Connecting Everything: From Individual Sentience to Organizational Innovation, Creativity and Sustai

WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:03.279
The topics and opinions express in the
following show are solely those of the hosts

2
00:00:03.319 --> 00:00:06.000
and their guests, and not those
of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are

3
00:00:06.040 --> 00:00:10.039
affiliates. We make no recommendations or
endorsements radio show, programs, services,

4
00:00:10.119 --> 00:00:13.919
or products mentioned on air or on
our web. No liability explicit or implies

5
00:00:13.919 --> 00:00:17.800
shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio
or its employees are affiliates. Any questions

6
00:00:17.879 --> 00:00:21.079
or comments should be directed to those
show hosts. Thank you for choosing W

7
00:00:21.160 --> 00:00:31.600
FOURCY Radio. What's working on Purpose? Anyway? Each week we ponder the

8
00:00:31.600 --> 00:00:35.479
answer to this question. People ache
for meaning and purpose at work, to

9
00:00:35.600 --> 00:00:40.719
contribute their talents passionately and know their
lives really matter. They crave being part

10
00:00:40.719 --> 00:00:45.399
of an organization that inspires them and
helps them grow into realizing their highest potential.

11
00:00:45.679 --> 00:00:49.399
Business can be such a force for
good in the world, elevating humanity.

12
00:00:49.640 --> 00:00:53.600
In our program, we provide guidance
and inspiration to help usher in this

13
00:00:53.719 --> 00:00:58.600
world we all want Working on Purpose. Now, here's your host, Doctor

14
00:00:58.600 --> 00:01:06.840
Elise Cortes. Welcome back to the
Working on Purpose Program. Thanks for turning

15
00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:07.920
in again this week. Great to
have you. I am your host,

16
00:01:07.920 --> 00:01:12.519
Doctor Elis Cortes and I have been
with passion and pride bringing you this podcast

17
00:01:12.519 --> 00:01:17.519
since February of twenty fifteen. If
we've not met before, you don't know

18
00:01:17.640 --> 00:01:21.760
me. I am an organizational psychologist
and loco therapist, speaker and author,

19
00:01:22.159 --> 00:01:25.400
and my team and I at Gusto
now help companies to enliven and fortify their

20
00:01:25.439 --> 00:01:30.480
operations and increase profitability by articulating their
purpose and building inspirational leaders and cultures activated

21
00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:34.599
by meeting and purpose. Our mission
is to help our clients create a destination

22
00:01:34.680 --> 00:01:38.799
workplace where people flock to join,
are intrinsically motivated to perform with their best,

23
00:01:40.079 --> 00:01:42.359
can grow into their full potential,
and are committed to stay and dynamically

24
00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:47.280
deliver on the company's mission, which
then translates to your higher profits. You

25
00:01:47.319 --> 00:01:49.719
can learn more about us and how
we can work together at Gusto dashnow dot

26
00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:55.040
com and my personal site, Atliscortes
dot com. Now getting back in today's

27
00:01:55.040 --> 00:02:00.439
program with us again is Faiso Hook, an accomplished entrepreneur, senior EXCPS secutive

28
00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:05.000
author, thought leader, public speaker
and advisor to management teams and boards of

29
00:02:05.040 --> 00:02:08.719
directors with more than twenty five years
of cross industry success. He's the founder

30
00:02:08.759 --> 00:02:14.680
of Shadoka, Next Chapter and Next
Chapter and other companies. They all focus

31
00:02:14.719 --> 00:02:19.159
on enabling sustainable and transformational changes.
As a thought leader, he has authored

32
00:02:19.159 --> 00:02:23.560
a number of books on leadership,
innovation, mindfulness, resilience, organizational transformation,

33
00:02:23.680 --> 00:02:29.400
and entrepreneurship, including Everything Connects,
How to Transform and Lead in the

34
00:02:29.439 --> 00:02:34.560
Age of Creativity, Innovation and Sustainability. His work has appeared in Fast Company,

35
00:02:34.639 --> 00:02:38.599
Business Insider, Walls, Street Journal, BusinessWeek, Fox CBS, Financial

36
00:02:38.639 --> 00:02:44.319
Times, Mergers and Acquisitions, Forbes, etc. Today he joined us from

37
00:02:44.360 --> 00:02:47.960
Connecticut Faisal a hearty welcome back to
working on purpose. Good to be back,

38
00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:52.479
thanks for having me. Well,
it's wonderful. And as I as

39
00:02:52.520 --> 00:02:53.560
we know, my friend, when
you came back and I saw that you

40
00:02:53.599 --> 00:02:57.240
had this book out, Everything Connects, and one of your people had sent

41
00:02:57.360 --> 00:02:59.840
it to me, and I realized
we hadn't yet futured it, I said,

42
00:02:59.840 --> 00:03:01.800
you must come back, young man, you must come back. So

43
00:03:01.919 --> 00:03:05.919
thank you, thank you, honor, thank you. You're welcome. And

44
00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:07.280
as I mentioned before we got on
air, you know, this show has

45
00:03:07.319 --> 00:03:10.439
been on air for nine years,
and so what we tend to do is

46
00:03:10.840 --> 00:03:14.479
curate the content. What I mean
by that is, if we've already covered

47
00:03:14.479 --> 00:03:16.560
it, I don't go over the
things that I've already been covered. I

48
00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:20.639
like to pull out the nuggets that
I really think, you know, enliven

49
00:03:20.719 --> 00:03:23.000
and add to what we've covered.
And so they're what I want to do

50
00:03:23.199 --> 00:03:25.719
in our in our time together today
is pull out those pieces that I thought

51
00:03:25.759 --> 00:03:30.759
were really quite delicious and different than
what we've covered. And you know,

52
00:03:30.879 --> 00:03:35.840
I already told you that I love
your definition of entrepreneur and as I recall

53
00:03:35.879 --> 00:03:39.439
it, it's it's the person who
takes responsibility for their economic lives and wellbeing.

54
00:03:40.120 --> 00:03:44.520
And that's a that's a title that
I have grown into over the years,

55
00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:46.520
viisl and I love the way that
you have defined that for us.

56
00:03:46.560 --> 00:03:51.039
So let's all welcome, you know, the entrepreneurs and want to be entrepreneurs

57
00:03:51.039 --> 00:03:55.240
who are listening and watching today.
Welcome entrepreneurs and those who want to innovate.

58
00:03:58.159 --> 00:04:00.240
So the first thing I want to
talk about here, which I think

59
00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:02.800
it's amazing that we need to talk
about it is you talk about in this

60
00:04:02.919 --> 00:04:06.919
latest book the need to humanize our
work lives. It is so true.

61
00:04:06.919 --> 00:04:11.599
We do still and this is this
book came out what was it twenty twelve

62
00:04:11.680 --> 00:04:15.719
originally, is that correct? That's
correct. It's been now eight years and

63
00:04:15.319 --> 00:04:20.040
feels like that message is more relevant
today than what we actually sat and wrote

64
00:04:20.079 --> 00:04:25.839
that thing and the outline I was, I was talking about traveling. I

65
00:04:25.920 --> 00:04:30.639
actually wrote the outline of that book
literally sitting in Dubai airport, and then

66
00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:33.079
the book came out, you know, about a year later. So it's

67
00:04:33.120 --> 00:04:38.759
pretty interesting. Yeah, I just
I think it's really really interesting. And

68
00:04:39.120 --> 00:04:43.240
again I am a person. So
for my PhD studies, I studied human

69
00:04:43.279 --> 00:04:46.519
development and we did a lot of
work around systems. So I like to

70
00:04:46.560 --> 00:04:51.079
think in systems, and to me, this idea everything connects really speaks to

71
00:04:51.160 --> 00:04:56.480
systems and interconnectivity and nothing exists on
its own, which, of course I

72
00:04:56.600 --> 00:05:00.360
celebrate it. I love how you
talk about, you know, first thing

73
00:05:00.360 --> 00:05:03.759
in the book you borrow a line
from Phil Live in the highly portable CEO

74
00:05:03.879 --> 00:05:08.959
of ever note, and you talk
about, of course, humanizing our working

75
00:05:09.000 --> 00:05:13.040
lives is a sufficiently epic quest to
dedicate lives too. Well, That's what

76
00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:15.040
I'm doing for sure, and probably
you are too to a certain extent.

77
00:05:15.399 --> 00:05:20.560
But I appreciate how this idea that
humanization will yield more positive experiences at work,

78
00:05:20.639 --> 00:05:26.399
more creativity and innovation within organizations,
and greater interpersonal bonds between the people

79
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:30.439
we work with. And of course
this also means that we're creating longer,

80
00:05:30.120 --> 00:05:32.720
more value long term. So that's
where I want to start if we can

81
00:05:32.800 --> 00:05:36.160
find so if you can kind of
just speak to that, that's where I

82
00:05:36.160 --> 00:05:41.199
want to be an organization. Look, I mean, maybe I can start

83
00:05:41.240 --> 00:05:46.519
with the definition of entrepreneurship because you
know, in reality, almost every one

84
00:05:46.560 --> 00:05:54.199
of us has some sort of entrepreneurial
trait that allows us to survive, right,

85
00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:59.279
because if you think about a very
early stage when you are trying to

86
00:05:59.319 --> 00:06:02.519
find a job or when you're trying
to make a living, and depending on

87
00:06:02.560 --> 00:06:11.600
where you're born and where you're the
circumstances around you, that that makes you

88
00:06:11.680 --> 00:06:15.959
do certain things and you're very much
focused on survival and making a living that

89
00:06:16.040 --> 00:06:19.759
allows you to put food on the
table. As you grow and as you

90
00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:29.120
progress and as you learn, you
know, if your motivation and your idea

91
00:06:29.279 --> 00:06:36.439
of success maybe changes, and most
successful people as they go through different stages

92
00:06:36.480 --> 00:06:40.560
of life, like if you look
at my life, I can talk from

93
00:06:40.560 --> 00:06:44.399
my own perspective. Initially, you
know, when first I came to us,

94
00:06:45.160 --> 00:06:47.639
I wanted to just survive because I
had to put food on the table

95
00:06:47.680 --> 00:06:51.879
and put myself to school. So
I had to be very creative to do

96
00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:57.959
that, right, So that's the
creativity and way of surviving is very much

97
00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:02.360
fundamental for entrepreneur. Now, if
you go fast forward and you know,

98
00:07:02.399 --> 00:07:06.199
now I'm in my fifties, I've
gone through several stages of my life.

99
00:07:08.000 --> 00:07:11.800
I've got a little more credibility,
a little more knowledge. I can do

100
00:07:11.879 --> 00:07:16.920
things more effectively than when I was
in my twenties. My motivation is very

101
00:07:16.920 --> 00:07:21.040
different, the same as what you're
saying that you know, this idea of

102
00:07:21.160 --> 00:07:26.920
making an impact and caring for others
because you can afford to do that.

103
00:07:27.000 --> 00:07:30.160
You know, once you're basic,
it's like mass Low's hierarchy. Once your

104
00:07:30.199 --> 00:07:35.199
basic needs are med, then you
look for something bigger than you. So

105
00:07:35.439 --> 00:07:44.800
so the definition of entrepreneurship and impact
and this pursuit of whatever that you want

106
00:07:44.839 --> 00:07:49.160
to do changes over time. So
whether it's fills a definition of you know,

107
00:07:49.639 --> 00:07:56.319
looking for that's meaningful, or whether
my definition from my own life journey

108
00:07:56.959 --> 00:08:03.199
what's important to me. We have
committical opportunity to craft and change it as

109
00:08:03.240 --> 00:08:07.279
we grow. So I thrive on
that idea that you actually can learn and

110
00:08:07.319 --> 00:08:11.639
grow and change me too. And
I of course I'm a big Manslow fan

111
00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:15.759
as well. And yes, you
know when you want to, you know,

112
00:08:15.800 --> 00:08:18.439
as an entrepreneur. Of course,
a big reason that I'm an entrepreneur

113
00:08:18.639 --> 00:08:22.800
is that, yes, I do
want to be able to be responsible for

114
00:08:22.839 --> 00:08:26.879
my own time and my economic well
being, and I want to I want

115
00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:30.199
to express my purpose to the work
that I do, and that is what

116
00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:33.240
I get to do. But that
takes us to this next place, or

117
00:08:33.279 --> 00:08:35.720
there's two pieces, two parts to
where I want to take us next.

118
00:08:35.720 --> 00:08:39.279
And one is I like how you
talk about the entrepreneurs idealistic and pragmatic,

119
00:08:39.720 --> 00:08:43.399
sensitive to the world they wish to
see, and conscious of the world as

120
00:08:43.440 --> 00:08:48.559
it is. The entrepreneurs work then
is connecting these two. That's exactly what

121
00:08:48.679 --> 00:08:54.600
you know has been kind of my
riveting challenge and focus of late. I've

122
00:08:54.639 --> 00:08:58.559
been, you know, an entrepreneur
since two thousand and three and more specifically

123
00:08:58.559 --> 00:09:03.799
living my purpose since to that eighteen. So that is definitely my space,

124
00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:07.360
but taking it more specifically where it
gets really more interesting to call on more

125
00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:11.759
deeply your area of expertise, especially
as it relates to innovation. So I

126
00:09:11.799 --> 00:09:16.080
wanted to take it further where you
then go on you talk about Christensen's work

127
00:09:16.519 --> 00:09:22.279
and talking about how instead of not
instead of just looking at what's the market

128
00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:24.840
today? What are people wanting today? What can I give them today that

129
00:09:24.879 --> 00:09:30.559
they want they already know that they
want. What can I actually create that

130
00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:35.840
it actually speaks to their unspoken,
unmit future needs. That's where I'm also

131
00:09:35.960 --> 00:09:39.320
at, and share more about that
in just a second, But if you

132
00:09:39.320 --> 00:09:43.320
could speak to how that really disrupts
things and what does it take to be

133
00:09:43.360 --> 00:09:48.120
able to live in that space?
Right? Look, I mean the innovation

134
00:09:48.320 --> 00:09:54.080
journey, or this whole notion of
being idealistic and pragmatist at the same time

135
00:09:54.639 --> 00:10:00.840
is very crucial and fundamental. And
that says that you know, most of

136
00:10:00.879 --> 00:10:03.919
the entrepreneurs are innovators, are dreamers, right, They want to see the

137
00:10:03.960 --> 00:10:09.759
world in a different lens than than
most people does. Right, And as

138
00:10:09.799 --> 00:10:13.320
a result, you you take a
lot of risk, but you also sometimes

139
00:10:13.320 --> 00:10:18.039
fall in love with your own creation. Whereby the market may not be ready

140
00:10:18.080 --> 00:10:24.919
for what you're preaching or whatever you're
producing. Right, But the successful ones

141
00:10:26.320 --> 00:10:31.519
somehow managed to balance this this uh
you know, idealistic view where world needs

142
00:10:31.559 --> 00:10:37.639
to be and and what you can
produce and create that demand because you know,

143
00:10:37.639 --> 00:10:39.320
a lot of time, as I
said, you know, as you

144
00:10:39.480 --> 00:10:41.799
just mentioned that people doesn't know.
I mean, you can look at every

145
00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:48.519
single innovation, whether that's Teem's apple, uh and and the iPhone, or

146
00:10:48.559 --> 00:10:52.720
whether it's the new generation of cars, whatever the case may be. Right,

147
00:10:54.080 --> 00:10:56.840
these are it didn't exist. We
created the need for it. They

148
00:10:56.919 --> 00:11:01.639
created the need for it, and
now we can live without it. But

149
00:11:01.799 --> 00:11:05.720
if you look at the journey,
we forget how many times they failed in

150
00:11:05.879 --> 00:11:09.480
order to pursue that journey. Right, I mean the history of iPhone,

151
00:11:11.320 --> 00:11:16.000
you know, I mean it's almost
like twenty fifteen years old because it didn't

152
00:11:16.039 --> 00:11:20.519
start as iPhone. It started as
the iPad, and then it morphed into

153
00:11:20.600 --> 00:11:24.320
the iPhone. And I don't mostly
mostly, I mean, you know,

154
00:11:24.519 --> 00:11:28.919
those of who are in our fifties, remember that was a bricklike device that

155
00:11:28.960 --> 00:11:35.159
nobody wanted to use. Right,
So it is that, you know,

156
00:11:35.039 --> 00:11:41.159
So the pragmatism is so that you
can actually maintain that economic sustainability to survive,

157
00:11:41.360 --> 00:11:46.879
right, And idealism is that having
that dream to do something that's different

158
00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:52.240
and creative, whatever, But it
takes time to get there, and the

159
00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:56.840
longer you stay with it, the
chances of success becomes higher. Right.

160
00:11:56.919 --> 00:12:01.000
So it's a fine balance, and
some of us are luckier than others in

161
00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:03.840
the sense that sometimes you come up
with something and it becomes an instant hit.

162
00:12:05.799 --> 00:12:09.279
Sometimes you know, you have to
work at it for many years.

163
00:12:09.799 --> 00:12:13.919
I mean, it's funny. I
was flipping through my very first book that

164
00:12:13.960 --> 00:12:18.399
I published in two thousand, called
e Enterprise with Cambridge University Press, and

165
00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:22.519
in that book, this was right
around the Internet bubble, and I had

166
00:12:22.519 --> 00:12:26.600
an internet company obviously at that time, and I was arguing in the book

167
00:12:26.639 --> 00:12:31.000
that it's not the technology, it's
how we learned to use it and come

168
00:12:31.080 --> 00:12:37.120
up with the business model that will
make this new generation products successful that are

169
00:12:37.240 --> 00:12:41.360
very much going to be digital.
I look at that what I wrote twenty

170
00:12:41.399 --> 00:12:45.759
five years ago, and you know, I heavily coted Peter Drucker's principle and

171
00:12:46.000 --> 00:12:48.480
other things in that book, and
I look at now, yeah, and

172
00:12:48.679 --> 00:12:52.360
you know, I'm now, you
know, last year when I was kind

173
00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:58.240
of writing a fresher version of this
in my other book called Reinvent. A

174
00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.080
lot of things have changed, technology
change, and we're about to like completely

175
00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:05.799
disrupt the world with AI, but
fundamentals haven't changed. Like that all of

176
00:13:05.840 --> 00:13:09.279
the things we're talking about, you
know, this mindset and looking at things

177
00:13:09.360 --> 00:13:16.120
in certain ways, and ability to
survive and the ability to pragmatically balance and

178
00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:20.519
so that we can actually do the
things we want to do and have the

179
00:13:20.639 --> 00:13:28.360
patience to do. That is a
trick Later later on, I'll add something

180
00:13:28.399 --> 00:13:31.159
to this, but that that's really
the case. I mean, you have

181
00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:35.320
to have the idealism and vision and
the dream, but you also have to

182
00:13:35.360 --> 00:13:41.159
be pragmatic what works when and how
much work it will take to get where

183
00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:43.759
you want to get it there.
Mm hmm, Well just quickly, just

184
00:13:45.159 --> 00:13:48.159
you know, you mentioned Maslow before. I mean, I'm already helping companies

185
00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:50.320
to activate meaning in purpose in their
leadership and their culture. But really,

186
00:13:50.360 --> 00:13:54.440
where I want to go next is
you mentioned Maslow. He has a higher

187
00:13:54.440 --> 00:14:00.240
attitude or be value spectrum, and
I am out now to develop programs that

188
00:14:00.240 --> 00:14:05.840
that help people to live in that
space of those higher values, because it

189
00:14:05.960 --> 00:14:09.840
lends to creativity, it lends to
pro pro social behaviors, etc. So

190
00:14:09.879 --> 00:14:13.639
that's where I'm going next. Even
though nobody's saying would you please do this

191
00:14:13.679 --> 00:14:16.519
from there's no that I can think
of. There's nobody saying I'd like to

192
00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:20.759
buy this from you today, but
I need to do it so anyway,

193
00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:24.919
So now where I want to go
next, Wesel is this is just such

194
00:14:24.919 --> 00:14:30.039
a brilliant way to talk about management. And it's one of my big things

195
00:14:30.080 --> 00:14:31.679
because I teach a lot of managers
through my programs, and I teach a

196
00:14:31.679 --> 00:14:35.399
lot of leaders, and I hate
the idea of managing my presence. I

197
00:14:35.480 --> 00:14:41.840
hate the idea of but in seat
management, it's so anti human. And

198
00:14:41.879 --> 00:14:46.039
so your idea of managing my consciousness
is a time Who's is an idea whose

199
00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:48.960
time has come? Please? Would
you say a little bit more about what

200
00:14:50.039 --> 00:14:50.840
you mean by that? And then
I want to delve a little bit.

201
00:14:52.960 --> 00:14:54.200
Yeah, I mean, look,
most of the time, you know,

202
00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:58.360
when especially in the field of innovation
and creativity and that sort of a thing,

203
00:15:00.440 --> 00:15:07.039
you know, we often enough put
timeline and we managed by what was

204
00:15:07.080 --> 00:15:11.440
the output and when what time frame
it was done, how many hours somebody

205
00:15:11.519 --> 00:15:15.039
is putting into it, et cetera, et cetera. Right, in a

206
00:15:15.600 --> 00:15:22.399
complex creative environment, that's that doesn't
really work because the reason it doesn't work

207
00:15:22.600 --> 00:15:26.759
is, and we all know if
you look at individual level a lot at

208
00:15:26.960 --> 00:15:31.919
an organizational level, and we'll connect
the dot between individual and organization minute.

209
00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:39.200
We all have specific biorhythm, we
all have specific creative burst, we always

210
00:15:39.240 --> 00:15:46.440
have. We all have a particular
driver for creativity. Some people get motivated

211
00:15:46.480 --> 00:15:50.279
by music, some people get motivated
by walk in the nature, whatever,

212
00:15:50.440 --> 00:15:52.799
or talking to other people, whatever
the case may be. So if you

213
00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:58.799
can so if you put time frame
when you start putting people in this box

214
00:15:58.919 --> 00:16:03.120
that did you put eight hours and
did you work five days a week?

215
00:16:03.320 --> 00:16:07.039
Or or when you know, did
you show up at the office at nine

216
00:16:07.080 --> 00:16:15.039
in the morning, those things really
doesn't is not the activator for your creativity.

217
00:16:15.039 --> 00:16:18.000
For example, you know I work
best in the early part of the

218
00:16:18.039 --> 00:16:22.320
morning, meaning creative work. Right, so between four point thirty five o'clock

219
00:16:22.799 --> 00:16:26.399
aut in nine, I'm very creative. After that, it's my productivity starts

220
00:16:26.440 --> 00:16:32.759
getting you know, lower and lower. And so if somebody said you got

221
00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:36.399
to come here at nine o'clock in
the morning and you have to have three

222
00:16:36.440 --> 00:16:40.320
o'clock you start writing your next white
paper, that's probably not gonna work,

223
00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:45.600
right. So we mean by managing
consciousness being being they're very mindful of how

224
00:16:45.759 --> 00:16:52.360
people you know tick in their own
way so that they can give their maximum

225
00:16:52.440 --> 00:16:57.000
creative output. As a result,
you actually get there faster. And then

226
00:16:57.039 --> 00:17:02.679
add on to that, you know, the ownership both economically and otherwise,

227
00:17:02.720 --> 00:17:06.799
you know, I mean there's a
huge argument when people have ownership in meaning

228
00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:11.279
physical economic ownership in a company versus
you're just a plain employee. Those have

229
00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:15.960
all has impact, right, I
mean, that's monetary ownership. But there's

230
00:17:17.000 --> 00:17:22.480
also other kind of ownership when you
put a responsibility and accountability on people and

231
00:17:22.559 --> 00:17:26.079
telp them come up with something uh
that that that's off their own and they

232
00:17:26.119 --> 00:17:33.200
get rewarded for that. That's where
the creative process really starts, you know,

233
00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:38.799
taking taking home. So you know, being conscious about how each person

234
00:17:40.960 --> 00:17:48.160
uh you know uh gets motivated and
produced and able to adjust and motivate them

235
00:17:48.279 --> 00:17:53.000
to really you know, to live
their fullest potential is how you then translate

236
00:17:53.119 --> 00:17:59.119
into that organizational system because that has
to be part of the culture. It's

237
00:17:59.119 --> 00:18:03.000
not just to one person. Is
like catering to the entire organization to be

238
00:18:03.079 --> 00:18:07.400
that way so collectively that produce.
It to produce doesn't mean you don't hold

239
00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:14.119
people accountable, doesn't mean that you
know, you don't manage my numbers.

240
00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:15.960
Because at the end of the day, if you're talking about a company,

241
00:18:17.680 --> 00:18:21.640
you know they really have to produce
result from the financial point of the otherwise

242
00:18:21.640 --> 00:18:25.359
they will go out of business.
Beautiful Pvice, Well, thank you for

243
00:18:25.400 --> 00:18:27.559
bringing that to life so eloquently.
That's exactly what I was hoping for.

244
00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:32.759
Let's grab our first break. I'm
your host, doctor Elise Cortes. We've

245
00:18:32.839 --> 00:18:37.079
on the air with Faiso Hoak.
He's an accomplished entrepreneur, senior executive author,

246
00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:41.279
thought leader, public speaker and advisor
to management teams and board of directors

247
00:18:41.279 --> 00:18:45.640
with more than twenty five years across
industry success. He's the founder of Shadoka,

248
00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:49.319
Next Chapter and other companies who all
focus on which all focus on enabling

249
00:18:49.359 --> 00:18:53.400
sustainable and transformational changes. We've been
talking a bit about some of the areas

250
00:18:53.400 --> 00:18:57.880
around humanizing work and also managing my
consciousness. After the break, we're going

251
00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:03.720
to get into the relationship between an
organization's structure and how it actually innovates.

252
00:19:03.839 --> 00:19:22.000
Stay with us. We'll be right
back. Doctor Elise Cortes is a management

253
00:19:22.079 --> 00:19:27.200
consultant specializing in meaning and purpose.
An inspirational speaker and author. She helps

254
00:19:27.200 --> 00:19:33.039
companies visioneer for greater purpose among stakeholders
and develop purpose inspired leadership and meaning infused

255
00:19:33.039 --> 00:19:37.960
cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,
and commitment within the workforce. To learn

256
00:19:37.960 --> 00:19:41.640
more or to invite a lease to
speak to your organization, please visit her

257
00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:47.359
at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk
about how to get your employees working on

258
00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:56.119
purpose. This is working on Purpose
with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our

259
00:19:56.160 --> 00:20:00.039
program today or to open a conversation
with Elise, send an email to a

260
00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:07.799
lease a li se at eliscortes dot
com. Now back to working on purpose.

261
00:20:12.599 --> 00:20:15.880
Thanks for staying with us, and
welcome back to working on Purpose.

262
00:20:15.920 --> 00:20:19.000
I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes. Likewisel As, I'm also dedicated to

263
00:20:19.000 --> 00:20:22.920
helping create a world where people can
realize the potential at work and are led

264
00:20:22.960 --> 00:20:26.359
by inspirational leaders who bring them to
their best. And we do business at

265
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:29.640
Betters the World. I keep researching
and writing my books, and the latest

266
00:20:29.640 --> 00:20:33.559
one came out in March of twenty
twenty three. It's called The Great Revitalization.

267
00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:37.799
How activating meaning and purpose can radically
enliven your business. And I wrote

268
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:41.720
the book to really help readers,
business leaders and company owners to understand the

269
00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:45.440
new lay of the land, of
what the workforce wants, and then to

270
00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:48.880
provide twenty two best projects to help
you steward or culture to get there.

271
00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:52.480
So you can find it at my
side at Lasecoortes dot com or Amazon if

272
00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:56.319
you are just joining us. My
guest is Faisal Hope. He is the

273
00:20:56.319 --> 00:21:00.599
author of Everything Connects Cultivating Mindfulness,
Creativity and Innovation for Long Term Value,

274
00:21:00.839 --> 00:21:04.680
one of his many works which we're
talking about today. So where I wanted

275
00:21:04.720 --> 00:21:07.039
to go next, which I think
is really really interesting, and you've really

276
00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:11.559
got me thinking about this visa from
my own company. As I quote from

277
00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:15.400
your book, you say, any
organization that designs a system will inevitably produce

278
00:21:15.440 --> 00:21:21.720
a design whose structure is a copy
of the organization's communications structure. So in

279
00:21:21.799 --> 00:21:25.839
other words, what we how we
can restate that as you use Conway's law,

280
00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:29.880
there is there. What they're saying
is companies are destined to produce products

281
00:21:29.920 --> 00:21:34.680
that mirror their organizational structure, or
even more extremely poetically, we could simply

282
00:21:34.759 --> 00:21:40.799
say that the organization implies that product, or that the organization is the product.

283
00:21:40.920 --> 00:21:44.240
That is so interesting And now look
at that, and I went,

284
00:21:44.400 --> 00:21:48.599
oh, how would I characterize how
we communicate around here? Oops? Well,

285
00:21:49.319 --> 00:21:56.960
you know, it's it's this has
a very deep philosophical tenant for me

286
00:21:56.079 --> 00:22:00.640
because if you if you think about
this teaching, you know, it says

287
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:06.000
that you are who you think you
are, right, and so it's kind

288
00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:11.000
of like that when when when you
when you put that in a greater context,

289
00:22:11.079 --> 00:22:15.079
a leader, uh, it's kind
of is the face of the organization,

290
00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:18.960
but the leader also kind of crafts
what that organization is. And often

291
00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:23.319
enough, when you look at the
organistal structure it you know, obviously you

292
00:22:23.319 --> 00:22:26.640
have to have systems, especially the
larger you are, the more you need

293
00:22:26.680 --> 00:22:33.319
systems. But but what you structure
the organization and how how much rigidity you

294
00:22:33.400 --> 00:22:40.200
have in the organization kind of reflects
the leader's personality and mindset and the philosophy

295
00:22:40.640 --> 00:22:47.680
how that leader wants to produce,
communicate, and and and drive people's output.

296
00:22:47.799 --> 00:22:51.400
Right. So, so so that's
it really comes from that, And

297
00:22:51.480 --> 00:22:55.119
you know, I mean so in
the books as you as you read thoroughly

298
00:22:56.000 --> 00:23:00.519
so much appreciated. You know,
we we crack. We kind of craft

299
00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:04.920
this notion that you have to look
at if you look at the organizational structure

300
00:23:06.400 --> 00:23:11.720
from the eyes of innovation and creativity, you can look at people say,

301
00:23:11.720 --> 00:23:15.200
okay, who are the people who
are creating ideas, Who are the people

302
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:19.200
who are uh, you know,
uh building those ideas, What are the

303
00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:23.480
people building partners around those ideas,
and who are the people who are focusing

304
00:23:23.759 --> 00:23:30.000
how we can improve and then craft
organization in that context. And by the

305
00:23:30.039 --> 00:23:33.200
way, you have to rotate those
people, so there is a cross pollination

306
00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:37.480
or cross learning versus saying here's my
marketing, here's my sales, and here's

307
00:23:37.559 --> 00:23:41.240
this and here's that, And that's
how you start creating those silos that that

308
00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:47.039
doesn't overlap. Right, So,
because you're not thinking from the you know,

309
00:23:47.119 --> 00:23:51.240
that life cycle of a new innovation
where it starts with idea to go

310
00:23:51.279 --> 00:23:55.559
to market to value realization. Mm
hmm. Thank you, And speaking to

311
00:23:55.599 --> 00:23:57.839
that, I did think there was
merit for our listeners and viewers to talk

312
00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:02.880
about the four roles in in performing
innovation that you really lay out so beautifully

313
00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:07.039
in your book, because they're all
needed, right, all four of them

314
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:10.759
are needed, and I think it
makes sense for us to discuss them briefly,

315
00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:14.480
describe them and what it is that
they do, because you know,

316
00:24:14.519 --> 00:24:17.640
some people might say, oh,
I totally love this kind of a role,

317
00:24:18.119 --> 00:24:19.200
or I might try to want to
try to learn this role. So

318
00:24:19.240 --> 00:24:25.079
could you talk about the four roles? Yeah, So there's the ideation role.

319
00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:30.720
You know, people who actually creates
the idea and they look at opportunities

320
00:24:30.359 --> 00:24:36.039
and they look at the core competencies
in the organization and then they come up

321
00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:42.599
with an idea. Second one is
the people who are are really looking at

322
00:24:42.759 --> 00:24:49.400
building those ideas in terms of designing
and implementing so that you can take an

323
00:24:49.599 --> 00:24:52.799
output to the market. And when
I'm saying that, I'm not talking about

324
00:24:52.880 --> 00:24:56.839
this physical product. It could be
a service, it could be all kinds

325
00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:02.680
of things, but nevertheless, you
have to that in a consumable manner that

326
00:25:02.920 --> 00:25:07.559
your your you know, your customer
can take it. So, for example,

327
00:25:07.160 --> 00:25:11.200
we could write a book which is
a product, and we had to

328
00:25:11.240 --> 00:25:14.200
think about it, came up with
the idea of the book. You had

329
00:25:14.200 --> 00:25:18.079
to you know, design what's kind
of the structure and so on and so

330
00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:21.480
forth right. So once you do
that, then there's this idea of you

331
00:25:21.519 --> 00:25:25.519
know, as ad this twelve years
ago, but it evolved a little bit

332
00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:29.200
from that. Now. I like
to say that there is a role of

333
00:25:29.759 --> 00:25:33.960
partnering. Who creates ecosystems so that
that product or service can survive. Who

334
00:25:33.960 --> 00:25:40.200
goes out there and creates this,
uh, this vehicle whereby you know,

335
00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:44.160
people get to know what you're offering, People get to support their offering,

336
00:25:44.599 --> 00:25:49.240
influence your offering, helps adapting that
offering in your customer base, et cetera,

337
00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:53.680
et cetera. While you're doing that, there's a very important role that

338
00:25:55.039 --> 00:26:00.920
we often forget is the improving role
that that allows it. Looking as you

339
00:26:00.960 --> 00:26:06.559
know, a step back and looking
at that ideation to market to valorialization and

340
00:26:06.599 --> 00:26:11.200
said where can we improve Because as
you're doing, especially in a new offering,

341
00:26:11.799 --> 00:26:15.880
what happens is that you're all you're
going to learn things that you haven't

342
00:26:15.920 --> 00:26:18.559
thought through. The reaction to the
customer is going to have, the way

343
00:26:18.599 --> 00:26:22.000
you decided to distribute, the way
you priced it. You know, these

344
00:26:22.039 --> 00:26:27.240
are all uh, you know,
places for improvement. So those improving role

345
00:26:27.759 --> 00:26:33.960
has a different role than the people
who are coming up with new ideas because

346
00:26:33.119 --> 00:26:37.359
they're looking at how can we improve
it? So it does get better,

347
00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:42.920
and it does get more acceptance,
and it does generate more more revenue and

348
00:26:44.039 --> 00:26:48.119
profit margin, which is ultimately the
uh the you know, the reason of

349
00:26:48.200 --> 00:26:52.440
surviving a product or service. And
by the way, that also includes what

350
00:26:52.640 --> 00:26:56.960
impact is having on a societal level, because the higher you can move as

351
00:26:57.000 --> 00:27:03.720
social impact, the more arsenal and
more sticky the product because because the audience

352
00:27:03.799 --> 00:27:11.200
creates the emotional connection to your offering. Thank you fise listeners and viewers.

353
00:27:11.240 --> 00:27:14.200
What I want to emphasize about why
I brought this up for you. I

354
00:27:14.279 --> 00:27:18.160
always want you to be able to
take away something immediately from my program to

355
00:27:18.200 --> 00:27:22.400
put to work immediately in your business. And so think about those four roles,

356
00:27:22.440 --> 00:27:25.160
the ideation role, the guiding role, the building role, and the

357
00:27:25.160 --> 00:27:30.200
improving role. Think about how you
can layer that structure into your team today,

358
00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:33.000
especially if you want to encourage innovation. So really you could. I

359
00:27:33.039 --> 00:27:38.000
know so many organizations whose teams are
definitely not structured that way. So put

360
00:27:38.000 --> 00:27:41.400
that to work. Okay, So
the next thing before I queue this up

361
00:27:41.440 --> 00:27:45.440
here, by okay, if you
could just indulge me here and remind me

362
00:27:45.680 --> 00:27:49.960
and the listeners and viewers of your
basic education. How are you schooled?

363
00:27:52.559 --> 00:27:57.200
I'm schooled from the street. Literally. I did go to school for my

364
00:27:57.359 --> 00:28:03.440
undergrad in' Southerland, a university for
electrical engineering, and then I went to

365
00:28:04.640 --> 00:28:11.599
University of Minnesota for computer science and
management science. But in my fifth year

366
00:28:11.680 --> 00:28:15.079
of school, I came up with
a product and I dropped out of college

367
00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:18.920
and sent out a disc to get
my first you know, a floppy disk,

368
00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:23.440
literally a floppy disk in a demo, and I got my first job.

369
00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:27.799
But since then, I've been an
entrepreneur, and my learning is actually

370
00:28:29.000 --> 00:28:34.000
from reading all these people you mentioned, you know, whether it's how that

371
00:28:34.079 --> 00:28:37.160
I met in real life, sometimes
some of them I've never met, like

372
00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:45.839
whether it's Peter Dracker or Clechiciansen or
even Buddhist teaching. And also from my

373
00:28:45.039 --> 00:28:49.480
customers. I have had a tremendous
opportunity to work with some of the best

374
00:28:49.519 --> 00:28:53.440
and the brightest in the industry,
both in private sector and public sectors.

375
00:28:53.519 --> 00:29:00.599
I worked with Gee, my first
or second company was acquired g S.

376
00:29:00.960 --> 00:29:06.400
I worked there for a while.
But whether it's g whether it's ibm Ames,

377
00:29:06.559 --> 00:29:10.960
you know, et cetera, et
cetera. But also last seven six

378
00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:15.839
seven years, I'm doing a ton
of work for our government, both for

379
00:29:15.880 --> 00:29:22.240
our development of defense and the you
know, the homeland securities. I've had

380
00:29:22.279 --> 00:29:26.279
a different kind of learning experience in
the last seven eight years where motivation is

381
00:29:26.279 --> 00:29:33.279
not profit. It's literally human lives
and national security and other things. So

382
00:29:33.839 --> 00:29:41.119
the innovation and surviving and creativity motivating
people has a totally different construct than a

383
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:48.599
commercial organization. Thank you for that. That was really so beautiful and really

384
00:29:48.640 --> 00:29:51.599
filled in so much for me.
And the reason I wanted to situate your

385
00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:55.599
your education feiso is where I want
to go next is I want to talk

386
00:29:55.599 --> 00:29:59.599
about love and enjoying the workplace,
which doesn't usually fit with electrical engineering and

387
00:29:59.720 --> 00:30:03.880
you know sort of you know,
even creating you know, an entrepreneurial company,

388
00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:06.519
and it does I think when it
comes to people's lives, et cetera.

389
00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:10.200
But you know, as an organizational
psychologist, of course, I understand

390
00:30:10.200 --> 00:30:14.400
how important stuff is, so hearing
it from your perspective is really really valuable.

391
00:30:14.440 --> 00:30:18.960
So I really appreciate that you do
cite Barbara Fredericks Fredrickson's work in your

392
00:30:19.000 --> 00:30:22.640
in your book as well but this
talk about this idea, the role of

393
00:30:22.720 --> 00:30:29.359
love and joy in the workplace,
especially as it relates to innovation. Look,

394
00:30:29.480 --> 00:30:34.599
I mean, you know, anything
positive, anything you know that has

395
00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:41.000
meaning, deep meaning, and any
type of deep work that doesn't come from

396
00:30:41.960 --> 00:30:47.480
tasing something superficially uh and often enough. You know, if you look at

397
00:30:47.680 --> 00:30:55.720
the greatest entrepreneurial journey, they are
personal stories that created the spark of doing

398
00:30:55.759 --> 00:31:02.000
something different and doing something you know, innovative. So in my case,

399
00:31:02.519 --> 00:31:08.920
you know what has happened at least
is that various stages of my life I

400
00:31:08.960 --> 00:31:17.240
had different motivation and different sorts of
love, if you want to quote it

401
00:31:17.279 --> 00:31:21.960
as love. So at some stage
it was love of creating something different and

402
00:31:22.039 --> 00:31:29.400
new and being successful. At some
stage it was the love of taking care

403
00:31:29.440 --> 00:31:33.079
of my family, at some stage
making an impact for the society. And

404
00:31:33.920 --> 00:31:41.359
recently it has been a combination of
doing something that has a long lasting impact

405
00:31:41.720 --> 00:31:45.000
for the next generation, but also
serving my country. So the work I

406
00:31:45.079 --> 00:31:51.240
do today it is solely based on
how can I serve my country? Number

407
00:31:51.240 --> 00:31:56.160
one? And number two, can
I do something that will help a certain

408
00:31:56.240 --> 00:32:00.079
cause that I have in specifically these
days is cancery because I have a cancer

409
00:32:00.119 --> 00:32:07.279
surviving child. So my motivation and
what I do today is completely different than

410
00:32:07.400 --> 00:32:13.359
the you know, the nineties and
two thousand tech entrepreneur who's chasing to be

411
00:32:13.519 --> 00:32:17.000
yet another tech entrepreneur that wants to, you know, take the horn by

412
00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:21.000
the bull, as they say,
those are long gone. It's a totally

413
00:32:21.039 --> 00:32:25.200
different definition. So each of these
stages are driven by love, and each

414
00:32:25.240 --> 00:32:30.240
of these stages are driven by a
joy that you get by doing the work.

415
00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:35.519
I don't consider my work as work. I consider that it's a fulfillment

416
00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:40.599
of giving. If I can use
that term, and I don't think I

417
00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:45.200
could. I'm truly content by what
I do. I mean, I can

418
00:32:45.279 --> 00:32:47.960
say that, and I'm very able
to say exactly that. And if you

419
00:32:49.000 --> 00:32:53.680
don't do that, you know,
but let's rephrase it separately. If you

420
00:32:53.799 --> 00:32:57.960
manage to do that, the output
you're going to get out of the work

421
00:32:58.000 --> 00:33:02.440
you do is unmatched to the work
that you do when you are just slugging

422
00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:07.559
in a way to survive, right, and you have to somehow get to

423
00:33:07.599 --> 00:33:12.640
that point. Thank you for that. And I did not know about your

424
00:33:12.759 --> 00:33:15.920
child, so this really it makes
even more sense. Thank you for sharing

425
00:33:15.960 --> 00:33:22.400
that My soul that is really remarkable
and beautiful. I want to also bring

426
00:33:22.440 --> 00:33:25.559
back the pragmatic application of the work
and joy for those who are still out

427
00:33:25.559 --> 00:33:30.640
there thinking this might still feel a
little touchy feely, and that is that

428
00:33:30.680 --> 00:33:32.799
you go onto your book to really
talk about how when we factor in things

429
00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:36.680
and we work from a place of
love and joy, that you know,

430
00:33:37.279 --> 00:33:40.759
it helps us to relax our inborn
and unseen mental rigidity and to expand our

431
00:33:40.759 --> 00:33:45.200
perspective of a situation beyond the cocoon
of my view this is how I think

432
00:33:45.240 --> 00:33:49.720
of things, into something more aerial, more aware of the group as a

433
00:33:49.759 --> 00:33:53.559
whole, including that of the customer
or user or the unseen partner to any

434
00:33:53.680 --> 00:34:00.119
any workplace conversation. So you know, it just kind of expands our capacity

435
00:34:00.160 --> 00:34:02.480
to see connect the dots, if
you will. And then, as I

436
00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:07.039
say, it helps us be able
to practice what are called pro social behaviors,

437
00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:09.159
So that part of what it does. And so then if we take

438
00:34:09.159 --> 00:34:14.280
it a step further and go into
just you know, positive emotions in general,

439
00:34:14.320 --> 00:34:17.320
which of course all of my work
is servicing that. I just appreciate

440
00:34:17.360 --> 00:34:23.480
that you're really also talking about how
what that does for people's mindset or who

441
00:34:23.519 --> 00:34:29.239
are intentionally putting themselves into or you
know, channeling positive emotions, whether they

442
00:34:29.239 --> 00:34:31.679
do it because they've been asked or
because it's in the environment they work from.

443
00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:35.800
You know, just that ability to
be able to start to be able

444
00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:39.679
to work from the place of love, joy, empathy that allows people to

445
00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:45.599
have a wider inventory of possible actions
and then they take that broader context necessary

446
00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:49.639
for systems thinking and promote that resilience. And that's what I wanted to celebrate

447
00:34:49.679 --> 00:34:54.079
when you're talking about love joy,
positive emotions in the workplace, especially as

448
00:34:54.079 --> 00:35:00.079
it relates to innovation. Look,
I mean you know when you when you

449
00:35:00.119 --> 00:35:05.159
go to ultimately, you know,
innovation is not a solo sport. You

450
00:35:05.519 --> 00:35:13.440
can innovate something and make it sustained
and actually adapted if you're not working with

451
00:35:13.519 --> 00:35:15.920
people, right. So, so
you can take a commercial product, or

452
00:35:15.960 --> 00:35:20.679
you can look at you know,
a complex environment like our federal government.

453
00:35:20.800 --> 00:35:24.800
Right any it doesn't matter what sector
or look at cancer research, right so,

454
00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:30.159
it doesn't matter what area of expertise
or field or you work with.

455
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:34.599
You know, you can go with
their good intention, but ultimately you have

456
00:35:34.679 --> 00:35:39.000
to expand that in an ecosystem,
right so so this is where that love

457
00:35:39.039 --> 00:35:45.719
and joy becomes critical because these are
hard work. Convincing other people of your

458
00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:52.239
idea and motivating other people of your
cause is hard work, right because everybody

459
00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:54.840
has their own thing going on and
et cetera, et cetera. So this

460
00:35:55.000 --> 00:36:05.360
is where empathy and you know,
and a conscious effort of connecting with other

461
00:36:05.400 --> 00:36:10.480
people becomes critical because you have to
go to there where they are and bring

462
00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:14.760
your idea to them. Now,
this is my idea, Just make it

463
00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:16.320
happen. That just doesn't work that
way, right, You have to show

464
00:36:16.360 --> 00:36:21.079
what's in it for them, and
you have to convince them why they should

465
00:36:21.079 --> 00:36:25.559
care about things and you should.
You should be able to article it why

466
00:36:25.599 --> 00:36:30.000
it matters in a greater context,
right, So if it's a company,

467
00:36:30.360 --> 00:36:34.840
it matters because you if you create
a good product or service, then your

468
00:36:34.840 --> 00:36:37.280
customer will buy it and as a
result, the company will be successful.

469
00:36:37.599 --> 00:36:42.159
If you do it in the context
of let's say in in you know,

470
00:36:42.480 --> 00:36:45.199
in public sector, you're trying to
serve public goods. If it's good for

471
00:36:45.239 --> 00:36:49.840
the society, ultimately it will be
good for you, but it's also going

472
00:36:49.880 --> 00:36:52.039
to be good for your children.
So you do your part and as a

473
00:36:52.079 --> 00:36:57.480
result, you bring it together so
that and you know, and you know,

474
00:36:58.239 --> 00:37:04.119
positivity and gratitude and empathy is contiguous
as we all want. Once you

475
00:37:04.159 --> 00:37:09.119
go there with that positive attitude,
it you know, it attracts people to

476
00:37:09.480 --> 00:37:14.519
like, you know, to to
to rally behind you. But the trick

477
00:37:14.639 --> 00:37:21.079
is taking that and you know,
create a system and a culture that can

478
00:37:21.119 --> 00:37:25.760
be replicated above and beyond your presence. Right. So this is the role

479
00:37:25.920 --> 00:37:30.400
of the leader, whereby the leaders
doesn't create followers, They create system,

480
00:37:31.320 --> 00:37:35.239
you know, they you know,
there's that's saying leaders create other leaders.

481
00:37:35.440 --> 00:37:40.679
I actually like to say leader creates
system and process that becomes the cultural DNA

482
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:46.039
that allows you, for allows other
people to carry the water above and beyond

483
00:37:46.079 --> 00:37:50.119
you. Right. So if you
can't do that, then you become that

484
00:37:50.199 --> 00:37:53.800
sustainable organization and it doesn't matter who's
there and who's not there. The next

485
00:37:53.800 --> 00:37:59.920
generation will take it over and do
it. So beautiful vice, Okay,

486
00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:02.079
let's grab our last break on then
let our listeners and viewers chew a little

487
00:38:02.119 --> 00:38:06.280
bit on what you were talking about
with love and joy, positive emotions and

488
00:38:06.320 --> 00:38:12.199
how sprinkling them into your organizational culture
can actually promote innovation I'm your host,

489
00:38:12.199 --> 00:38:15.360
doctor release Cortez. We've been on
the air with Faiso hok. He's an

490
00:38:15.360 --> 00:38:20.199
accomplished entrepreneur, senior executive author,
thought leader, public speaker, and advisor

491
00:38:20.280 --> 00:38:22.519
to management teams and board of directors
with more than twenty five years of cross

492
00:38:22.679 --> 00:38:28.039
industry experience. He is the founder
of Shadokah, Next Chapter and many other

493
00:38:28.079 --> 00:38:32.199
companies which all focus on enabling sustainable
and transformational changes. We're going to talk

494
00:38:32.239 --> 00:38:37.440
more after the break about this wonderful
notion of sentience and how you, as

495
00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:39.840
a manager and leader can embrace that
to bring out the best in your people.

496
00:38:40.039 --> 00:38:58.760
Stay with us, We'll be right
back. Doctor Release Court says as

497
00:38:58.760 --> 00:39:02.679
a management consultant specializing in meaning and
purpose, an inspirational speaker and author,

498
00:39:02.960 --> 00:39:08.480
she helps companies visioneer for greater purpose
among stakeholders and develop purpose inspired leadership and

499
00:39:08.599 --> 00:39:14.440
meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment,
performance, and commitment within the workforce.

500
00:39:14.800 --> 00:39:17.400
To learn more or to invite a
lease to speak to your organization, please

501
00:39:17.519 --> 00:39:22.000
visit her at Elisecortes dot com.
Let's talk about how to get your employees

502
00:39:22.079 --> 00:39:31.960
working on purpose. This is working
on purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To

503
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:37.039
reach our program today or to open
a conversation with Elise, send an email

504
00:39:37.119 --> 00:39:44.039
to Elise Alise at Elisecortes dot com. Now back to Working on Purpose.

505
00:39:49.519 --> 00:39:52.079
Thanks for staying with us, and
welcome back to Working on Purpose. I

506
00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:54.480
am your host, doctor Elise Cortes. As I mentioned in our first break,

507
00:39:54.519 --> 00:39:58.280
I just put out my last book, The Great Vitalization, in March

508
00:39:58.320 --> 00:40:00.960
of twenty twenty three. What I
did for you to help utilize the contents

509
00:40:01.000 --> 00:40:05.559
of that book without even reading it, is I created a three page assessment

510
00:40:05.639 --> 00:40:09.199
you can print off my website from
gustodashnow dot com to determine the extent to

511
00:40:09.239 --> 00:40:15.760
which your workforce, your culture today
is actually set up to meet the discerning

512
00:40:15.800 --> 00:40:19.920
needs of today's workforce. It will
also help give you a roadmap to elevating

513
00:40:19.960 --> 00:40:23.719
your organizational culture to meet that discerning
standard. So it's at gustodashnow dot com

514
00:40:24.119 --> 00:40:27.679
if you are just now joining us. My guest is Faisal Hope. He

515
00:40:27.760 --> 00:40:31.599
is the author of Everything Connects Cultivating
Mindfulness, Creativity and Innovation for Long Term

516
00:40:31.679 --> 00:40:35.960
Value, one of his mini works. So where I wanted to go next

517
00:40:35.960 --> 00:40:39.920
fisl is I love words, I
love speaking different languages and words, and

518
00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:45.000
you talk about this wonderful word called
sentience in your work here when it comes

519
00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:51.519
to really celebrating individuals and managing and
steward and nurturing them. So let's talk

520
00:40:51.559 --> 00:40:57.360
about sentience. Sure that word,
if you typed it on AI or if

521
00:40:57.400 --> 00:41:04.000
you typed it on Google, it
will tell you that is the capacity to

522
00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:10.360
be very conscious and self aware and
the capacity to be self aware what's around

523
00:41:10.440 --> 00:41:16.519
you and what other people feels and
does meaning your ecosystem if you want to

524
00:41:16.519 --> 00:41:21.760
get it to a very broader extent. So, if you look at a

525
00:41:22.000 --> 00:41:25.639
leader, a successful leader, they
truly are sentient. The more successful they

526
00:41:25.679 --> 00:41:31.320
are, the more self conscious they
are. They are more conscious about how

527
00:41:31.360 --> 00:41:37.159
other people feel, but also how
you feel, because how you feel comes

528
00:41:37.159 --> 00:41:40.800
across the way you speak, your
body language, your reactions, et cetera,

529
00:41:40.840 --> 00:41:44.639
et cetera. Right, So that's
really the meaning of sentient. So

530
00:41:45.280 --> 00:41:50.639
if you now look at a successful
leader, successful leader doesn't create chaos.

531
00:41:51.039 --> 00:41:58.239
Successful leader does not create an environment
where people runs around with chicken like a

532
00:41:58.320 --> 00:42:02.840
chicken with their headcut, right,
sucessful creator. Successfully leaders are the persona

533
00:42:04.039 --> 00:42:09.880
of calmness, who is you know, very much aware of whatever the chaos

534
00:42:10.079 --> 00:42:15.519
that organization is feeling, but also
how to come that process so that you

535
00:42:15.599 --> 00:42:20.119
can move things forward. Right.
So it's a conscious leadership versus h you

536
00:42:20.199 --> 00:42:23.199
know, the classic command and control
leadership that says, hey, I said,

537
00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:28.719
so therefore you make it so.
Yeah, and we probably talked about

538
00:42:28.719 --> 00:42:30.360
this, but I have long been
a conscious capitalist, and I do serve

539
00:42:30.400 --> 00:42:34.880
on the board here in Dallas as
well. I very much promote those principles

540
00:42:35.400 --> 00:42:37.719
and taking just a little bit further
here this idea of sentience. I wanted

541
00:42:37.800 --> 00:42:40.920
just to reinforce what you said so
beautifully in your book. You say it

542
00:42:40.960 --> 00:42:45.679
also entails in appreciating the interior complexity
of the people you work with. Then

543
00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:51.440
by appreciating that complexity, you can
make explicit the links between a person's individual

544
00:42:51.559 --> 00:42:55.360
motivations and that of the organization,
creating an alignment and alliance between the individual

545
00:42:55.440 --> 00:43:00.039
that comprises the organization. And that's
that's back to everything connects, right.

546
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:05.400
How can you actually see that in
such a way that you can actually work

547
00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:08.559
to connect it. I think that
is such a beautiful and elegant contribution of

548
00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:12.639
a manager and leader to be able
to develop the capacity to do that.

549
00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:16.119
Yeah. Look, I mean,
if you know there's a little woman most

550
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:22.800
successful organization and their leaders don't have
like thirty direct quotes, they have four

551
00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:25.360
or five because what you just said, you know what you just read from

552
00:43:25.400 --> 00:43:30.320
my excerpt from my book. If
you look at that, it takes a

553
00:43:30.440 --> 00:43:36.719
lot of interpersonal relationship and not saying
the relationship to get to the point where

554
00:43:36.760 --> 00:43:43.239
you'd really understand somebody else's inner complexity
and whatever else is going on in their

555
00:43:43.320 --> 00:43:46.159
lives, right, because whatever else
going on in their lives a direct reflection

556
00:43:46.639 --> 00:43:50.960
how they perform at work. Right, So if you're not aware of it,

557
00:43:51.119 --> 00:43:53.079
you don't have to like get into
their lives, but you have to

558
00:43:53.199 --> 00:43:58.920
be you have to have an empathy
to recognize that whatever is going on,

559
00:43:59.159 --> 00:44:04.880
and however, they express their creativity
both positively and negatively. So if you

560
00:44:04.920 --> 00:44:09.039
look at that context, every leader
can only do that with a handful of

561
00:44:09.159 --> 00:44:15.519
people. Right. That's why organization, you know, larger the organization is,

562
00:44:15.159 --> 00:44:20.159
it's a hierarchy, right, and
it's not a bad thing because hierarchy.

563
00:44:20.280 --> 00:44:24.440
You can look at hierarchy as a
quote or a guide that giving guidance

564
00:44:25.000 --> 00:44:30.599
versus commands, and the guidance comes
from what needs to be done, but

565
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:37.679
also the capacity and the capability of
the people that you're guiding to be the

566
00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:42.079
best performers. They can be right
by holding them accountable. Right, So

567
00:44:42.920 --> 00:44:47.440
in that context, you know,
the best performance, especially in the context

568
00:44:47.519 --> 00:44:52.639
of innovation and creativity. And by
the way, those are the only jobs

569
00:44:52.599 --> 00:44:58.199
you know that will be remaining,
you know, as time goes by,

570
00:44:58.440 --> 00:45:02.719
because repetitive, uh, you know, mundane work would be replaced with a

571
00:45:02.800 --> 00:45:08.480
lot of technology akai and other things. Even in the knowledge space, you

572
00:45:08.559 --> 00:45:15.679
will see that it's continuously being replaced
with technology that that are mundane. You

573
00:45:15.760 --> 00:45:19.880
know, that's repetitive, right,
So the only set of work that will

574
00:45:19.920 --> 00:45:24.760
be remain is this creative set of
work and given by creative people. So

575
00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:30.400
the management and the leadership also has
to go back to that, you know,

576
00:45:30.599 --> 00:45:35.559
to what we just discussed moments ago. And when I wrote that book,

577
00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:39.880
technology was not even that advance.
And if you look at what has

578
00:45:39.960 --> 00:45:44.639
happened in the last two years,
it's taken to the whole new, different

579
00:45:44.760 --> 00:45:47.360
level. Right. So, and
it's yet a tsunami is about to come.

580
00:45:49.480 --> 00:45:52.199
Yeah, it's so beautiful and I
want to really help like you along

581
00:45:52.280 --> 00:45:54.119
your side, stewarded, and to
that end, we're kind. I want

582
00:45:54.159 --> 00:45:57.199
to go next, and this will
probably take us close to very end of

583
00:45:57.199 --> 00:46:00.719
the show is listeners and viewers.
If you are an individual contributor, I

584
00:46:00.760 --> 00:46:02.239
want you to think about the extent
to which you experience work like this.

585
00:46:02.400 --> 00:46:05.880
If you are a leader of people, I want you to think about the

586
00:46:05.960 --> 00:46:09.239
extent to which your people experience their
work like this. I am a person

587
00:46:09.280 --> 00:46:14.920
who believes profoundly in the promise of
work to be able to help us realize

588
00:46:14.960 --> 00:46:17.400
our potential. So I love what
Feisl has in his book. Here he's

589
00:46:17.440 --> 00:46:21.760
talking about Apple. Whatever your view
is about Apple, but he's got an

590
00:46:22.079 --> 00:46:25.320
excerpt in here from a memo that
Apple gives to new hires in which the

591
00:46:25.400 --> 00:46:30.599
company contrasts work and life's work,
and it reads, I quote, people

592
00:46:30.679 --> 00:46:35.440
don't come here to play it safe. The memo printed in the New York

593
00:46:35.480 --> 00:46:38.880
Times reads, they come here to
swim in the deep end. They want

594
00:46:38.960 --> 00:46:45.280
their work to add up to something
that couldn't happen anywhere else. Think about

595
00:46:45.320 --> 00:46:51.039
that. That's you joining in opting
into sentience at its finest and really thinking

596
00:46:51.079 --> 00:46:54.159
about how can you give yourself over
so you give the greatest aspect of yourself,

597
00:46:54.440 --> 00:46:59.320
contribute it to something much bigger and
grander than yourself. I think most

598
00:46:59.440 --> 00:47:02.920
people want something some form of this
and are hungry for it, and so

599
00:47:02.960 --> 00:47:06.639
I really wanted to celebrate that piso. If you want to just comment on

600
00:47:06.760 --> 00:47:09.679
that, or if you're a perspective, look absolutely, it depends. It

601
00:47:10.079 --> 00:47:15.000
applies in any field. So you
look at the doctors and nurses, right,

602
00:47:15.480 --> 00:47:19.840
if you look at their credo,
they're not there to create products.

603
00:47:19.880 --> 00:47:22.000
They're there to save lives, right, So they have a different credo.

604
00:47:22.360 --> 00:47:28.840
Now when we when I look at
my brothers and sisters in their uniform in

605
00:47:28.960 --> 00:47:34.199
our military, they're there to protect
our country. They're there to uphold democracy.

606
00:47:34.320 --> 00:47:39.679
They're there to make sure hungry are
getting fed. People who are you

607
00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:46.239
know, are in dire calamity situation
are getting saved. Right, So their

608
00:47:46.360 --> 00:47:52.199
courte of ethics and courte of conduct
and their calling is different. But each

609
00:47:52.320 --> 00:47:54.880
one of those areas, whether it's
an Apple employee, or whether it's a

610
00:47:55.000 --> 00:47:59.199
doctor, or whether it's I mean, I look at the doctors of you

611
00:47:59.239 --> 00:48:01.519
know, my son's dot. He
wouldn't be alive if I didn't have those

612
00:48:01.639 --> 00:48:07.119
dedicated nurse research and doctors that are
working night and day to come up with

613
00:48:07.280 --> 00:48:09.960
a cure that could say patient like
him. I can say the same thing

614
00:48:10.199 --> 00:48:16.800
about uh, you know my friends
and co workers in the military community.

615
00:48:16.920 --> 00:48:22.400
Right, So each one of these
people or a group of people, they

616
00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:25.559
have different calling, but it is
their life work. It is their life

617
00:48:25.639 --> 00:48:31.559
work that's dedicating to create something different
and a better place and a safer place

618
00:48:31.719 --> 00:48:37.800
for all us. Right. So
it doesn't has to be for just commercial

619
00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:42.519
call. It applies for anything and
everything that we all do. Absolutely,

620
00:48:42.559 --> 00:48:45.679
And I want to just finish by
celebrating and let you comment on this just

621
00:48:45.760 --> 00:48:49.800
quickly. As you talk about the
role of CEO, and you mentioned Meta,

622
00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:52.480
who's a serial entrepreneur, and he
says his number one job is to

623
00:48:53.079 --> 00:49:00.119
make sure everyone's operating at their absolute
potential and that he says that everyone and

624
00:49:00.599 --> 00:49:02.480
his job is to make sure everyone
is incredibly passionate about what they do.

625
00:49:04.199 --> 00:49:07.480
That is what I'm stewarding among leaders
as well. And just to finish it,

626
00:49:07.519 --> 00:49:08.840
if you could just see in like
twenty seconds, how would you like

627
00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:13.519
to come up and then and finish
the show. I think you know that's

628
00:49:13.599 --> 00:49:19.840
exactly what is sentience means because you
have to be able to not sure other

629
00:49:19.960 --> 00:49:24.920
people's potential. It's not about telling
them what to do. It's getting the

630
00:49:25.039 --> 00:49:29.639
best out of them so they can
lead what they want to lead, right.

631
00:49:29.679 --> 00:49:35.199
So that's the highest potential of a
leader and a teacher. Faisil.

632
00:49:35.320 --> 00:49:37.559
I really enjoy having you in my
life, learning from you, sharing with

633
00:49:37.639 --> 00:49:42.119
my listeners and viewers around the world. Thank you for coming back to working

634
00:49:42.199 --> 00:49:45.360
on purpose. Thank you for having
me absolutely honored. Listeners and viewers,

635
00:49:45.400 --> 00:49:47.719
you are going to want to find
more out about this man and the work

636
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:51.320
that he does, the work and
the books that he produces, and his

637
00:49:52.039 --> 00:49:54.719
various company Shadoka, next chapter,
et cetera. So just start by going

638
00:49:54.800 --> 00:49:59.119
to his personal website. It's Feisal
Hope. Let me spell that for you.

639
00:50:00.639 --> 00:50:06.559
F A I s A L hoke
h o q u E fislhok dot

640
00:50:06.679 --> 00:50:08.880
com. Start there. If you
missed the show last week, you can

641
00:50:08.880 --> 00:50:13.679
always catch it via recorded podcast.
We were on the air with Darren Tully

642
00:50:13.800 --> 00:50:17.280
talking about his book Live Your Possible, Ignite your Happy, Authentic Self and

643
00:50:17.360 --> 00:50:22.840
Love a fulfilling life where to enjoy
inclusion, love and possibilities. Sounds pretty

644
00:50:22.840 --> 00:50:24.760
good, doesn't it. Next week, we'll be on the air with Tim

645
00:50:24.920 --> 00:50:30.519
Vanda Hay talking about his book that
he co authored called Swipe, The Science

646
00:50:30.559 --> 00:50:32.880
Behind Why we Don't Finish what we
start. See you there, and remember

647
00:50:32.920 --> 00:50:37.159
that work is one of the best
means and adventures of realizing our potential and

648
00:50:37.239 --> 00:50:40.119
making the impact we crave. So
let's continue to find a way to work

649
00:50:40.159 --> 00:50:46.840
on purpose. We hope you've enjoyed
this week's program. Be sure to tune

650
00:50:46.880 --> 00:50:51.960
into Working on Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes, each week on

651
00:50:52.199 --> 00:50:57.719
W four CY. Together we'll create
a world where business operates conscientiously, leadership

652
00:50:57.800 --> 00:51:01.199
inspires and passion performance, and employers
are fulfilled in work that provides the meaning

653
00:51:01.280 --> 00:51:06.039
and purpose they crave. See you
there, Let's work on purpose.