose.

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It's not always easy, right,
definitely. Well, let's dive in

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straight away here to get our listeners
and viewers present to what we're so focused

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on improving. You shared with me
that doctor Vivic Murphy, who is the

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former US Surgeon General, raised the
alarm on the loneliest epidemic. What does

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that mean? What are we talking
about here? Oh man, we are

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diving right in. I'm so excited
to do that. Before I do,

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I just want to take a moment
to just honor you, doctor, at

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least a book that I really enjoy
an author I guess by extension. I

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really enjoy It's good to Great by
Jim Collins, right, and he provides

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excellent commentary on a lot of research
on you know, the power that the

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long like the longevity that companies have
when they can align their values with their

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mission, with their leaders. Right. And you give those people, you

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know, a platform two for us
to get to listen to and examine how

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are people really doing that and executing
that. So while there are excellent comment

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commentators like Jim Collins or even podcasts
out there that listen in or just kind

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of provide their commentary and how businesses
are formed, that you give us a

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chance to listen to the creators themselves. And so, yeah, thank you

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for this platform as a listener and
a fan, and I'm absolutely honored to

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get to be here and talk about
this topic that I'm so very passionate about.

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Thank you, Jin and that so
beautiful, Thank you for those beautiful

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words. Thank you absolutely so.
Yeah, let's talk about loneliness. It's

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a tough subject, so all of
listeners, hold on, we're gonna go

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for quiet the ride today. But
yeah, loneliness, how I like to

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define it is, it's this feeling
you feel when your experience and it's underlying

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feelings disqualify you from belonging, and
the epidemic manifests by disconnecting us from our

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communities and starving our need for social
interaction. I think we'll end up talking

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about how that's actually coming to,
like what outcomes that is manifesting in a

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minute. But something that I want
to highlight is the underlying feelings. As

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much as we hate to deny that
they bother us or they influence us,

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they're critical because at the end of
the day, they are the evidence we

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have the claim that no one can
relate to an experience we've gone through,

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and by the flip side, how
people can relate to us, how we

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can find a way to find commonality, find a way that we are not

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alone. So yeah, I'm going
to talk about feelings a lot today,

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but I promise if you stay with
me, my goal is just to provide

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language where you can talk to your
peers and your family and your friends about

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it. So yeah, that's kind
of a definition I like to work with.

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Awesome definition, and thank you.
Feelings are completely great with me.

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They're part of my world too,
So I'm okay with that. Awesome All

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right. Well, this is a
show called Working on Purpose, and some

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people when they come on are absolutely
governed and delivering and serving from their purpose.

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And you have a calling to help
prevent suicides in this loneliness epidemic time.

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So of course one of the things, one of the results of loneliness,

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tragic results, is suicide. Yeah, and I heard you say in

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one of the talks that I watched
on YouTube that it's one of suicide one

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of the top causes of death for
people one to forty four, among a

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couple others. Yes, what are
the others? And then let's let's kind

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of get into the numbers here.
What are we talking about. Yeah,

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let's let's talk about it because this
is the darkest part and then we can

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start to shed light into it.
That's right. Yeah, the top three

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causes of death, and the CDC
they published this between the ages of one

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and forty four to kind of represent
the average half life. And we'll talk

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about, you know, longevity in
a minute, but that between one and

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forty four, the top three causes
of death are first drug overdoses, second

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suicide, and third car accidents.
Right, that's been true since twenty thirteen.

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I believe then. You know,
it used to be car accidents,

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right, something that was something that
we were wielding and something that we needed

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to teach each other and ourselves how
to control. But you know, if

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we don't start doing that, teaching
each other how to control our mental health

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and how to check in on it. Right, these numbers about drug overdoses

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and suicides, I'm afraid are only
going to go up. We expand that

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now we take the age range off, right, you introduce eight more leading

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causes of death that I largely qualify
as biological decline. Right, it's a

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heart disease, seizures, liver failure, kidney failure. You'll introduce more biological

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decline, but those top three are
still right there, the only other edition

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being COVID. So yeah, even
when you zoom out and you look at

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life expectancy in the United States,
right, it's in the top four if

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you zoom out just a little bit. One of the things I did do

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a little research with the Center for
Disease Control and Prevention, and I saw

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that they said they were looking at
twenty twenty one and they said twelve point

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three million adults seriously thought about suicide. Three point five million adults made a

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plan and one point seven million adults
attempted suicide, and then it goes on

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to say that forty one hundred and
eighty three people died by suicide in the

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United States in twenty twenty one.
And just even just thinking, if even

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contemplating it, I just wanted just
presence, the compassionate and empathy that I

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want to extend anyone who's felt that
way. Yeah, definitely. It's you

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know, we talk about it in
terms of outcomes, and I think that's

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kind of where I'm trying to shed
light onto. This is before the outcomes,

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Right, there's there's a journey to
disconnect, and if you kind of

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feel like you might be in that
space, gosh, I want you to

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know that there are so many people
who have devoted their lives to finding you

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wherever you are. There are full
on institutions. Yeah, there are so

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many people that have devoted their lives
into therapy, into practices because they've been

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inspired by something that you felt.
So even if it's hard for you to

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believe that you are not alone,
yeah, stay stay with us here today,

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and I hope that I can shed
some light into your situation. Wherever

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you are, and if you're not
in that situation. Yeah, I think

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I really believe we'll be able to
help us kind of increase your empathy,

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how to how to kind of identify
this around your communities too well. One

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of the things that I have really
gotten privy to over the years of hosting

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the show Jinian in my own research, is that very often you know our

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own story, whether whether it's what
we've gone through or what we've found meaningful

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in life, can lead us to
our purpose. And you, of course

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have your own story and connection to
loneliness. Let's talk a little bit about

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you. Yeah, it's like for
you to navigate life. Yeah, for

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sure. The journey to where I
have arrived is largely based on lived experience,

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right. So, I remember in
seventh grade it was my I was

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on this journey of wondering what time
was. And if you have any kids

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who say that, just know that
they're kind of going down a dark path.

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One day I found it. I
was laying in bed with my eyes

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closed, just trying to clear my
mind, and I suddenly just had I

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don't know, I feel like I
just was able to identify the absence of

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time, that being death, all
right, And I was so scared by

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that that what followed was about one
year of crying myself to sleep every night,

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and yeah, just wondering, why
does anything that I do matter in

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this absolute blip of time that I'll
have in relation to history. Yeah,

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That's what I was thinking about in
middle school. And I was just thinking

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at the time, like, there's
no way anybody's thinking about this, and

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I can't tell anyone that. And
eventually what pulled me out was this just

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kind of like resignation to well,
there's still a lot of life to live,

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so you might as well try to, you know, be curious about

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maybe let's start small, what makes
life worth living for other people? And

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sure enough, I have now spent
just one on one time with hundreds,

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truly hundreds of people to where I've
just always been asking, like what makes

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life worth living? Through that,
I've learned that we're all on this never

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ending search for what we want in
return for our time, and what makes

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that hard is well, along this
journey, we all have times and we

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feel lonely and disconnect from our surroundings
where it's uncomfortable to just be. When

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we're uncomfortable being that's that's when we
feel alone. Right, that's the difference

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between loneliness and solitude where you can
find great comfort and being by yourself.

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But at that discomfort and being by
yourself that such a such a fine line

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we can slide into. So yeah, I can, I can expand there,

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but happy to have you to pause
there too. Well. I want

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to just really first acknowledge and celebrate
you as someone who is so thoughtful.

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I don't know of any seventh graders
who were wondering about time. I mean,

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I'm just gobsmacked that that's where your
mind and heart and soul were at

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that time. And I have to
say, I'm you know, you're a

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philosopher, and that voice of yours, my friend, was beautiful. But

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when you when you say the you
know, it encourage you that the absence

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of time would be death. That
is incredibly I don't know, smacking,

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it's just it really is so So
I just really want to acknowledge your journey,

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your very unique journey. You also
talk a little bit, You're welcome

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also talk a little bit too.
It just the pressures of what it was

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to be raised as a Korean young
man, and you know that went along

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with that too, with maybe just
say a little bit about that as well.

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Yeah, for sure. It is
certainly part of the I think,

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Korean American experience, and I haven't
gotten to confirm this much except through this

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blog post. I've had a few
people reach out to me, and that

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is just in the Korean culture,
pressure produces diamonds. It's like the one

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unyielding law. So the only way
that I could ever relieve myself from that

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pressure and defend myself was by being
the best. So it was always about,

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you know, I played a couple
of instruments, and I needed to

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be first chair in everything. I
needed to qualify for a masterclass on the

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piano. I needed to be school
president, I needed to be all these

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things. And yeah, that I
think is also why I get so nervous

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around cameras and audio equipment because for
me, growing up, cameras and audio

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equipment was filming practice, and my
mom would film practice so I could review

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it and it was just, you
know, just nitpicking, and that that

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would get really tough, especially in
this time where I'm wondering why does anything

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that I do matter? Yeah,
so, yeah, yeah, that was

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a pretty rough, pretty rough kind
of Yeah, a lot of a lot

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of different kinds of pressures pressing on
you know, what's the point of life

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at that point? Yeah? Oh, all right, well, let's do

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this geny, and let's let our
let our listeners and viewers let this sink

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in and maybe consider for themselves sometimes
in their lives when things really got incredibly

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overwhelming or they wondered what's it all
for? And take our first break.

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I'm your host, Doctor Lee's Protest. We've been on air with Ginia and

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Shin. He's the president and co
founder of Pensive, where they use perspective

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and reflection to strengthen mental health.
We've been talking about the seriousness and pervasiveness

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of the loneliness epidemic and some of
the ramifications like suicide and other things.

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After the Rick, we're going to
get into this notion of being able to

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get more present to our feelings,
to understand what's under that data that comes

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with them. Stay with this,
will be right back. Doctor Elise Cortes

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is a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author,

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she helps companies visioneer for a greater
purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired

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leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate
fulfillment, performance and commitment within the workforce.

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To learn more or to invite a
lease to speak to your organization,

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please visit her at Elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to get your

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employees working on purpose. This is
working on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes.

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To reach our program today or to
open a conversation with Elise, send an

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email to Alise Alise at eliscortes dot
com. Now back to working on Purpose.

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Thanks for staying with us, and
welcome back to working on Purpose.

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I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes, as I am dedicated to helping create

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a world where people realize potential at
work, are led by inspirational leaders that

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help them find and contribute their greatness. And we do business at Betters the

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World, which is some of the
things that Ginuin had said before. I

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needed to research and write my own
books, So one of my latest came

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out in March of twenty twenty three. It's called The Great Revitalization. How

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activating meeting and purpose can radically enliven
your business, and I wrote it to

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help the readers understand the lay of
today's workforce, What do they want and

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need to be meaningfully engaged and stick
around? And then I provide twenty two

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best practices to you create a culture
to to presence that for them. You

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can learn more about it at my
website at a Leastquortes dot com or just

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00:17:07.119 --> 00:17:10.599
go on Amazon for your copy if
you are just joining us. My guest

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is Ginya and Shin. He's a
mental health mental wellness coach and an entrepreneur

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at Pensive, where they use perspective
and reflection to strengthen mental health. His

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calling in life is to help prevent
suicides. As a mental health entrepreneur,

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he is one of many who are
trying to help destigmatize mental health. As

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a coach, he explores where onliness
has disconnected us from munities we love and

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provides the language to reconnect. Beautiful, Okay, now let's get back to

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those those those feelings that you talked
about. I too, I too work

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in the feeling space, and so
I appreciate this, and I really really

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this is one of the reasons I
keep hosting the show giniin is that I

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learned so much from my guests.
And I had told you that I had

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had somebody else on the program before
who was using they were tracking mood to

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try to address mental health and wellbeing, and you indicated that your research is

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it's more are useful to focus on
feelings. So if we could talk about

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what's the difference and why are is
it more effective to focus on feelings?

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Yes, yes, yes, oh
man, allow me to begin with that

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slightly snarky, satirical comment. Okay, let's do it. One day,

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everybody is going to turn ten years
old and you're going to realize that life

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cannot be categorized into five moods.
I'm seeing these five moods like everywhere now.

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I see them in journaling apps,
I see them in the Apple Health

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Kit, and to try to do
so, I think it's just reductive to

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a point that's self inflicting. A
great we experience just nuance in life,

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and frankly, nuance is where we
find the inspiration to take the next act

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to better ourselves. Like take nostalgia
for example. Right for me, that's

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some aggregate of like a light shade
of sadness and a deeper sense of joy

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and combined it's it's quite fulfilling,
and it inspires me to seek out new

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experiences that might make some sort of
feeling concoction that's fulfilling or like you know,

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close to as fulfilling is whatever I
was originally nostalgic about. And there's

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just no way I could reduce that
into a singular a singular mood I think

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to consistently do so would make me
feel like I have to I have to

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be happy or I'm failing, and
that disincentivizes engaging with life with a curiosity

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that has like you know, long
term questions. If I'm always just having

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to face at the end of the
day of today I'm sad or today I'm

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angry, it's just kind of telling
myself I've failed to be happy. And

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that's that that has been confirmed by
you know, a lot of the mental

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health practitioners I work with. They
might ask how your mood is in an

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introductory meeting, But all these therapy
clinics I see more and more they have

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feelings, wheels everywhere, because life
is nuanced, and that's how we make

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meaning out of life is exploring that
we want. So, yeah, I

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do have a little personal vendetta against
mood trackers, but I don't it's not

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as uncommon in the field that I
originally thought it was. I really appreciate

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that explanation, and we align so
much to you and so much just quickly

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of what I've come to see that
is part of my work in helping activate

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meaning and purpose in organizations and the
people along the way their own individual transformation

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journey is. You know, we
start off in life being able to access

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a hole gamut of the human emotional
spectrum. We're angry, we're joyous,

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we're sad, we're frustrated, we're
all these things. And you know,

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as life goes on and we learn, you know, we're not supposed to

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share all these feelings, and then
life stumps on us. And then so

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by the time I meet somebody in
their thirties or forties, they went from

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this huge emotional spectrum down to about
something small like this. So then my

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job is partly to help them open
that's get back up again so they can

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experience the wild wonder of life and
therefore be able to access their sources of

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inspiration and create something and connect beautifully
in a way that they couldn't if they're

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just working from that teeny little slice
of emotions. We are so aligned it

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beautifully said. Yeah, yes,
yes, I heard you talk about this

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recent on a recent episode, and
I was just I was just stopping the

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floor and clapping. Uh so,
yeah, good good. I love that.

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Well, we're we're we're we're going
arm in arm here in this world.

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Yes, absolutely, Well, I
really enjoyed reading. I read a

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couple of your blogs as well in
preparation for this conversation, and one of

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the blogs that you have contains a
passage I wanted you to expand on because

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it really caught my attention. It
might be related to what we're just now

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talking about, but you were saying, as we move through life, between

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our conditions and our circumstances, we
keep looking for significant consequences that contain an

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AHA moment that complete the puzzle of
self actualization. Somewhere in this process,

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typically at the reflection stage, Aha, we have found the final piece that

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makes all the pieces make sense.
We know we have reached self actualization through

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some version of I had to go
through blank to become someone blank. So

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I'm interested because I do some kind
of an exercise like this too. How

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and why is this important to mental
health and well being? Yeah? That

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is so loaded and it is.
It is very well aligned with what you

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were just talking about. You had
mentioned, you know, conditions and circumstances,

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right circumstances. They can sometimes force
us to retool our conditions. Maybe

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we were once much more expressive and
today we are less. Or sometimes they

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can force us into situations where,
you know, our priorities sometimes feel like

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a forced hand, and that changes
the conditions of our hearts as well.

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If I can use a little bit
of an illustration, I like to imagine

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life like one big house. This
is going to maybe hopefully tie together some

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of the things I was talking about
before with all these one on one conversations.

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But I've been very, very blessed
and privileged to get to or in

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this house. I should say,
everybody gets one room. We all get

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the same size room because we all
get twenty four hours in a day.

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And I have been very blessed and
privileged to get to be welcomed into many

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rooms. I have seen the accolades
on their mantles, and the achievements on

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the walls, the pictures, the
names that correspond with people's names on the

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chairs every once in a while,
the shames that are tucked away in their

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vaults, and what I have learned
is the things that people are collecting and

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truly most proud of are those pictures
on the walls. But those are the

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moments they're trying to relive. And
rarely do I see a wall full of

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just happiness. There's trials, there's
overcoming, there are low points, because

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people want to remember what they came
from and how far the journey was.

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And that's when I came up with
this idea that, oh, I don't

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think life is about happiness. I
think life is about moments of astonishment,

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to these moments that make us say
aha in life. And my evidence for

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that is because when I ask people
about those aha moments, and I say,

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if you got to know that at
a previous point in life, right

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before all the trials and adversity,
would you have liked to have known?

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And the answer is always no.
Sometimes I hear somebody say, I don't

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want my kids to go through that. But my journey is what's made me

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who I am today. How it
relates to how can we get ahead of

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that right? How can we apply
that to our mental health and our mental

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well being. The toughest thing that
I face when I am just coaching people

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one on one about mental health is
breaking this concept of happiness being the end

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all, be all goal of your
well being. Right, I'd like to

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live with my own mantra like,
don't live life with the luxury of knowing

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you're going to live tomorrow. But
at the same time, you know,

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have goals that are aligned with who
you think you can be. Right,

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That's that's how you maintain your integrity
on the outside at least, and then

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how that affects the inside the mentals
that that will start to foster a curiosity

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for meaning and purpose being where there
is an acceptance for not having all the

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answers. Right, You've got to
get to that point of not having all

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the answers in peace, at that
point to where you can actually start to

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get ahead of your mental health and
say, oh, you know, I'm

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waiting for my AHA moment. That's
all this is. And if I can

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be present in this right now,
I think it, I'll only get there

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sooner. So then that's where I
also pulled out this definition of mental health

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is I think at its simplest form, your mental health is your ability to

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be present. That's it, Right, And I listen to people talk about

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mental illness versus mental health or mental
health problems and gore chronic mental health problems,

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and it's all it's all a lot
of concentric circles. The way I

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like to put it is, mental
illness are people. People who have mental

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illnesses are people who are at a
chemical disadvantage of being present, and mental

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health is something we all have to
fight with, to battle with to be

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present. There's so much going on
all the time now when we are all

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looking at screens for what at least
six hours a day. Yeah, mental

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health is absolutely something we need to
just work into our regular vocabulary and then

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have the empathy and sympathy for people
who have mental illnesses. So yeah,

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I kind of spun out there,
but yeah, that's I hope I was

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able to touch on just you know
how like happiness and aha moments have their

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own moments or have their own I
guess, influence on just being present in

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the day to day staff. That
was beautifully presenced, beautifully Okay, So

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that takes me where we wanted to
go to where I wanted to go next

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anyway, And that is you really
served up for us this notion the importance

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of being aware of yourself and your
feelings and such. So I want to

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get you to talk a little bit
about and you've you know, your own

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journey and what you're created will help
us get I think, get access in

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a more fresh way. But how
can we start to increase our awareness for

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our conditions and circumstances in a way
that can positively impact our our mental health

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and well beings. So I be
interested from the individual standpoint, and then,

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of course, how can we help
others around us? Yeah? Great

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question, great question. I like
that this really grounds as back to like

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like one hundred level concepts where I
feel like I was just kind of in

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a very theoretical space. I loved
it, yummy, but yeah, just

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in the very practical sense. A
word that I think is like being thrown

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around in a very positive, well
intentioned way is mindfulness. And then I

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think we get a little lost as
far as what mindfulness is and how it

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takes shape. But mindfulness I like
to define as practicing being present and then

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within that, there are two forms
of mindfulness, two kind of categories.

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The first one is reductive mindfulness.
Reductive mindfulness are things like yoga, meditation,

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exercise. If you think about all
the noise we feel in life,

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right, it kind of cuts out
a lot of the noise and it helps

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us feel centered again. That's how
people often feel after experiencing or practicing reductive

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mindfulness, and an additive mindfulness is
when you're taking whatever is left and you

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are creating meaning, you're searching the
meaning of what's left. This is things

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like therapy, like reflecting in a
small group like Bible studies, men's groups,

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women's groups, or journaling. And
actually a friend of mine who's also

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a pastor, he put this so
well. He said he encourages journaling for

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people because it's it's the last step
where when you get through it, it

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feels like taking rocks out of a
backpack. You feel this immense sense of

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peace when you do face whatever feelings
are left and you're able to find a

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meaning in them. Yeah, some
people are able to do that just kind

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of reflecting by themselves in a journal
or in a sanctuary like a church,

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and other people they prefer more of
an exchange, right, so they'll enter

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therapy or small groups like I had
mentioned. So those are some practical ways

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that. Yeah, I think that
if you have a good combination of reductive

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and additive mindfulness techniques, and you
will always be able to just say,

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hey, I'm not feeling very present. Here's something I can just try out

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for myself real quick and set myself. That's beautiful. Really like that reductive

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and additive techniques. Okay, so
we were talking about increasing awareness for our

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own mental health and wellbeing. I
don't think we can really not talk about

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the impact of social media on this
frontier. And I was really quite astonished.

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I didn't know this, but you
mentioned to me in one of your

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exchanges that the top social media companies
that just left Congress defending the safety and

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integrity of their platforms in New York
City sued those companies for their negative impact

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on mental health. So the question, I guess, is, to social

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00:30:49.039 --> 00:30:55.000
media make it harder to practice mindfulness
or being aware of oneself? Yes?

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00:30:55.519 --> 00:31:00.559
Yes, so, yeah, a
handful of companies like tiktoks, Chat,

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00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:06.279
Instagram, Discord, and an x
we're just in Congress for a week defending,

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00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:11.319
yeah, the integrity of their applications. But if we just narrow down

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on making it harder to be present, right, I think it doesn't take

401
00:31:15.319 --> 00:31:22.039
a lot to be able to pry
that open right on a very cold,

402
00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:29.160
just numbers approach. Social media companies
make money by generating impressions for their marketers,

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00:31:29.720 --> 00:31:33.279
which means they have to keep our
attention and make us engage with content.

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00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:37.920
So they fabricate an experience that gets
us to press on our phones and

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00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:45.480
they call it connection. That kind
of sucks. I don't know. And

406
00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:48.119
if you remember what I said about, like in the beginning about feelings being

407
00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:52.119
evidence to support a claim, well, these companies show us that, like,

408
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:56.000
these show us issues we care about, and the feelings they're able to

409
00:31:56.079 --> 00:32:00.039
generate then become evidence to support their
claim that their health things be connected.

410
00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:05.319
Right, And it's like this vicious
loop of well, I don't really feel

411
00:32:05.359 --> 00:32:10.119
any more connected, but you're triggering
feelings that I have, so I feel

412
00:32:10.119 --> 00:32:15.200
like I want to then re engage, and then suddenly, I don't know,

413
00:32:15.240 --> 00:32:20.440
I've never really walked away from social
media feeling like, oh, yeah,

414
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:25.519
I feel much more centered now,
you know. Yeah, he'scott has

415
00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:30.680
brain dumped all the stuff that I'm
supposed to feel more connected by. But

416
00:32:30.920 --> 00:32:37.240
I feel exhausted and like my brain
just went for a spin. Yeah,

417
00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:42.960
So I'm rooting for New York frankly, they're they're they're suing all these companies

418
00:32:43.279 --> 00:32:45.480
for over one hundred million dollars.
I think it's actually one hundred million dollars.

419
00:32:45.559 --> 00:32:50.359
Eric Adams mayor Eric Adams and his
staff to point out, like,

420
00:32:50.400 --> 00:32:52.920
hey, you are causing. You
are part of the problem, so be

421
00:32:52.960 --> 00:32:58.559
part of the solution. So yeah, certainly, yeh wow. All right,

422
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:01.039
Well let's let our listeners viewers think
about that. What kind of social

423
00:33:01.119 --> 00:33:04.920
media are you consuming? And maybe
is that a good thing for you?

424
00:33:05.319 --> 00:33:07.559
While we take our last break here, I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortez.

425
00:33:07.599 --> 00:33:09.839
We r on the air with Ginya
and Shin. He's a president and

426
00:33:09.839 --> 00:33:14.880
co founder of Pensive, where they
use perspective and reflection to strengthen mental health.

427
00:33:15.079 --> 00:33:19.799
We've been talking a good bit about
this notion of feelings versus mood and

428
00:33:19.839 --> 00:33:22.920
how we can start to get more
present to ourselves. After the RIK,

429
00:33:22.960 --> 00:33:28.000
we're to learn how Ginian and his
team have actually created a way for us

430
00:33:28.079 --> 00:33:45.960
to better connect. Stay with us. We'll be right back. Doctor Release

431
00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:50.839
courts Has is a management consultant specializing
in meaning and purpose. An inspirational speaker

432
00:33:50.920 --> 00:33:54.759
and author, she helps companies visioneer
for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop

433
00:33:54.799 --> 00:34:00.279
purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures
that elevate fulfillment, performance, and commitment

434
00:34:00.319 --> 00:34:05.079
within the workforce. To learn more
or to invite Alise to speak to your

435
00:34:05.160 --> 00:34:08.840
organization, please visit her at elisecortes
dot com. Let's talk about how to

436
00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:19.880
get your employees working on purpose.
This is working on Purpose with doctor Elise

437
00:34:19.920 --> 00:34:22.960
Cortes. To reach our program today
or to open a conversation with Elise,

438
00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:30.159
send an email to Alise ALISEE at
eliscortes dot com. Now back to working

439
00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:38.480
on Purpose. Thankteresting with us,
and welcome back to working on Purpose.

440
00:34:38.519 --> 00:34:42.920
I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes. I mentioned in the last break about

441
00:34:42.920 --> 00:34:45.400
my latest book coming out last March
of twenty twenty three, The Great Vitalization.

442
00:34:45.880 --> 00:34:49.719
What I did for you to help
you along the way in your journey

443
00:34:49.880 --> 00:34:53.440
is to help start to create a
destination workplace for yourself. Is I gave

444
00:34:53.559 --> 00:34:58.599
on my website a three page assessment
that you can use to see the extent

445
00:34:58.639 --> 00:35:02.480
to which your current culture practices are
meeting the needs of today's workforce. So

446
00:35:02.519 --> 00:35:07.559
it's at gustodeshnow dot com. If
you are just joining us now. My

447
00:35:07.599 --> 00:35:10.199
guest is Ginia and Chin. He's
a mental wellness coach and entrepreneur at Pensive,

448
00:35:10.360 --> 00:35:15.039
where they use perspective and reflection to
strengthen mental health. His calling Your

449
00:35:15.039 --> 00:35:19.679
Life is to help prevent suicides,
and he has been working diligently with his

450
00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:22.199
team to be able to do just
that. So we'll learn more about this

451
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:25.199
as we go. Okay, so
before we get into more of what you

452
00:35:25.280 --> 00:35:29.039
and your team have created, which
again I just have so much respect for

453
00:35:29.159 --> 00:35:30.800
you've seen something and you're like,
Okay, what can we do about it?

454
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:35.679
But we'll get to that. I
do want to hear your perspective and

455
00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:38.639
what does it mean to be in
touch? And how is that different from

456
00:35:38.719 --> 00:35:44.599
just from being connected. Yeah,
that's a really really good question, and

457
00:35:44.639 --> 00:35:49.159
I think this is the nuance that
I've been exploring a lot lately, because

458
00:35:50.519 --> 00:35:53.360
when we were first searching out on
like how do we solve this problem,

459
00:35:53.400 --> 00:35:57.280
A lot of people could relate to
I feel like I'm out of touch with

460
00:35:57.320 --> 00:36:00.239
my people, but I also feel
like I'm more connected to the world.

461
00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:06.280
And it was a massive gap that
everyone was looking at and kind of scratching

462
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:10.239
their heads, is how can that
be possible. Isn't technology supposed to help

463
00:36:10.280 --> 00:36:17.159
fill this gap? And it wasn't
until I really thought about like my upbringing

464
00:36:17.199 --> 00:36:22.559
that I think I kind of noticed
where this emphasis on connection was able to

465
00:36:22.599 --> 00:36:29.599
split from being in touch. And
you know, I thought about when my

466
00:36:29.719 --> 00:36:32.320
parents would you know, take us
to grandma's house for example, when I

467
00:36:32.360 --> 00:36:37.559
was a kid, I would always
want to like resist and I'd always just

468
00:36:37.559 --> 00:36:39.880
think it's always boring to go to
Grandma's house. We never do anything.

469
00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:45.159
We just we just kind of hang
out and we said. It wasn't until

470
00:36:45.159 --> 00:36:50.719
I got much older that I came
to appreciate that time to just be No

471
00:36:50.840 --> 00:36:57.400
Grandma wanted exactly that she wanted to
hear my inner monologue and get to just

472
00:36:57.440 --> 00:37:02.440
receive me and ask me questions,
reflect with me. And I had noticed

473
00:37:02.440 --> 00:37:06.719
that. I think, or how
this kind of then, you know,

474
00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:12.440
transposes us into connection versus being in
touch is you know, connection is really

475
00:37:12.519 --> 00:37:16.079
driven by productivity, you know,
what is the latest news, what has

476
00:37:16.199 --> 00:37:22.360
been done lately? Where being in
touch is more the analysis and the time

477
00:37:22.480 --> 00:37:28.400
the examination to look at each other
and think, well, how has what

478
00:37:28.480 --> 00:37:35.960
I've done actually influenced my identity or
built my identity or otherwise impacted my identity.

479
00:37:36.719 --> 00:37:39.679
And I think it's the lack of
those conversations on our communities that are

480
00:37:39.679 --> 00:37:44.079
making us feel like we are out
of touch with our friends and our peers

481
00:37:44.119 --> 00:37:50.599
and sometimes even our family members.
So yeah, that kind of then forced

482
00:37:50.639 --> 00:37:54.800
us to look at how can technology
help us to be to be in touch

483
00:37:54.840 --> 00:38:02.000
with each other? Yeah, so
much in that, And I just really

484
00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:07.599
appreciate your thoughtful, contemplative nature.
There's just so much and everything that you

485
00:38:07.840 --> 00:38:12.440
say has just such a in your
rear word nuance to it, and so

486
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:14.800
so much we're getting from this genue. This give me the show, ladies

487
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:16.559
and gentlemen that you're gonna have to
listen to a few times to be able

488
00:38:16.599 --> 00:38:20.920
to get more and more out of
this. All right, So where I

489
00:38:20.960 --> 00:38:23.559
want to go next is we did
talk about social media before, and you

490
00:38:23.679 --> 00:38:28.320
just brought up the idea of technology. Yeah, and I've had a couple

491
00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:31.599
of other conversations with guests talking about, you know, how to interrogate content.

492
00:38:31.679 --> 00:38:35.239
I'd love to hear your perspective on
what people can do to be more

493
00:38:35.280 --> 00:38:40.000
critical of the content they interact with
and consume. Yeah, I should probably

494
00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:45.000
clarify that I don't think all content
is inherently bad. I think some people

495
00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:47.599
might think that I'm making that way, like I love watching TV or movies,

496
00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:52.400
you know, And where I'm just
more critical of social media is because

497
00:38:52.480 --> 00:38:55.800
the constant engagement is draining, Right, I kind of mentioned this before,

498
00:38:55.840 --> 00:39:00.559
but yeah, I rarely feel as
though I pull away from social media thinking

499
00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:05.239
I'm more present in my surroundings.
Right, I'm just like scatterbrained, and

500
00:39:05.320 --> 00:39:09.639
I know it's not good for my
mental health. So this is kind of

501
00:39:10.039 --> 00:39:14.519
a pretty big jump into like a
I want to say, like a four

502
00:39:14.599 --> 00:39:17.320
hundred level concept. And I'm you
hear me referencing these numbers because I'm currently

503
00:39:17.320 --> 00:39:22.079
working on writing a book. But
I think the best way to defend against

504
00:39:22.440 --> 00:39:27.719
just the onslaught of information is to
know and establish your personal values. So

505
00:39:27.800 --> 00:39:30.840
I kind of teach this too kids
in their like young twenties, to try

506
00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:36.920
to set them up for independence.
But values, in their simplest form,

507
00:39:37.960 --> 00:39:42.920
they're just themes that summarize what you
want in return for your time. And

508
00:39:43.079 --> 00:39:47.159
you would be surprised how quickly you
could point out your own right if as

509
00:39:47.199 --> 00:39:51.519
a listener, if you want to
just Google a list of values, I

510
00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:53.679
challenge you or I encourage you to
just take a look at, like what

511
00:39:53.719 --> 00:39:59.920
would your top three be. And
the reason why you're going to be able

512
00:40:00.320 --> 00:40:05.280
pick them out so quickly, especially
as an adult, is because you've spent

513
00:40:05.440 --> 00:40:09.960
a lot of time with heartache and
pride and everything in between, and those

514
00:40:10.880 --> 00:40:17.960
those were related around these values and
how they impacted your time and how they

515
00:40:19.000 --> 00:40:22.760
inspired you. But yeah, when
you can know your personal values, I

516
00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:27.280
think that's the best way to ensure
that you show up in a consistent way

517
00:40:27.960 --> 00:40:30.960
and that you know you can then
kind of have a filter in the future

518
00:40:31.079 --> 00:40:37.079
for how to be critical about the
content that you interact with. For sure

519
00:40:37.119 --> 00:40:39.920
digitally, but I think it will
translate into the real world as well.

520
00:40:40.880 --> 00:40:45.639
Yeah, it's funny you bring up
values. I have a list of one

521
00:40:45.719 --> 00:40:49.159
hundred values that I use when I'm
speaking to audiences that I then distribute and

522
00:40:49.199 --> 00:40:52.119
flisters viewers. If you want that
list, you can reach out to me

523
00:40:52.159 --> 00:40:54.119
and get it from me. It's
at least at least coore test dot com.

524
00:40:54.199 --> 00:40:57.519
But yes, many people tell me
that they don't know their values,

525
00:40:57.760 --> 00:41:05.119
and yet it's so arrest providing clarity. When you define them when you actually

526
00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:08.519
isolate them. So I love that. That's beautiful. Okay, So next

527
00:41:08.519 --> 00:41:12.159
thing I want to get to then, because one of the things that i'mware

528
00:41:12.159 --> 00:41:15.000
of this is both I wanted the
conversation to be both about how can we

529
00:41:15.039 --> 00:41:19.199
really get more present to ourselves but
also to other people, people that we

530
00:41:19.239 --> 00:41:22.760
work with, people that we care
about. So the next question then is

531
00:41:22.800 --> 00:41:25.199
how can we get better at checking
in on the mental health of our friends

532
00:41:25.199 --> 00:41:30.079
and our peers. I mean,
how many times do we hear about somebody

533
00:41:30.159 --> 00:41:34.639
having a horrible situation life sometimes even
take in their own life and their friends

534
00:41:34.679 --> 00:41:38.039
and family and peers did not know
they were suffering. MM, thank you

535
00:41:38.079 --> 00:41:43.719
for asking this question. I call
myself a community builder and I'm always thinking

536
00:41:43.719 --> 00:41:45.440
about, you know, how we
can help each other out. So I'm

537
00:41:45.480 --> 00:41:52.480
glad we get to give them just
tactical, tactical things for community members and

538
00:41:53.639 --> 00:42:00.920
my number one piece of advice as
somebody who is not a clinician, right,

539
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:05.079
I have no extra letters after my
name. I'm not a researcher,

540
00:42:05.480 --> 00:42:09.400
right. This is all just lived
experience, and what brought me so far

541
00:42:09.960 --> 00:42:15.639
is frankly, just asking questions,
asking questions in a way where I'm not

542
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:22.079
solutioning with people, you can always
start with people's mental health by just asking,

543
00:42:22.360 --> 00:42:27.039
Hey, what's been making it hard
to be present? You have that

544
00:42:27.159 --> 00:42:30.480
language now, and I please for
me. You can even blame me if

545
00:42:30.519 --> 00:42:35.199
people are uncomfortable with other questions,
say I heard this guy doctor Lees is

546
00:42:35.320 --> 00:42:42.920
a podcast and he dared me to
do it. But as they start to

547
00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:46.960
share, just be curious as they
examine how they've been interpreting their surroundings,

548
00:42:47.840 --> 00:42:53.320
and that can lead to really grounding
conversations. Right, all individuals are capable

549
00:42:53.360 --> 00:42:59.719
of making decisions and living with the
consequences. But what's really encouraging is when

550
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:05.960
some one will help us talk through
preparation or the aftermath, you know,

551
00:43:06.079 --> 00:43:10.920
without being told what needs to be
done or what I should do right here

552
00:43:12.039 --> 00:43:16.159
here. Yeah. Oh that bears
repeating listeners and viewers. This question that

553
00:43:16.199 --> 00:43:19.760
you can serve up to your family, your friends, your peers, people

554
00:43:19.800 --> 00:43:23.000
at work. What's been making it
hard for you to be present? What

555
00:43:23.119 --> 00:43:28.920
a great question. Okay, now
let's go on to what you're doing at

556
00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:30.840
pensive now. One of the things
that I appreciated about our first conversation is

557
00:43:30.840 --> 00:43:35.920
we learned we both had a similar
sort of career in management consulting, and

558
00:43:35.920 --> 00:43:39.159
that you left yours, as did
I. Both of us left that respective

559
00:43:39.159 --> 00:43:43.800
field to go found our own thing
that was near and dear to our hearts,

560
00:43:43.840 --> 00:43:46.239
that allowed us to live our purpose. So let's hear a little bit

561
00:43:46.239 --> 00:43:52.599
about what were you doing before you
started pensive and why did you take the

562
00:43:52.679 --> 00:43:57.199
leap to do pensive? Yeah,
I was in management consulting, and after

563
00:43:57.360 --> 00:44:02.079
a couple of years of trying to
figure out how do I separate myself from

564
00:44:02.079 --> 00:44:06.280
just being a generalist, I've found
it. And it was when I leaned

565
00:44:06.280 --> 00:44:09.840
into being a community builder, and
you know, I found techniques to help,

566
00:44:10.800 --> 00:44:16.280
you know, people at the highest
levels of the organization just listen more

567
00:44:16.280 --> 00:44:22.960
effectively to people across the organization.
And while I was enjoying that very much

568
00:44:23.599 --> 00:44:29.440
and it was going very well,
unfortunately it wasn't directly serving my calling in

569
00:44:29.480 --> 00:44:32.880
a way that I thought I could
more effectively. When I look at technology,

570
00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:38.360
I look at just incredible potential for
community because it's something that's all in

571
00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:43.719
our pockets, right phones. We
all have computing power as powerful as our

572
00:44:43.800 --> 00:44:46.480
laptops in our pockets. I actually
have. I just got a new phone.

573
00:44:46.559 --> 00:44:51.320
It's more powerful, it's got more
RAM than my laptop. So you

574
00:44:51.320 --> 00:44:53.360
know, we have all this great
technology, and to me, that's great

575
00:44:53.400 --> 00:45:00.440
potential. And I think where I
saw this opportunity was, hey, how

576
00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:06.840
do we actually get each other to
use these devices in a way where we

577
00:45:06.920 --> 00:45:13.440
are serving each other and not just
passing information? And that just yeah,

578
00:45:13.480 --> 00:45:16.480
thats chewed at me for so long
that unfortunately I needed to leave my last

579
00:45:16.480 --> 00:45:20.199
company. I understand, my friend, that's what happened to me too.

580
00:45:21.320 --> 00:45:25.480
I get it. Well, I'm
really intrigued with just the I guess the

581
00:45:25.960 --> 00:45:30.960
clarity of how you describe what you
do at Pensive. You say, we

582
00:45:30.079 --> 00:45:34.920
use perspective and reflection to strengthen mental
health, and then you went on,

583
00:45:34.960 --> 00:45:38.440
you see, mechanically we use sharing
in a feelings wheel techniques we learn from

584
00:45:38.480 --> 00:45:43.559
mental health practice to promote belonging and
peace of mind. I did download the

585
00:45:43.559 --> 00:45:45.679
app, I have not been able
to get into it yet because it gives

586
00:45:45.679 --> 00:45:49.360
me I got stuck and that was
on my side. So that I want

587
00:45:49.400 --> 00:45:52.880
you to tell us more about about
this notion of this feelings wheel. Yes,

588
00:45:53.079 --> 00:45:59.280
the feelings wheel is how we are
trying, how we Pensive are trying

589
00:45:59.679 --> 00:46:05.159
to courage all of us as a
society to take a step with feelings together.

590
00:46:06.480 --> 00:46:09.719
We're in a place where, you
know, people are saying mental health

591
00:46:09.800 --> 00:46:13.800
is health, and that's awesome,
But when we go a level deeper,

592
00:46:13.920 --> 00:46:17.199
just one level deeper, it really
does come down to can we look at

593
00:46:17.239 --> 00:46:24.079
feelings like information informing our identities.
That's the next step we have to take

594
00:46:25.039 --> 00:46:29.880
in for us to get there.
And for men, I know that the

595
00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:35.079
issue is still if I talk about
feelings, somebody will consider me weak just

596
00:46:35.159 --> 00:46:37.840
in general. Right. Shaquille O'Neal
right now is in major headlines because he

597
00:46:37.840 --> 00:46:44.440
says he never shares his emotions with
anybody, because he says if you tell

598
00:46:44.480 --> 00:46:45.280
it, and especially to women.
He says, if you tell it to

599
00:46:45.280 --> 00:46:47.880
a woman, they will throw that
right back and use that against you.

600
00:46:49.440 --> 00:46:52.360
Right. So this is still extremely
prevalent today. And then for women,

601
00:46:52.400 --> 00:46:58.559
what makes it very challenging is women
know how to articulate their feelings, but

602
00:46:58.920 --> 00:47:02.239
women are afraid of being a burden
with their negative feelings on their peers,

603
00:47:02.559 --> 00:47:06.599
and so even when their peers are
trying to offer that space out, they'll

604
00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:09.119
shy away from it. And yeah, for fear of being a burden and

605
00:47:09.119 --> 00:47:15.320
burdening others. So that's to me
where I see this wonderful potential of hey,

606
00:47:15.639 --> 00:47:20.719
what if we use a digital space
right to be able to inform each

607
00:47:20.719 --> 00:47:24.199
other how we are being right?
Because the more we neglect this, I

608
00:47:24.199 --> 00:47:30.679
don't know why we just keep turning
away from this. Looking at feelings like

609
00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:32.719
data is the way that we like
to put it. And that's that's our

610
00:47:32.719 --> 00:47:38.199
goal right now. Our mission is
just to help people see feelings as data.

611
00:47:38.599 --> 00:47:44.840
We're wearing technology to sleep to see
when we flinch or sneeze or cough,

612
00:47:45.440 --> 00:47:49.920
right, And that's entertaining for the
first few weeks, but at some

613
00:47:50.039 --> 00:47:54.239
point that's not what's going to help
you get in touch with yourself or your

614
00:47:54.320 --> 00:48:00.639
peers any deeper in the journey of
a stock or words astonishing moments. Right,

615
00:48:00.719 --> 00:48:07.719
it's feelings that are the fuel,
and I hope that technology can yeah,

616
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:14.119
play a positive, helpful role in
that journey. It's fantastic. Now

617
00:48:14.119 --> 00:48:15.679
we're almost I did the close of
the show here and I want to give

618
00:48:15.679 --> 00:48:20.119
you a chance just to share the
vision of pensive. So listeners and viewers,

619
00:48:20.119 --> 00:48:23.440
from my vantage point, what I
teach for my practice is vision is

620
00:48:23.480 --> 00:48:28.320
what happens when you're the purpose of
your organization is fully realized. So it's

621
00:48:28.360 --> 00:48:34.639
a futuristic view. So for you, what's the vision of pensive, oh

622
00:48:34.679 --> 00:48:39.880
Man? For me, the vision
of pensive is where, you know,

623
00:48:40.000 --> 00:48:47.519
I think the ultimate purpose of technology
is to find this like symbiotic relationship with

624
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:54.239
humanity. And the signal for me
that pensive will have found a symbiotic relationship

625
00:48:54.280 --> 00:49:04.119
with humanity is when we talk about
value and feelings in a way that authenticates

626
00:49:04.199 --> 00:49:07.719
our experiences, the ones that we
buy into, the one that we reflect

627
00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:13.480
on. Yeah, you know,
it's just everyday language where it's like,

628
00:49:13.519 --> 00:49:16.000
hey, my core values, for
example, I probably should have shared this

629
00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:22.559
earlier are loyalty, compassion, and
courage, And through those three lenses,

630
00:49:22.599 --> 00:49:28.400
I really can boil down my entire
life experiences of my proudest moments and my

631
00:49:28.559 --> 00:49:32.199
toughest ones. But yeah, I
think we just have to take one step

632
00:49:32.719 --> 00:49:37.800
by practicing being and hopefully technology can
help us get towards that beautiful Ginya,

633
00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:40.719
and this has been an incredible conversation. Thank you so much for lending your

634
00:49:40.719 --> 00:49:45.039
heart and soul and beautiful brain to
working on a purpose. And glad to

635
00:49:45.079 --> 00:49:49.320
know you as well. Thank you
so much for having me. Of course,

636
00:49:49.400 --> 00:49:52.199
listeners and viewers, you're going to
learn more about this man and what

637
00:49:52.320 --> 00:49:54.320
he's doing with his team. So
this is a ginin shin we've been on

638
00:49:54.360 --> 00:49:57.840
the air with. You can check
out what he and his team at Pensive

639
00:49:57.880 --> 00:50:02.960
are doing at pe civ. Is
how you spell pensive pe nciv dot com.

640
00:50:04.199 --> 00:50:07.639
You can also then find the app
with the same name and check that

641
00:50:07.679 --> 00:50:10.400
out. It's free, downloaded and
get started, and then join us next

642
00:50:10.400 --> 00:50:15.599
week for another delicious serving of inspiring
thought, leadership on creating destination workplaces,

643
00:50:15.599 --> 00:50:17.519
and other such matters. See you
there. Remember, work is one of

644
00:50:17.519 --> 00:50:21.960
the best adventures and means of realizing
our potential and making the impact we crave.

645
00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:28.519
So let's work on Purpose. We
hope you've enjoyed this week's program.

646
00:50:28.760 --> 00:50:31.960
Be sure to tune into Working on
Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes,

647
00:50:32.119 --> 00:50:37.280
each week on W four CY.
Together we'll create a world where business

648
00:50:37.360 --> 00:50:42.880
operates conscientiously, leadership inspires and passion
performance, and employees are fulfilled in work

649
00:50:42.920 --> 00:50:45.960
that provides the meaning and purpose they
crave. See you there, Let's work

650
00:50:46.079 --> 00:50:46.760
on Purpose.